welder for a pipeline job?

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I'm wanting to hopefully go on a pipeline job sometime in the near future and I'm going to need to buy a new welder. I know many people use the lincoln classic welders or the SAE Welder and the pipeliner my question is which one is probably the best choice and does it really matter? This might be a dumb question but I'm just wondering before I go waste money on a welder when I might need a different one. Thanks for any answers.Lincoln 225 RangerSa200            01 dodge  3500 welding rig
Reply:Pipeline welding has evolved over the years and there are several different disciplines. All of the machines you're asking about will work on the basic pipeline. After you use any of the machines you listed long enough to master the 6G pipe test and the 12" on 12" saddle you're good to go. Many pipelines are using flux core, dual shield, etc. Personally I prefer the SA 200. Many do, but they are limited to stick. Some are using them for flux core, inner shield, etc. but I don't know if the inspectors are allowing them on pipe lines as I have been out of that part of it for a long while now.Only when the last tree has died and the last river has been poisoned and the last fish has been caught will we realize we cannot eat money.                                         -Cree Indian ProverbSA 200 LincolnVictor Torches
Reply:How much money you have to spend will best dictate an answer...IMOSA 200's ae nice and I've run one... But, I've been on a Lincoln Vantage recently and got to lay my hands on a Miller Pipe Pro and it's the cats meow....If you got the money there is no reason to buy an older machine that may have issues.  If your breaking into the BIZ, and it sounds like you are?  And are mechanically incline?  There is no better low dollar machine than an SA200 to break into the biz on...  I bought mine for $800, fixed up some basic issues, made money with it, and then sold it for $2700....Nothing souds like an old sa-200...Sounds mean!The modern machines are on point though....No going back for me. The convenience of plugging in a grinder, lights, etc.... Is awesome. They are multi-process capable. And weld good as hell. I'd also recommend if you have the money?  To buy a diesel welder.....Diesel is king.1981 Lincoln SA 200Miller Trailblazer 302gMiller 211 Mig Welder w/ AutosetI'm learning to stick metal together
Reply:Henkel and McCoy has been running a line through my town for the last few months... pretty much all the hired welders rig's have sa 200s, one or two are running pipe pro's.. Henkels trucks and the EJM Pipe Service trucks are all running millers of some sort, which I found interesting. The pipe layer machines are running six packs with what looks like XMT's.. was hard to tell from a distance.  Anyway it comes down to preference and whether you want to run wire as well.
Reply:Thank you all for the replies they are very helpful. I am still currently in school but I have been welding for awhile and have got pretty good at the 6G position. I heard the SA200 is a good welder I had my eye on a classic 300 but I also heard they weren't as good as the SA 200 but idk I still have a while before I have to worry about it but was just planning ahead.Lincoln 225 RangerSa200            01 dodge  3500 welding rig
Reply:I have a 1989 SA-200 on my truck. My welding school has a miller bobcat 250 and hands down the SA-200 runs a much smoother arc. Not to mention the SA-200 will last forever and replacement parts are easy to be had. With a simple TIG hard rig a SA-200 is capable of doing the TIG roots that some companies require. P.S. See you in class on Monday.....don't be late.BrettUSAF SSgt - Explosives ExpertHobart Handler 187Hobart Airforce 4001989 Lincoln SA-200 Classic I
Reply:im in the process of rebuilding my 1972 SA 200.  i bought it january 2010 for $300 and it came on a 2 wheel trailer.  I used it for a solid year and it burned 2 quarts of oil a day.  The machine shop bill came in at under $200 (friends in low places) and parts were $700.  I m not a mechanic by any stretch of the imagination but I was able to seperate the generator from the engine- my mechanic is taking over engine assembly.  In this economy, if you want to survive, you have to make smart decisions with your money.  There is no doubt in my mind why welders have loved these old 200's for generations.  I m a pipe guy so I have little use for anything else other than a "plain jane" stick welder.  If I need AC power I've got a Bobcat (great generator!)  Diesels are great but I need low cost, reliable, right now.  I can foot an extra $15 a day fuel cost gas vs. diesel.  As for the SAE 300, I have an old school SAE 300 (1978) - biggest drawback is size.  I will say I have my 300 on my truck right now while I get the 200 together.  The 300 is a better welder than the 200 by a little bit.  I just found out today I passed an "in service" high pressure gas line test I took about a month ago.  Basically, it was a 12 on 12 branch test with no hole cut out of the header, and water flowing through it.  From root pass to cap 7018 all the way out.  If you are familiar with 7018 its difficult to open root anything with it.  Once I figured the heat I needed, that 300 made love with that pipe ! lol.  Good luck, learn as much as you can.
Reply:some of the pipeline companies will tell you what you can and cant use..contact  the ones you want to work for...
