How to bend turbo systems

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I just though I would ask on hear to see if someone might have an answer. I wanted to see if anyone can tell me the best way to make bends in Alum, tubing? I know it will depend on wall thickness so hear is what I would like to do. I have a one shot pro bender that needs the hydraulic power unit, I plan on using it to bend tubing to make custom bumpers for golf carts. I think it will work for that and be the best tool for that job. The thing is I would like to do bends on SS and alum tubing or piping to make turbo systems. I also have an exhaust bender ( big unit) use to used to mace custom exhausts. I was told a guy would make custom headers using sand to fill the piping before bending( it is not a mandrel). I guess the question is am I better using the exhaust bender for the turbo systems or will the pro bender work? A friend wants the exhaust bender and was thinking of trading him, But if I can use it I would keep it.P.S sorry if the post is long winded.
Reply:Turbo headers & exhaust will have to manage a lot of heat.  Most turbo headers are built from welding together lots of bends & such.  An exhaust bender would crimp the pipe too much unless there is a way to get your hands on a mandrel bender.  Filling the tube with sand might work, you just have to experiment with it to see if it works.Let us know if the sand in the tube works with the exhaust bender.MarkI haven't always been a nurse........Craftsman 12"x36" LatheEnco G-30B MillHobart Handler 175Lincoln WeldandPower 225 AC/DC G-7 CV/CCAdd a Foot Pedal to a Harbor Freight Chicago Electric 165A DC TIG PapaLion's Gate Build
Reply:from my days as a race car mechanic and shop owner (import car builder and tuner) i've found that about 95% of turbo systems ARE mandrel bent due to what Mark said-heat. less stresses on t6he pipe and most importantly, the flowrate isn't diminished with a decreasing cross sectional area in mid apex.the other 5% are "aramdillo'd" with mulitple angles cut and welded.. which is scary since thats more points to fracture at. the only problem i see with your one shot is the shoes probably won't be able to bend a tight enough radius should your customer or application want an equal-length header. i've heat ofd the sand trick and heard it works well, and annealing the aluminum is always a win-win, but still.. most people may not mind the slight shrink in the pipe at the bends, but it's iffy.. you almsot can't oversize to compensate that due to pressure drops and ensuing lag.. hmm..http://kawispeed.com/ -moderator and tech deluxewww.myspace.com/trickortrack -cuz i have no life
Reply:That is what I was thinking guys. I was not going to use the one shoot for any turbo or exhaust systems just bumpers and roll-cages. Not to sure if I will keep the big bender since it will cause the pipe to wrinkle.
Reply:should be beautiful for bumpers and such!at my old bike shop i built a few stuntbike, and if you've ever seen a purpose-built stunt bike ( for wheelies and whatnot) thet're usually "caged".. they'll have a steel cage around the engine. i used a 16 ton hydraulic bender for those and my customers ate them up. LOVED em. that one shot otta be perfect for full-sized cages for cars or whatever..http://kawispeed.com/ -moderator and tech deluxewww.myspace.com/trickortrack -cuz i have no life
Reply:I was going to try and use the hydro system off the exhaust bender to power the one shot when needed and use it (big bender) to do exhaust. I do not think the exhaust bender will do alum. tubing for bumpers and molly for roll-cages. I think it will crinkle the tubing like the exhaust pipe ( not sure) I might just get rid of the big one and buy pre-bent piping if I need to for turbo systems. More than likely the one shot is best to use for the bumpers and cages rather than the big one.
Reply:If you are going to bend aluminum it should be annealed first..Otherwise it will just crack at the bend point.....zap!I am not completely insane..Some parts are missing Professional Driver on a closed course....Do not attempt.Just because I'm a  dumbass don't mean that you can be too.So DON'T try any of this **** l do at home.
Reply:Thanks Zap I just talked with a place that makes benders and they said the same thing if I use T-5 I believe. He also said they had good results with bending T3 or T2 without it cracking and no heat. Also to try and get newer alum. older stock was more prone to cracking. I need to talk to a guy down at the coast who builds leaning posts and K tops using Alum. I don't think he annealed it before he bent it. I could be wrong. I think I will keep the big bender. It will do a lot more than I thought. If I want to bend SS It will be on the thick wall side like 2" 304 SS would need to be 070 to work with no crinkles, but would have about 20% shrinkage. They did say if I fill with sand and then bend could do thinner with only around 5% shrinkage. Can also do schedule 40 Alum pipe with good results. not to mention square tubing. The guy said he lived up north and they would fill the ss pipe with water and put outside during winter which would freeze into ice then bend it. They would just bring into heat and let it melt. After thinking about it my Buddy wanted to trade me a 2000 Suzuki Ventara soft top two door, That needed the timing chain top end of motor put back together and new top. I don't think it would be a good trade. If I buy a pump ($300) and put it on the bender it will be up and running and has a lot of dies with it. I could probably get $2,500 or so for the bender.
