Can this be done?

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Hi all, I'm brand new here and this is my first post!  I am basically a rookie to welding and I have no formal education.  While I was deployed overseas with the Army I would hang out with the mechanics on my FOB during down time, and there were a couple of really cool guys that showed me the basics of wire-fed MIG welding.  I practiced quite a bit on various scraps, and by the time I left I was able to lay down some pretty good welds.  I'm about to purchase my first welder, and I think I'm going to go with the Millermatic 211.  I'm mostly using it for garage projects like roll cages, engine mounts, body work, etc., but I have a few "art" type projects that I'd like to try and I'm not sure if this welder can do it.  I want to take some of my old pistons and cranks and weld them together in various ways, weld various pieces of steel to the block, etc., but they are much thicker than the max size of 3/8 that Miller says this machine is capable of.  Is there any way to weld these thick pieces together using this machine?Thanks for all replies!
Reply:You can "glue" together thicker stuff as long as it's not load-bearing (structural)."USMCPOP" First-born son: KIA  Iraq 1/26/05Syncrowave 250 w/ Coolmate 3Dialarc 250, Idealarc 250SP-175 +Firepower TIG 160S (gave the TA 161 STL to the son)Lincwelder AC180C (1952)Victor & Smith O/A torchesMiller spot welder
Reply:Get the MM211 and keep an eye out for a used Stick machine- this will cover most of  your projects until you decide you want to try Tig welding.Last edited by Broccoli1; 08-07-2012 at 06:44 PM.Ed Conleyhttp://www.screamingbroccoli.com/MM252MM211 (Sold)Passport Plus & Spool gunLincoln SP135 Plus- (Gone to a good home)Klutch 120v Plasma cutterSO 2020 benderBeer in the fridge
Reply:Wow, quick responses. Thanks!  I would like to try TIG as soon as possible, but I don't have any friends that TIG weld, so who knows when that could be.  Is stick welding much harder than MIG, and do you think it would be more beneficial to just skip stick and maybe take a class at a local tech school and save up for a TIG welder?  I'd like to get into aluminum and stainless one day, so I've given TIG some thought in the past...just didn't want to get in over my head!
Reply:Well I would buy the MM211- work horse for a geerage hobby dude.You can also look for a used Miller Synchrowave or Lincoln- those will do Stick and TigHow much of your money you want us to spend ? Classes are always good.Ed Conleyhttp://www.screamingbroccoli.com/MM252MM211 (Sold)Passport Plus & Spool gunLincoln SP135 Plus- (Gone to a good home)Klutch 120v Plasma cutterSO 2020 benderBeer in the fridge
Reply:Originally Posted by Broccoli1How much of your money you want us to spend ?
Reply:Take a moment and add your location to your User CP at the top left so we know where you are.Tig and stick aren't that hard top learn, but it does help to have someone work with you to get the basics down.If you are discharged, you might look into what the VA can do to help. We often get a lot of vets at the tech school night program that are getting all or part of the class paid for by the VA. Honestly don't know all the details, but it's worth asking some questions.Around me classes are usually stupid cheap when you sit down and start adding things up. By the time you bought the material, rod, gas, electric and so on, not to mention the equipment and instruction. It's hard to see how they don't loose money. Depending on the class and how long the class runs, most night classes around here average about $10-15 / hour when you break down the total..No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:A stick/arc/SMAW welder option can also be an older stand-alone "buzz box" variety. Versatile enough given the general run in price...depending on your location, $75-$150 for an AC model and toss another $100-$150 at it for an AC/DC model. This type will generally allow you to weld much thicker sections of metal. Generally of the transformer variety, they will demand more out of your electrical service...there are always trade-offs.As far as the spool gun with a MIG, you will be limited on the thickness of the aluminum you are able to join, just as you would be by the limits of the welder itself that powers the spool gun. Aluminum demands a much higher amp "flow" to weld than steel and other metals. You'll still be able to do the non-structural "sticking" processWaiting for a TIG welder that can handle both the TIG as well as the arc process makes sense, if you are definately wanting to accomplish both eventually. It begins to make less sense (monetarily) when you factor in wife, kids, mortgage payments, transportation, etc. into the mix. When that happens you have to start looking at the trade-offs again. Also, some of the lower end TIG machines are not able to handle the two processes and only offer the TIG feature.Lincoln PrecisionTig 275Miller 251Miller DialArc 250Bridgeport millHossfeld bender & diesLogan shaperJet 14 X 40 latheSouth Bend 9" 'C'Hypertherm 900Ellis 3000 band saw21"Royersford ExcelsiorTwo shops, still too many tools.
