|
|
Figured I would share a few of the roll cages I have built over the past year. Our shop focuses on primarily rally cars but we are getting into doing more drift cars and an occasional LeMons or road race car. All of these pictures were taken with my phone so apologies if some of them aren't that great96 Subaru Impreza LeMons/Rally cage:1991 240SX Drift Car:1992 BMW 325 Road Race/possible rally car:This owner really only wanted the back half of the cage but he wanted the option to add door bars down the road and run some stage rallies with it so we basically built a rally cage without door bars.1999 Subaru Impreza Rally car:
Reply:2006 Subaru STi Rally car (still in progress):This one I am super happy with the fitment of everything to the body, the main hoop and half laterals are welded to the roof and a-pillars on 4 spots on each side
Reply:Have also done some smaller projects like finishing the cage and tubed front end on my bosses 240sx and boxed the control arms for it Some random bumper beams:This one actually saved the front of this car from a hit at about 35-40 into a wall:After about half an hour of ratchet straps and hammers this front end was straight. I really didnt plan for it to fail right where it bolts to the stock frame rails (though I would like to think I designed it like that) but it actually saved the frame rails and did its job beautifully
Reply:Thanks for sharing. Looks safe, lots of steel.Dave ReberWadsworth Ohio
Reply:I have a question about the sheet metal gussets on the door part of the cages. I have always heard that they should not be full welded around over the radius of the tube, if there is any flexing that is the weakest part and will cause a crack there. It looks like the ones in the pictures are full welded around, is there any truth to what I have heard about full welding it?
Reply:Thanks guysI have heard something similar to that before but never about the gussets. I had a lengthy discussion about welding the footplates (the pieces of steel added to the floor where the tubes hit) all the way around. Basically I have been taught weld it all the way (and some sanctioning bodies actually require full welding of everything) and the other party had been taught not to weld all the way because it causes a weak spot and makes it easy for the cage and footplate to punch through the floor. I have never seen this happen nor have I ever heard of this happening and I for sure have never heard of cracking around the gussets.Edit: Also should add that all piping is 1.75 x .095 for the main structure (main hoop, half laterals, windshield bar and sill bars) or 1.50 x x.095 for the other supporting members.Last edited by RSTi; 12-25-2013 at 09:52 PM.
Reply:I would have to take 10 years of Yoga to be able to get in there to fit and weld all that. Kudos to you. I'm gonna plate mine in steel. Easier. Don't have to dis-articulate my spine.Arcon Workhorse 300MSPowcon 400SMTPowcon SM400 x 2Powcon SM3001968 SA200 Redface1978 SA250 DieselMiller Super 32P FeederPre 1927 American 14" High Duty LatheK&T Milwaukee 2H Horizontal MillBryan
Reply:Very cool....love the 240s.
Reply:I dont know just because the pictures are kinda unclear but I would really like to see an up close photo of the gussets welds. They appear to not be that great of welds just from appearance. As well as some the tubes look a little cold as the fillet is pretty tall.....im not an expert or judging. I have never attempted this type of weldment. But if it was my car or my life potentially on the line it needs to be of highest quality. Please dont think im saying your a bad welder or your welds arent good. Cant really see cause of the blurry pics. The other day at a friends hisbuddy was talking about getting back into tig welding for the sole purpose of redoing his roll cage in his drag car so he could legally run 200+mph rules state it has to be fully tig welded so he saysMiller Syncrowave 210 w/CK FlexLoc 150 3/6/14ESAB PCM 1125 Plasma CutterAtlas 12x36 LatheACER 9x42 3hp millHarig 612 Surface GrinderDRINK Machine welding&fabrication
Reply:In college welding classes, we watched a film about different types of welding and one was a roll cage. I saw what those guys go through in a wreck. I decided I would never build them for someone other than myself. I just don't want to be responsible for someone's death because one weld was bad. And I don't think any of us can say we have 100 percent perfect welds 100 percent of the time. But I love to see the work that other guys do. So keep posting up!Lincoln Power Mig 210MP MIGLincoln Power Mig 350MP - MIG and Push-PullLincoln TIG 300-300Lincoln Hobby-Weld 110v Thanks JLAMESCK TIG TORCH, gas diffuser, pyrex cupThermal Dynamics Cutmaster 101My brain
Reply:I have no experience with cages at all but share in the questioning of the welds. The craftsmanship/fit up/symmetry looks excellent. I thought that roll cages needed to be tig welded because of how controllable the welds are with tig. Once again, no experience here. The welds just look off and sloppy. Not trying to be insulting in any way.TA Arcmaster 300CM3XMT 304S22P12 suitcase feederX-Treme 12VSOptima pulserTA161SMaxstar 150STLHypertherm PM45OP setupStihl 020AVP, 039, 066 Magnum
Reply:I wasn't gonna say anything.......but.....I dunno about some of that stuff either....zap!I am not completely insane..Some parts are missing Professional Driver on a closed course....Do not attempt.Just because I'm a dumbass don't mean that you can be too.So DON'T try any of this **** l do at home.
