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seems easy enough to install.seems like the sensitive electronics in an inverter welder should be protected, heck even a lot of transformer tigs have expensive circuit boards now a days.Yet I see no one ever mentioning them?am I missing something?
Reply:i dunno how important it is really.. . .most inverters will automatically adjust to different voltage supplies, and have a broad spectrum of voltage that they can run on.i know on jobsites, power is always an issue and is prone to shutting off, or being low, but i dont think we ever have a problem with spiking.good question, wish i knew the answer!!bosses stuff:trailblazer 325maxstar 200my stuff:sa 200fronius transpocket 180100 amp Lincoln w/f97 f350 DITKevin
Reply:My inverter based welder has a multi pole switch. When the power is off, all the circuitry is protected from a spike because there is no connection to the power. That leaves your welder vulnerable only when you are using it.Power spikes are relatively rare. Usually caused by lightning strikes, transformer failures and automobiles hitting power poles (IIRC).----------------------------Measure twice. Weld once. Grind to size.MIG: Lincoln SP100 TIG/STICK: AHP Alphatig 200X
Reply:Not sure if this is the same as Arc Fault Circuit Breakers. Has to install a few of those on my basement finish. New code standard I guess. Damn things are $40/eachTiger Sales: AHP Distributor www.tigersalesco.comAHP200x; AHP 160ST; MM350P, Spoolmatic 30A; Everlast PowerTig 185; Thermal Dynamics 60i plasma. For Sale: Cobra Mig 250 w/ Push-pull gun. Lincoln Wirematic 250
Reply:If you have a chassis ground and the power disconnected, you can still get a spike into electronics.Even a normally grounded piece of equipment can pick up a voltage spike through an average ground.Just depends on the amplitude of the event and the potential voltage gradient.
Reply:"My inverter based welder has a multi pole switch." just curious which inverter is that? is that common feature on most inverter welders?
Reply:Make sure you install that after you dip your hands and torch in a tub of water.....Get off the internet already..Torchmate 2x2 CNC with Flashcut CNC controlsHypertherm Powermax45 Esab ET220i Razorweld 195 MigRazorweld 200ac/dc TigTormach 770, Tormach xstechRazorweld, Vipercut/Vipermig, SSC Foot Pedal Dealer
Reply:I am fortunate enough to be home most of the time. If there is a threat of lightning such as a storm warning, etc. I simply unplug my inverter welder until the threat is past.
Reply:The one Chinese inverter that I looked at had a precharge resistor bypassing the power switch.It kept its low voltage power supply on line and had the main caps charged up,as long as it was plugged in.
Reply:Selling adjunct "surge" protection has always been sort of a market plagued by rogues. 1st thing you do is scare folks into believing they need it then fill that need with a little black box filled with magic components. Yes, much of the surge protection out there does perform a valuable service, and much of it doesn't. Any reputable manufacturer will readily tell you what events and ranges their surge protection is designed to cover, the components they use and how it all works together. A predatory rogue outfit will sell you 3 ninety cent MOVs in a lil black box for the low low price of $60.00, tell you to wire it in yourself and it will cover everything from brown outs to direct lightening hits to the temple. Real surge protection is a huge topic. As a side note -- that panel the guy is wiring that magic box into has more bigger issues that should be addressed before worrying about a surge. "The things that will destroy America are prosperity at any price, peace at any price, safety first instead of duty first, the love of soft living and the get rich quick theory of life." -Theodore Roosevelt
Reply:Just before I retired, we installed a 3.5 million chiller and all the fancy associted switchgear. Part of that install was three Square D SurgeLogic digital surge protectors attached to our spanky new Square D 2K amp digital chiller breakers..The SurgeLogics failed almost every week and were replaced under warranty, but the new Carrier EverGreen chiller kept running just fine and it's digital drives never blinked...After warranty ran out on the install, we ignored the SurgeLogic junk and simply let the digital switchgear protect the chiller.Anytime the maker sez he backs his product up with an insurance policy, he is simply selling insurance-term insurance with impossible to meet clauses in the fine print.....Yawn
Reply:Originally Posted by SandySelling adjunct "surge" protection has always been sort of a market plagued by rogues. 1st thing you do is scare folks into believing they need it then fill that need with a little black box filled with magic components. Yes, much of the surge protection out there does perform a valuable service, and much of it doesn't. Any reputable manufacturer will readily tell you what events and ranges their surge protection is designed to cover, the components they use and how it all works together. A predatory rogue outfit will sell you 3 ninety cent MOVs in a lil black box for the low low price of $60.00, tell you to wire it in yourself and it will cover everything from brown outs to direct lightening hits to the temple. Real surge protection is a huge topic. As a side note -- that panel the guy is wiring that magic box into has more bigger issues that should be addressed before worrying about a surge.