Reply:This guy bends with sand in the tube:
Reply:thats interesting...
Reply:That was cool. Do remember if you going to do something that needs to be heated first and you weld the ends closed and not tape do not use water or wet sand. Here is a way a guy does it with only a vise and cheater.http://www.rorty-design.com/content/sand_bending.htm
Reply:You may want to investigate the REMS Curvos and Curvo 50. They are German made powered units and are portable. Standard Curvo does a 90 degree bend in about 5 seconds and a 180 in 10. Curvo 50 is bigger and slower but has larger capacity.There is a video on the REMS website at www.rems.de. Go to the downloads tab and look for product videos. They have a variety of formers available and I know some people have made their own. Don't know if it suits your needs but may be worth looking into. Teal Corporation is the U.S. importer and can advise further. 952 432-8325
Reply:Originally Posted by speedyshark1I just though I would ask on hear to see if someone might have an answer. I wanted to see if anyone can tell me the best way to make bends in Alum, tubing? I know it will depend on wall thickness so hear is what I would like to do. I have a one shot pro bender that needs the hydraulic power unit, I plan on using it to bend tubing to make custom bumpers for golf carts. I think it will work for that and be the best tool for that job. The thing is I would like to do bends on SS and alum tubing or piping to make turbo systems. I also have an exhaust bender ( big unit) use to used to mace custom exhausts. I was told a guy would make custom headers using sand to fill the piping before bending( it is not a mandrel). I guess the question is am I better using the exhaust bender for the turbo systems or will the pro bender work? A friend wants the exhaust bender and was thinking of trading him, But if I can use it I would keep it.P.S sorry if the post is long winded.
Reply:That looks like one bad a$$ Alfa Romeo motor. How much HP are you pushing out of it with the Turbo? Also what year is the motor?
Reply:Originally Posted by speedyshark1That looks like one bad a$$ Alfa Romeo motor. How much HP are you pushing out of it with the Turbo? Also what year is the motor?
Reply:That is an engine. Love the coil on plug, gets rid of the short wire lie the Gm cars. Me and a buddy were looking at a NA VG30 (Nissan) that is going into my 87 300zx  and I noticed the huge girdle on the main caps. Now I now why they say this v6 will hold 450hp. The heads also look like a semi-Hemi ( angle valves and dome chambers with small area not machined out( hard to explain) I thinking of trying to get as much out of it before a turbo with machine work and all. Run it with that motor for a while then import a twin turbo 240sx motor from Japan to put into it. By the way do you know any shops who do extrude hone on heads? Here in San Antonio Tx no one does it. Just thought I would ask.
Reply:great info in this thread
Reply:Originally Posted by speedyshark1 By the way do you know any shops who do extrude hone on heads? Here in San Antonio Tx no one does it. Just thought I would ask.
Reply:I guess I will go with the old port and polish I know it does help with opening and flow, but takes long and is hard to get all the way through. I will try to find someone who does the extrude hone I feel it gives better flow through out. At least what I think which is not much.
Reply:Back in the mid 90's I was doing some custom turbo fab work.  We always used mandrel bends of various radius.  Performance gains from doing away with crush bent stuff are surprising.  Stay away from those deltagate wastegates.  Also, contrary to popular belief, blow off valves that "make that cool sound" are not efficient.  You should either hear nothing or a rush of air, instead of that farting sound.  If you think about what it is, a vacuum operated valve used to relieve excess boost pressure.  That farting sound is air SLOWLY forcing itself past the valve seat opening and closing quickly, just like a human fart.  The Bosch unit off a 944 turbo works great for hosed applications.  Vortex makes a very good high flow for weld flanged.  The crappy ones we used for paperweights, doorstops...Knuckle busting wrencher.Millermatic 185Miller econo tigLincoln dc600 (shoulda kept the bullet)87 Buick Grand National, built and mega fast95 Honda Accord, better on gas than the Buick84 Honda Nighthawk, sitting...