Reply:Looks like a fun project and a big steel and welding work! Thanks for sharing.PlasmaCam CNC cutterLathe and Band SawClamps
Reply:I agree with the fitup comment. Looks great def not his first time I think rule books will state welding process required. I know that this guys cag3 in a drag car is mig welded but in order for him to make the car faster and break the 200mph barrier the rules state the cage has to be 100% TIGged. Thats nhra I think.i felt it necessary to speak up because he literally has someones life in his hands and its his duty to make sound welds that will NOT fail in a severe crash.idk maybe all is well before the race are the cars rigorously inspected? Maybe the welds pass a sledgehammer test but you cant duplicate the impact of an 80mph+ car smashing into a tree or rollovers......you know a driftcar smashing into a wall at what 100mph?I dont want to be a dick. This is the first time ive expressed concern about someones welds. What if a car smashes into the door of one of those cars and the tube breaks at the weld and impales the driver.....it trul6y is life or death based on the quality of the welds in a race carMiller Syncrowave 210 w/CK FlexLoc 150 3/6/14ESAB PCM 1125 Plasma CutterAtlas 12x36 LatheACER 9x42 3hp millHarig 612 Surface GrinderDRINK Machine welding&fabrication
Reply:I wasn't going to say anything either - I zoomed some pics and the work looks shoddy.Dave J.Beware of false knowledge; it is more dangerous than ignorance. ~George Bernard Shaw~ Syncro 350Invertec v250-sThermal Arc 161 and 300MM210DialarcTried being normal once, didn't take....I think it was a Tuesday.
Reply:you can never have too many pics! i like the way you fitted the tube sections to the light frame material.i.u.o.e. # 15queens, ny and sunny fla
Reply:I gotta agree with most of the replies.Last edited by RaptorDuner; 12-26-2013 at 01:53 PM.Millermatic 200Hobart Handler 120Victor O/A & Ramco BandsawLincoln 225 ACSnapOn AD HoodMiller XMT304/22AHypertherm Powermax 1650 G3Lincoln Idealarc DC600 w/Extreme 12 VSMiller Digital Elite "Joker"
Reply:Thanks for the replies guys. I gotta say alot of you have better eyesight than me (and im 23 with 20/20 lol) I tried zooming in to see what you guys might be refering to and the only ones that i can kind of make out the look of the welds on have weird shadows and such cast on them by the light. Unfortunately i never really took close up pictures of the welds and only one of those cars is still here. Ill see if i can get some decent pictures of that cage later.Every sanctioning body is different in what the require for roll cages and what process they prefer them to be welded with. NHRA and some others do require everything to be tig welded but that isnt the case with any of the sanctioning bodies we deal with. Personally though I would prefer to TIG weld these cages (my personal car, the first one I caged back when I was still in school is TIG welded) but most of our customers arent able to shell out twice the price for a TIG welded cage. Every single one of these rally cars is thoroughly inspected all around to ensure the welds are safe. The chance of dying in a rally car are probably higher than any other form of motorsport because on a track you kind of have to work hard to hit something, and even at that its usually had some sort of safety built into it. On a stage during a rally you pass thousands upon thousands of very hard obstacles (trees, rocks, houses,telephone poles etc etc) So they need to be thoroughly inspected. When it comes to drift cars on the other hand you would be surprised with some of the bird**** ive seen pass tech. It is truly appalling. Even at the top levels where yes they are doing 100mph sideways next to a wall and door to door. Some of them i think may be bubblegum with paint on it
Reply:Haha bubblegum......yeah likei was saying at first could be the picture but then again cant really tell. Cages are really nice looking though.maybe take some close up pics of some of your welds you do have in the shop and clear this up...Miller Syncrowave 210 w/CK FlexLoc 150 3/6/14ESAB PCM 1125 Plasma CutterAtlas 12x36 LatheACER 9x42 3hp millHarig 612 Surface GrinderDRINK Machine welding&fabrication