Reply:Originally Posted by soutthpawNot sure if this is the same as Arc Fault Circuit Breakers. Has to install a few of those on my basement finish. New code standard I guess. Damn things are $40/each
Reply:Originally Posted by BlueweldersGoing to be interesting to see how much it takes to trigger one of those.The breaker are supposed to trigger when they detect an arc,but how much and how far away ?
Reply:So if a light switch gets old,it will kill the power ?
Reply:Originally Posted by AluminumWelder"My inverter based welder has a multi pole switch." just curious which inverter is that? is that common feature on most inverter welders?
Reply:Originally Posted by BlueweldersIf you have a chassis ground and the power disconnected, you can still get a spike into electronics.Even a normally grounded piece of equipment can pick up a voltage spike through an average ground.Just depends on the amplitude of the event and the potential voltage gradient.
Reply:Eh. Just unplug your machine anytime you aren't using it. If it really worries you, get a surge protector, but with the draw you have on the higher machines, you have to ask yourself if it's worth it. Why not figure out what the killing surge would be for your machine, then ask the power company how many times they've had such a surge in the past 20 years? Then your decision can be based on real data, and not scare tactics.MillerMatic 252Miller Xtreme 625Miller Digital Elite
Reply:Originally Posted by DaeyelEh. Just unplug your machine anytime you aren't using it. If it really worries you, get a surge protector, but with the draw you have on the higher machines, you have to ask yourself if it's worth it. Why not figure out what the killing surge would be for your machine, then ask the power company how many times they've had such a surge in the past 20 years? Then your decision can be based on real data, and not scare tactics.
Reply:Originally Posted by dbstooI'm not sure that's valid, unless you have multiple failures throughout your wiring. I'm excluding massive magnetic pulses, since those are independent of the power wiring.If the power is disconnected, but the ground is intact, what is the electrical path for any spike? I can see voltage present at the ground connection if the ground was open at the panel and shorted to the hot leg of a live circuit somewhere, but where would it travel to once it reached the disconnected welder? Dan
Reply:Originally Posted by 7A749X 2^^I always unplug mine and disconnect the leads from any work I'm doing. A lightning strike to your building can fry anything connected to an outlet. On a breaker or not.I have a smoked XMT sitting here in my carport from exactly that. Pretty well not worth repairing. Inverter power sources will be far more susceptible to a situation like this than analog machines.Unplugging is the best way to go. It's easy and pretty foolproof.IMHO of course
Reply:Originally Posted by 7A749X 2^^I always unplug mine and disconnect the leads from any work I'm doing. A lightning strike to your building can fry anything connected to an outlet. On a breaker or not.I have a smoked XMT sitting here in my carport from exactly that. Pretty well not worth repairing. Inverter power sources will be far more susceptible to a situation like this than analog machines.Unplugging is the best way to go. It's easy and pretty foolproof.IMHO of course
Reply:Originally Posted by PB17654People actually leave their machines plugged in when not in use? Sorry if this is a dumb question, but why?
Reply:Originally Posted by MinnesotaDaveYep - all of mine get unplugged - the compressor and big Airco are hard wired and the breakers get shut off every night when finished.
Reply:Originally Posted by 7A749After I got that XMT with damage from a lightning strike, I became very cognizant about always unplugging my two inverters. I spent a lot of money on one of them, not even taking a chance. If anybody wants to call it paranoia, I'm ok with that.They didn't pay six grand for my Dynasty 350 either. I did. My air compressor and machine tools are also hard wired. Not too worried about them tho. It would probably smoke the phase converters, but those are replaceable without a lot of dough spent on them.IMHO of courseIf you look at a simple $100 Lambda power supply, they have varistors, T filters, PI filters,spark gaps and RC snubbers.Yet a $1500 welder will have essentially nothing substantial to save it.
