What am I missing?.........warning 110 mig post

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So I was reading through another post they where debating what a 110 can and can't do.So i thought I would do some research and consult the manufacturer.So Millers says there MM140 will weld 3/16" max, it states there amperage range is 30-140 amps.Now if you look at Millers welding calculator on there site for 3/16" it say running .035 flux cored your amperage range is 190-220I always thought there thickness rating was a single pass so are they overrating these machines or is the calculator incorrect.Just checked this also applies to there 220 machines.MM252 1/2" max, amperage 30-300 ampsMiller weld calculator 3/8"  with flux core 330-375 amps.
Reply:A bit of both.If you read the fine print in the manual, most of these small machines will draw more than a standard 20 amp 115v circuit will supply. By giving the machine say 30 amps they allow the machine to achieve maximum potential and thus max thickness, but that doesn't equate to real world conditions for the average person. So in that way, they over rate the machines. Pretty much everyone does it.Now as far as the calculator is concerned, it's based on optimal conditions for production. That would be for someone who needs to lay down the most bead in the least amount of time in a production setting. Higher output settings allow for higher travel speeds, and thus more weld per hour. You'd loose your shirt in a per piece shop using the door settings on some machines and dealing with things like duty cycle. While you could do the welds, you simply would take forever doing so. On the other hand, someone who has a big industrial mig power source like an XMT or Deltaweld will run rings around you with the kind of output those machines can do at 100% duty cycle.In short you are comparing small home owner units to large factory machine based settings. Thus the numbers don't add up..No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:So the weld calculator is basically useless for the homeowner hobbyist.On to my next question I ready to upgrade from my Lincoln 90 amp and am thinking real hard about the MM211 as I like the option of 110 or 220 plus the size as I will be having to carry in and out of the house.I would like to be able to run dual shield on the 220 side.I think if I am reading the specs correct I could run Lincoln Outershield 71M in .035 on the 220v with about 30-40% duty cycle.Does this seem right or am I interrupting these specs wrong?Also a 10 lbs. spool and a 8" spool are the same aren't they?These are my spec references. http://www.millerwelds.com/pdf/spec_sheets/DC12-54.pdfhttp://www.lincolnelectric.com/en-us...olnElectric%29Thanks for your helpSammy
Reply:yeah the calculator doesn't always make sense when you look at it from a home owners standpoint. In some cases it does, in others it doesn't.Someone here in the past did some welding with dualshield thru  a MM211. However the voltage of that machine is on the very bottom of the suggested setting scale from Lincoln.Lincoln lists 20-23 volts as the lower limits of that wire. Max settings go all the way up to 30-33V for that size wire. However the MM211 maxes out at 30 v according to the amp volt chart, and that is at almost 10 amps on the curve. once you get up into the 140+ amp range, your voltage is down below like 24v. at max power you are just barely over 20v on the chart. ( oh and this is assuming the MM211 is run on 230v power, not 110 where the voltage won't even make the chart.)http://www.lincolnelectric.com/asset...d71M/c3101.pdfThat's really not the machine to make use of that wire. You really need an machine capable of higher voltages. Out of curiosity, why choose dualshield for such a small machine?.No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:Dualshield is what I have the most experience running. I am a Carman for the RR and I worked in a backshop for 7 years doing major rebuilds and wrecked train cars this is where I learned to weld and all we ran was .045 dualshield wire granted we had 440 linde power supplies with essab feeders. I was thinking of trying the dualshield  in .035 if I could run it on a homeowner sized machine. I know it would be on the upper end of MM211 range I was thinking it would work for 3/16-1/4
Reply:Here's the link to the thread I remember.http://weldingweb.com/vbb/showthread.php...ual-shield-fun!"Homeowner" grade machines could also include the MM212 or MM252 and probably both would be better suited for dual shield. Granted that they are a lot more money and way more machine than the guy who wants to do yard art needs on average. But hey when are most of us "average"?If I upgrade my "home owner" unit will be a nice used XMT with feeder. I can get the power source for just a bit more than say a MM211 would run me. I already have the feeder. If I opted for a 110v/220v smaller machine, it would be a used Passport plus..No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:If I didn't have to haul it in and out of the basement I would have me a MM252 for sure. Looking at that link it could be doable, I should have enough coin saved up in about 6 weeks and will be ordering me a MM211. Will try some dualshield in .035 and report back.Thanks for your help and have a good morning.Sammy
Reply:Originally Posted by celticrootsI was thinking of trying the dualshield  in .035 if I could run it on a homeowner sized machine. I know it would be on the upper end of MM211 range I was thinking it would work for 3/16-1/4
Reply:Anvil. It's a railroad thang. I use to put down my nursery cloth in Floridastan with 40's and a spike mail You get over it after a few decades although this topic has me wanting another maul Bubble gumTooth pixDuct tapeBlack glueGBMF hammerScrew gun --bad battery (see above)
Reply:Originally Posted by celticrootsIf I didn't have to haul it in and out of the basement I would have me a MM252 for sure. Looking at that link it could be doable, I should have enough coin saved up in about 6 weeks and will be ordering me a MM211. Will try some dualshield in .035 and report back.Thanks for your help and have a good morning.Sammy
Reply:When on the edge of these smaller machines, you will see that Miller tweaks the voltage settings.For the thicker wires the voltage may actually go down vs. the thinner stuff.Bottom line, 200 amps at 20V == 4000W.   Off a 110V line, that would be over 30 Amps!  That's assuming 100% efficiency.Real life, you dial in 18V, you get 15-16V and with a wire speed in the 250ish range your at 125ish amps.  (.030 wire I think).  That's more like 2000Watts.  Well within range of a 20 Amp plug (hairy edge of a 15 Amp one).Stick with .030 wire max on that machine.  Your biggest issue will be duty cycle if you are welding 3/16 all day.   If this becomes an issue, upgrade your power and get a bigger machine.   You'd be surprised how much a home owner can do with just a 110V welder.  Just fear working on road going trailers.Con Fuse!Miller Dynasty 350Millermatic 350P-Spoolmatic 30AMiller Multimatic 200Hypertherm PowerMax 1000G3Miller Maxstar 200DX
Reply:Originally Posted by BurpeeAnvil. It's a railroad thang. I use to put down my nursery cloth in Floridastan with 40's and a spike mail You get over it after a few decades although this topic has me wanting another maul
Reply:Originally Posted by ANVILcelti, since your welder is for "homeowner" projects and for that thickness of work material (3/16-1/4"), you're wasting money spending it on  dualshield wire plus the gas.  IMO, your MM211 is perfectly capable of tackling the thicknesses you mentioned with basic ER70s-3 (or s-6) wire and 75/25 shielding gas.