Reply:What is this circled in red, it kind of stood out to me? Many of the welds look very cold and inconsistent from the pictures. What machine are you using? I seen a Miller in one picture but couldnt tell what model it was? If the mig is a 140, spend some money and go up to at least a 180 amp machine, I would recommend a 210amp class machine, especially of your welding on other peoples cars for money..I didnt see any seams in your pictures, but I would also recommend using nothing but DOM tubing, I know its more expensive but worth it, plus it saves a little weight over the EWS tubing.Pretty sure you can mig or tig any mild steel cages, there might be a breakover point where they have to be tigged if the car goes faster, I havent looked at a rule book in 12 years though. All Chromoly cages must be tig welded..Last edited by brucer; 12-26-2013 at 04:22 PM.tackleexperts.comwww.necessityjigs.comhttps://www.facebook.com/groups/mach...dingequipment/
Reply:Thats actually a good question. The way we like to do that pillar support bar is to keep it one piece (traditionally its a two piece deal, each notched to one side of the top door bar) So to do that we notch half of the upper door bar to fit that bar in, then weld it and add gussets, which can be seen in these pictures I pulled from my Instagram.As to the welder it is a Miller 140. I have always run a little bit lower wire speed and slow hand pace to achieve the penetration. Also this tubing is all .095" thick, which this welder is quite capable of welding. I would love to run a more powerful welder but unfortunately I am in no place to be buying a welder of my own and this is what the shop I work for has. (Though I have insisted that we should get one multiple times)And all tubing is DOM. None of the sanctioning bodies we build cars for allow any seamed tubing. And actually we had to cut the cage out of the car you quoted because a previous shop had started an EWS cage
Reply:There is no replacement for displacement...........you need more cubic amps bud. And wow you really need to be welding with 220v. I have a millermatic 211 at work and run it on 115. Hate it. Even for the lighter stuff its so much better at home on 220v....me personally would laugh my way outta someones shop if they told me they were gonna weld my rallye cars roll cage with a welder powered on 115v. Sorry bud but I think more than most will agree with thatdude your skill of building has outgrown that cute little machine I see it now. Its not you its the inadequate power of your machine tell your boss he needs to get you a millermatic 252. Then you wont have to worry about power.Last edited by chevydyl; 12-26-2013 at 05:44 PM.Miller Syncrowave 210 w/CK FlexLoc 150 3/6/14ESAB PCM 1125 Plasma CutterAtlas 12x36 LatheACER 9x42 3hp millHarig 612 Surface GrinderDRINK Machine welding&fabrication
Reply:Yo bud your young and a great fabricator and fitter for your age. If this is your passion that your name goes on, save some money and buy yourself some good welding equipment that is your own. Your name and product should not suffer in appearance with poopie welds. You are well on your way man, and just bump up your welding game a few notches. For 23 you do great fab work man! Maybe i'll meet you at Englishtown NJ's spring swapmeet for a beer if your gonna be there. Keep it up! I hate being bi-polar it's awsomeMy Heroes Have Always Been Cowboys
Reply:Respectfully, I have to agree with most of the comments here regarding the quality of work. I also think that most guys here recognize good work and will comment accordingly on it. I have been doing cages for years and the work I see just doesn't look right to me. I agree the welds look a bit on the cold side. And the machine you are using isn't appropriate for the work you are doing. I also question the integrity of the pillar support after such a major cut. I have not seen any sanctioning body allow that. Although I only do NHRA and SCCA stuff. Personally, I build em like I was going to put my family in it. I think if you crank up the amps or fire up the TIG you'll be looking good. Good luck!