Reply:Inverters will NOT adjust to lightning strikes on the power lines.Leaving tools plugged in will be cost you money.Welders with diodes,battery chargers,and electric motors will be damaged.Turning a switch off wont work because lightning jumps the open switch.A solid strike on inverters will reduce them to scrap.Ive spent 65 years repairing items struck by lightning.Many items are just junk after a solid strike.
Reply:Originally Posted by farmer37Inverters will NOT adjust to lightning strikes on the power lines.Leaving tools plugged in will be cost you money.Welders with diodes,battery chargers,and electric motors will be damaged.Turning a switch off wont work because lightning jumps the open switch.A solid strike on inverters will reduce them to scrap.Ive spent 65 years repairing items struck by lightning.Many items are just junk after a solid strike.
Reply:If you leave your inverter plugged in during lightning storms, you might want to install one of these:http://www.smarthome.com/leviton-511...supressor.html$200.00 may sound expensive, but it might save the cost of a much more expensive electronics board/device.
Reply:...reading the info on that whole home surge protection, they claim max surge of 50 000 amps, yet if you look, lightning storms can range from 10 000 amps to 200 000 amps, does this mean said protection only works for the bottom 1/4 of possible amperage in lighting? Or am I reading some of the specs incorrectly?
Reply:Originally Posted by RussZHC...reading the info on that whole home surge protection, they claim max surge of 50 000 amps, yet if you look, lightning storms can range from 10 000 amps to 200 000 amps, does this mean said protection only works for the bottom 1/4 of possible amperage in lighting? Or am I reading some of the specs incorrectly?
Reply:As a side note, marketing vs engineering coupled with typos maybe makes you wonder about a lot of products. Engineering turns over a bunch of specs to the advertising folks and globs of gobble de gook comes out so ya hate to always knock the product based on what you see in the advertising alone. But when you see something like 50,0000 AMPS you have to ask, what size of wire is this thing coupled in with? Clamping times are "instantaneous". Lightning is roughly at the speed of light so I guess "instantaneous" should do it. Just being sarcastic here. "The things that will destroy America are prosperity at any price, peace at any price, safety first instead of duty first, the love of soft living and the get rich quick theory of life." -Theodore Roosevelt
Reply:Originally Posted by davido30093If you leave your inverter plugged in during lightning storms, you might want to install one of these:http://www.smarthome.com/leviton-511...supressor.html$200.00 may sound expensive, but it might save the cost of a much more expensive electronics board/device.
Reply:Originally Posted by AluminumWelderWHAT MAkes this $200 surge protector any better than the $60 one I originally posted about?
Reply:specs look the same to me, both 50kva, waht else should I look for?
Reply:Also, check your homeowners policy. Often they will cover your electronics based on power surge/lightning. Not sure how hard it would be to prove it. My policy covers item replacement minus a small deductible.Con Fuse!Miller Dynasty 350Millermatic 350P-Spoolmatic 30AMiller Multimatic 200Hypertherm PowerMax 1000G3Miller Maxstar 200DX
Reply:if you use the welder for business then HO insurance wont' cover it i'm pretty suyre.
Reply:$60 and you have to wire it in your self. I have seen welder adaptor and extension cords with built in surge protection.old Miller spectrum 625 Lincoln SP-135 T, CO2+0.025 wireMiller model 250 and WP-18V torchCraftsman 100amp AC/DC and WP-17V torchCentury 115-004 HF arc stabilizerHome made 4 transformer spot welderHome made alternator welder
Reply:$3.99 at the corner hardware store 1st on WeldingWeb to have a scrolling sig! HTP Invertig 400HTP Invertig 221HTP ProPulse 300HTP ProPulse 200 x2HTP ProPulse 220MTSHTP Inverarc 200TLP HTP Microcut 875SC
Reply:I have seen 220 volt surge suppression cords.old Miller spectrum 625 Lincoln SP-135 T, CO2+0.025 wireMiller model 250 and WP-18V torchCraftsman 100amp AC/DC and WP-17V torchCentury 115-004 HF arc stabilizerHome made 4 transformer spot welderHome made alternator welder
Reply:free AHP AlphaTig 200x 3rd gen.Lincoln Power Mig 210MP
Reply:Originally Posted by PB17654free |
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发表于 2021-8-31 22:40:17