Reply:Thanks for all of the great info everyone.DSW, unfortunately (or fortunately, depending on how you look at it) I've already used my VA educational benefits for my college degrees.  I did take a peek at an applied technology college that isn't too far from my house and their rates surprised the hell out of me...very affordable as you demonsrated!  I thought it would cost a lot more.  I took 2 years of metal shop in high school and looking back on it now I must have used thousands of dollars worth of metal....what a deal!WyoRoy, I definitely want to wait to get a good TIG mostly because I'm a big fan of buying things once. I learned at a young age that it's better to buy the right thing, and a quality thing, one time instead of the wrong thing, or cheap things, a whole bunch of times.  You end up being disappointed and usually end up spending more money in the long run.  I've always been really hands-on and I don't like taking my projects to other people to have them do it for me.....even if that makes the most financial sense.  That being the case, I will see what kind of "buzz box" I can round up if they really are that inexpensive.  I have a 220V outlet in my garage...do I need any other special electrical work done to run one?
Reply:Depends on how big a circuit the 220v line in your garage is. If it's a small 20 amp line for an AC unit or compressor, chances are it's not big enough. You can run a small transformer stick machine on a 220v 30 amp dryer line, but usually you will be limited to 3/32" rods or you will trip the breaker. Not the end of the world, and lots of guys start out this way. You just have to limit yourself and remember how high you can set the machine. 50 amps 220v is typical for most home size stick machines. This will allow you to run full power with most units and not trip the breaker. Larger, industrial sized machines need more juice. It's not uncommon to find machines that want 100-125 amps 220v power to run at rated output. However many of these will still function in the lower range of their output if run on a 50-60 amp breaker. Most seldom need the 300+ amps some of these machines can crank out and limiting yourself to 150-170 amps usually will stay under the tripping point for 50 amp breakers.Colleges aren't the only places that offer classes. Don't forget votech high schools as well. That's predominantly what's local to me. In general the classes are a bit less expensive, since they usually run shorter class sessions.A quick CL search pulled up an older listing from the end of last month. I think it's an AC only Thunderbolt. For $50 you can't really go wrong. Most of those machines have very little to break and will run even after tons of abuse. Chances are you'll still be able to sell it years later for the same money you paid for it. Being an older ad, if he's still got it, and because he's not sure it "works", you can probably get him down to $35 or maybe even less... Tons of stuff has been made with AC only stick machines. http://provo.craigslist.org/tls/3175667549.htmlOther than that I don't see much listed right now that jumps out at me. I like to use a CL aggregator like Searchtempest to search a bunch of CL at the same time. I usually use "welder" and sort manually to see if I find any hidden deals. If you can locate an AC/DC stick machine it will give you more options, like the ability to do very basic scratch start DC tig on steel and stainless. The down side is most used AC/DC stick machines will start at $300-600 used, though occasionally you get lucky and someone sells one for less..No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:Hey Torched!Thank you for your service! Welcome to welding. You will enjoy it. Lots of great guys on here so ask a lot of questions and post pictures of your progress.Another old soldier.Burt _____________________Miller Syncrowave 250Millermatic 211Miller 375 Plasma Cutter Hobart Handler 12010FtDrillBit.com
Reply:DSW, thanks for the info.  I checked my circuit breaker box and the circuit that runs to the garage has two circuits linked together with a handle that has a 20 on each individual one.  I'm not an electrician, so I don't know the technical terms here, but there are definitely two separate circuits that are each labeled "20" and they are connected together with a piece of plastic so they flip together.  I would guess both of them together would be 20 amps, but I suppose it could mean 40?  Again, I'm not an electrician, but would I be able to just change the circuit and possibly wiring to be able to handle the amperage?  We also have a news website here that has a very good classified section with thousands of ads (www.ksl.com).  I'll take a look there as well to see what I can find used.  A few hundred bucks isn't too bad, so I'll probably spring for the AC/DC if I can find a good used one.... I'm kindof liking the idea of trying my hand at stick welding!Burt, thanks!  It seems that thanks for your service are in order as well   I'm really looking forward to getting my tools and taking it to the metal!!Last edited by Torched; 08-08-2012 at 11:19 PM.Structural Engineer...Happy to answer any engineering questions since I can't contribute anything to welding questions!