Reply:i think hes pretty close to having the machine maxxed out, two pieces of that tube together on a fillet weld is over 3/16. the welder is only rated to weld 3/16 in a single pass. idk i think the guy does pretty decent fitup, helluva lot better than i could do if i walked into it, but the machine is really holding you back.if it were me i wouldnt get a MM211 or a MM212, it only be the MM252, or lincolns equivalent. i dont ever wanna be pushin the machine to the max to weld up a joint, having to manipulate wire speed and movement just so i can barely melt two pieces of metal together, i want my machine to scoff at the joint. lol if you get what i mean. like i said theres no replacement for displacement...inverter welders are nice too, thats what i have. can adjust inductance. it welds pretty nice and ive never seen my power bill increase from using is everyday for hours while on my off time, mostly just practicing....gocirino.....in that picture the tube isnt cut there those are gussets welded around the door bar....i think thats what your looking at, it fooled me too but in another picture you can see it wraps the tubing. which is welded to the door bar, im not sure what that does as far as a HAZ by welding the tube and then welding all the way around pretty much again and up the sides of the other tube.....RSTi when you put two of those tubes together it effectively doubles the thickness....sorta and .095 times two is .190 and its rated to weld .1875demand that shop get you a new welder or even a used welder. lincoln or miller 252 or 251 what ever but you need it bud....the shop needs it. what do you guys charge for a cage?Right from millers weld calc app it says 160-180 amps to weld 3/16 steel just above the mm140s capabilityLast edited by chevydyl; 12-26-2013 at 08:56 PM.Miller Syncrowave 210 w/CK FlexLoc 150 3/6/14ESAB PCM 1125 Plasma CutterAtlas 12x36 LatheACER 9x42 3hp millHarig 612 Surface GrinderDRINK Machine welding&fabricationOriginally Posted by chevydyli think hes pretty close to having the machine maxxed out, two pieces of that tube together on a fillet weld is over 3/16. the welder is only rated to weld 3/16 in a single pass. idk i think the guy does pretty decent fitup, helluva lot better than i could do if i walked into it, but the machine is really holding you back.if it were me i wouldnt get a MM211 or a MM212, it only be the MM252, or lincolns equivalent. i dont ever wanna be pushin the machine to the max to weld up a joint, having to manipulate wire speed and movement just so i can barely melt two pieces of metal together, i want my machine to scoff at the joint. lol if you get what i mean. like i said theres no replacement for displacement...inverter welders are nice too, thats what i have. can adjust inductance. it welds pretty nice and ive never seen my power bill increase from using is everyday for hours while on my off time, mostly just practicing....gocirino.....in that picture the tube isnt cut there those are gussets welded around the door bar....i think thats what your looking at, it fooled me too but in another picture you can see it wraps the tubing. which is welded to the door bar, im not sure what that does as far as a HAZ by welding the tube and then welding all the way around pretty much again and up the sides of the other tube.....RSTi when you put two of those tubes together it effectively doubles the thickness....sorta and .095 times two is .190 and its rated to weld .1875demand that shop get you a new welder or even a used welder. lincoln or miller 252 or 251 what ever but you need it bud....the shop needs it. what do you guys charge for a cage?Right from millers weld calc app it says 160-180 amps to weld 3/16 steel just above the mm140s capability
Reply:yeah stay away from roll cages and trailers. best to post pics of welding tables and carts here.I totally agree that mig welding a mild steel .125 wall cage with a 140 amp welder rated for 3/16 steel isnt good either. you need atleast 250 amp machine for that.....even tho my hh140 will blow threw a competition engineering cage on it highest settings, its totally not enough welder.all of the 200 guys that had their cages, subframes, and torque boxes welded up by my brother and his lincoln 135 are dead now from cage failures at the drag strip.
Reply:Originally Posted by jamesyarbroughyeah stay away from roll cages and trailers. best to post pics of welding tables and carts here.I totally agree that mig welding a mild steel .125 wall cage with a 140 amp welder rated for 3/16 steel isnt good either. you need atleast 250 amp machine for that.....even tho my hh140 will blow threw a competition engineering cage on it highest settings, its totally not enough welder.all of the 200 guys that had their cages, subframes, and torque boxes welded up by my brother and his lincoln 135 are dead now from cage failures at the drag strip.
Reply:dude cant you read? all 200 of them died. its like once a 120 volt welder touches a car....you die.none of them were 200mph cars btw. fastest is 5s (1/8 mile)
Reply:Originally Posted by chevydylhaha smartass you can see in his pics that the bead is crowned up pretty good also in anothher post he said his bumper weld failed at a 35mph hit......wtf overWe are all entitled to our own opinions and in mine, some of the beads appear to be a little cold. Need more powa haha. And I thought a 200mph drag car cage had to be tigged not migged? I have no clue other than what was said by a racer
Reply:
Reply:Originally Posted by jamesyarbrough
Reply:You hadnt mentioned how it failed. But like I said earlier that if they pass the inspectors then kudos. I have a multiprocess welder but have found the need for ac tig so kind of shot myself in the foot on that one. Prolly perfect for you if you say you wont weld anything more than what you stated although at 200amps you gotta be careful not to blow a hole in 3/4 plate and jamesducheyarbrough I said first thing that from the pics its hard to tell cause of the blurriness but *appears* to be cold.....as did others....soo phack you read the begginningit is funny though looks like my dipsht little brotherMiller Syncrowave 210 w/CK FlexLoc 150 3/6/14ESAB PCM 1125 Plasma CutterAtlas 12x36 LatheACER 9x42 3hp millHarig 612 Surface GrinderDRINK Machine welding&fabrication
Reply:you know whats weird is I didnt quote this cat or anything and he acts like I singled him out and starts ordering me to post pics and cussing atme. guess I got his goat pretty good. the simple truth chevydl or what ever your handle is, that even though you edited your post like 5 times you have never welded a cage in and dont know **** about it. now was this work perfect nhra top fuel ****? no probably not. could some of us done it a little pretty.....maybe. im sure zap could work some magic with a tig on mild steel tubing. but the fact of the matter is that its good enough for the application. and jumping on the 120 volt migs suck band wagon is bull****. 125 wall tubing is easy for a 140 amp mig. maybe some of the welds arent flawless, but its a 25 point cage in a damn ricer for crying out load. it would be just as safe with a bolt in roll bar. nobodys "life" is depending on the massively overbuilt cage. its depending on the crash testing done by the oem. the cage is just extra insurance. round here where hillbillies do more racing than anything else you will see alot of street/strip cars, mud trucks, and dirt track cars with cages that built with the same equipment by self taught weldors bashing into each other and everything else on the track every weekend.dont be so dramatic. like I said its a boosted 500hp 35ft lb ricer. not nascar or topfuel. the kids paying for it just wanna look cool anyway while they play the boom boom music with the 500 lbs of speakers in the trunk.
Reply:Haha your right my bad dude.....but im power hungry american and I want excess. 500lb speakers in the back goin boomboom hahah. I get it....the 115v welder is good enough for some. Like my personal toolbox at home. Guy at work doesnt understand how I can spend 6gs on a snapon tools box when the crafstman does the same job holding tools. But its not good enough for me....he doesnt understand it.your right I dont have a clue as to how to build a cage. I claimed to not having any idea as how to ya know and I applaud the dude for thatyou were counting how many times I edited my posts? Wow dude get off my nutz I typed some things I wanted to take back haha dont really wanna get banned over some dumbass horseplay you need not worry about what I type unless its directed to you. My opinion was for rsti to judge. Or whatever he wants to do with it. That guys fulla sht or yeah hes kinda right wish I had a bigger welder. Im out dont wanna steer this guys post off course any longer talkin trash back in forth with you.Miller Syncrowave 210 w/CK FlexLoc 150 3/6/14ESAB PCM 1125 Plasma CutterAtlas 12x36 LatheACER 9x42 3hp millHarig 612 Surface GrinderDRINK Machine welding&fabrication
Reply:Any chance you could weld up a few "rollcage style" pieces, put them in the press (or equivalent) to twist them beyond recognition, and post pics of how the welds have held up or failed after that?We can discuss how welds look and welder sizes all day, but in the end I'd say that a test of the welds should say more about how they're going to hold up in a rollcage.
Reply:RSTi what type of bender do you use...post a pic of that...I started collecting materials for a Tacacs cycles air over hydraulic benderMiller Syncrowave 210 w/CK FlexLoc 150 3/6/14ESAB PCM 1125 Plasma CutterAtlas 12x36 LatheACER 9x42 3hp millHarig 612 Surface GrinderDRINK Machine welding&fabrication
Reply:Neat stuff! I hate doing any cage work and turn it down all the time. Getting to old to crawl around in cars.
Reply:Originally Posted by chevydylRSTi what type of bender do you use...post a pic of that...I started collecting materials for a Tacacs cycles air over hydraulic bender
Reply:Nice I like the elec pump idea. What you got into the pump? Can they be had for cheap or was it spendy.....I wonder if I could get a ram that would work for my mounting application.....the air/hydro units are pretty loud. They can be made faster by changing th3 air delivery....but with that they are louder and id much rather hear the whine or hum of an elec pumpMiller Syncrowave 210 w/CK FlexLoc 150 3/6/14ESAB PCM 1125 Plasma CutterAtlas 12x36 LatheACER 9x42 3hp millHarig 612 Surface GrinderDRINK Machine welding&fabrication
Reply:Well I had a couple minutes this morning so I quickly grabbed a couple scrap pieces, turns out they were .120" wall not the .095" we make all cages with. So that should explain why these may look a little cold at the starts. Also dont have much for destructive testing so I threw this in our 12 ton press and went until I was sure the press was about to break haha.
Reply:Nice mic....those welds look pretty decent with the up close pic I stand corrected.I have some starrett outside calipers and a divider that are about 110yrs old light pitting but beautiful tools that I use while machining on the lathe...do you put a small bevel on your tubes? Was looking at some other cage builds and the guy was putting a bevel on them.Miller Syncrowave 210 w/CK FlexLoc 150 3/6/14ESAB PCM 1125 Plasma CutterAtlas 12x36 LatheACER 9x42 3hp millHarig 612 Surface GrinderDRINK Machine welding&fabrication
Reply:That's the difference between circle jerk and real race cars. The NHRA woulda had them put back on a trailer.Bubble gumTooth pixDuct tapeBlack glueGBMF hammerScrew gun --bad battery (see above)
Reply:if you really wanna test some skills next time you could try butt welding two sticks together and bending the joint. or you could also cut a section of your joint out and bend it. thanks for sharing. nice btw
Reply:Originally Posted by chevydylNice I like the elec pump idea. What you got into the pump? Can they be had for cheap or was it spendy.....I wonder if I could get a ram that would work for my mounting application.....the air/hydro units are pretty loud. They can be made faster by changing th3 air delivery....but with that they are louder and id much rather hear the whine or hum of an elec pump
Reply:Huh yeah I dont need a 900 dollar ram pump for my bender. Thing I like about the bender im building is it bends the tube up instead of sideways....but has a larger footprint than your style its engineered around pro tools 105 diesLast edited by chevydyl; 12-27-2013 at 03:29 PM.Miller Syncrowave 210 w/CK FlexLoc 150 3/6/14ESAB PCM 1125 Plasma CutterAtlas 12x36 LatheACER 9x42 3hp millHarig 612 Surface GrinderDRINK Machine welding&fabrication
Reply:Originally Posted by chevydyldo you put a small bevel on your tubes? Was looking at some other cage builds and the guy was putting a bevel on them.
Reply:Tube fitting and bending looks good. The welds are down right dangerous! Buy the proper welder or stop doing cages. Your going to kill someone!There is zero excuse, a decent machine for a shop is small money. All the online inspector jokes are cute, but you can see that most of those welds are cold, some are just snails laying on top for the most part. But I will be flamed and told how billy bob and john boy have welded 5,000 cages with a 140 mig and they hit walls at 200 MPH and didn't even bend 1/16.Last edited by n20junkie; 12-28-2013 at 11:28 AM.Syncrowave 350Coolmate 3Millermatic 251Spoolmatic 30A
Reply:Since it was brought up about safety, who is at fault if there was a failure in the cage that resulted with injury. I am sure the shop would be at fault but could the employee(welder) also be gone after in a lawsuit if it was determined a weld failed?
Reply:The welder is always at fault. No chassis inspection checks for much beyond visual condition of welds and the proper tube size and position. This is just a lack of professionalism all around. And to demonstrate how strong your welds are while pushing on the tube wall just shows how little the guy knows about stuff. Proper welds should hold many tens of thousands of pounds. A shop press denting the wall shows absolutely nothing. If this was a home builder I would say nice work. For a shop to be turning this stuff out is discusting. People trust their lives to this stuff. If a car fails, you will be stuck with the financial loss, and the knowledge that you used excuses and pawned off work as professional, when it wasn't.Syncrowave 350Coolmate 3Millermatic 251Spoolmatic 30A |
|
发表于 2021-8-31 22:39:16