Reply:I have been doing a little research and I'm starting to like the vantage 300 its a multi-process welder which is nice. I will be doing structural welding to but the classics are nice machines. I might just borrow ammo22's off of his rig its pretty nice.Lincoln 225 RangerSa200            01 dodge  3500 welding rig
Reply:personaly all the vantage machines are crap the computer boards go out on them all the time and when your waranty runs out that can get spendy.  the SA-200 is a great machine I have a 77 Miller Big 40 on my truck and it welds just as good as a 200 plus I have more amps than a 200 so I can burn big rod with out burning up the machine but like alot hae said its all in what you want to do and your personal pref hope this helpsLincoln Pro Core 125Lincolin sp 100Miller Big 40Lincoln Idealarc SP250miller matic 212http://www.facebook.com/hdwelding?sk=wallwww.hdweldingbeds.com
Reply:I have ran Lincoln SA200's and 250's both nice.  Some run alot smoother than others.  I would like to get into the Pipeline industry also.  I looked into this alot.  Some contractors will only allow Diesel Welders on there jobs.  I am a "Blue Guy".  I like my Millers.  The Miller Pipe Pro 350 is a great choice.  Expensive but really nice.  It runs at 1800 RPM VS the SA series welders at around 2500 - 3200 RPM.  Sips fuel, and is quiet.  and lighter than the SA series welders.  Its also smaller doesnt sit as high and will fit horizontally in the back of a truck easily.  Thats just my 2 Cents.  Good luck with your choice.Some Blue , Some Red & Some GreyProverbs 16:2-3.2 "All a person’s ways seem pure to them, but motives are weighed by the Lord. 3 Commit to the Lord whatever you do, and he will establish your plans."
Reply:old shorthoods turn at 1400 rpms and redface/blackfaces turn at 1550.  heard some places prefer diesels over gas.  keep in mind "if it an't grey, you can't stay." (pipeline)
Reply:Thank you for the advice on the vantage. I have always had any eye for the classics my dad had an old 57 classic he had for years ran perfect never had problems, he ended up trading it for a miller but it was a good machine. Anyways I'm probably going to get a classic as soon as I scrap up enough cash. Now the only decision I have is between a 200 or a 300?Lincoln 225 RangerSa200            01 dodge  3500 welding rig
Reply:you're going to need a backup machine. get one of each.
Reply:Originally Posted by lincweldyou're going to need a backup machine. get one of each.
Reply:he said he wants to get into pipeline work. talk to most pipeliners and they have at least 2 machines.  no, they probably didn't buy them at the same time but a back up is a good idea.
Reply:Originally Posted by lincweld  I just found out today I passed an "in service" high pressure gas line test I took about a month ago.
Reply:Originally Posted by lincweldhe said he wants to get into pipeline work. talk to most pipeliners and they have at least 2 machines.  no, they probably didn't buy them at the same time but a back up is a good idea.
Reply:Originally Posted by fortyonethirtyI've never done any pipe or utilities type work. So, I'm wondering, do people actually weld on "in service" high pressure natural gas pipelines?
Reply:Originally Posted by welder_onein post #9, he also stated that he would be doing structural as well... i do some pipe, mostly bridges and tons of custom work, i not only have back up machines, but also back up trucks too if thats what ya wanna call em, but i am more worried about the trucks layin down than i am the machines especially with all the danged soccer moms on the cell phones out n about...
Reply:That's why I was wondering about to vantage 300 I have ran a classic before and loved it but I have never ran a vantage. The reason I was asking was because I will be doing structural to and need AC power to run my tools and other gadgets. That one guy said vantages are crap so I wasn for sure. The only reason I'm having a hard time is because I will more than likely need something besides straight DC.Lincoln 225 RangerSa200            01 dodge  3500 welding rig
Reply:I have a miller bobcat 250 i use for structural and non critical pipe. I use my SA 200 and SAE 300 for critical (xray) pipe.  It looks like you have a BC 250 and Ranger so I would say your structural welding and AC needs are covered.  Some people love those Vantages and some hate em.  IMO, I am sure they weld great till something goes wrong.  I can work on my SA 200 and 300.
Reply:Ya lincweld your right I was just wanting the best of both worlds on one truck but I guess it won't hurt to back up to a trailer and pull the ranger or bobcat around. I think I'm pretty set on a classic 300 with a diesel engine I have been lookin at some they are a little pricey but it will be worth it to get a good machine that will last.Lincoln 225 RangerSa200            01 dodge  3500 welding rig
Reply:Have you looked at any SA 250 's ?  I believe they have an AC side (not sure).  On Bill's site, www.billswelderrepair.com,pre owned section, they have an SAE 350 with a deutz diesel.  I would bet that would cover your welding needs and it looks like a late enough model it may have electronic idler and AC power.  Dual continuous control on the SAE machines are about as sweet as it gets when stick welding.  I think the price tag at $5k may just be at or a little below what you've been seeing classic 300 going for.
Reply:Originally Posted by lincweldmost companies can sympathize with new equipment going down but if it looks like sh*t and is old -they have less patience and will call someone else.Very true about limiting your income that's why I'm wanting a machine that gives me more options. I have two other welders with plenty of AC power for when I'm at home doing custom work. But my main concern was the pipeline I have never been on one and don't really know if I will need AC power on it or not. From what I have read a lot of the rigs do not have AC so you might not really need it. Guess ill find out if I ever go on one. Thanks for the info on that SA 250 ill look into that.Lincoln 225 RangerSa200            01 dodge  3500 welding rig
Reply:Also you have a great advantage over guys like me.  Your right in Oklahoma.  I believe Tulsa is the Pipeline capital of wthe world.  Also Local 798 is located right in Tulsa.  I wish you the best of luck.Some Blue , Some Red & Some GreyProverbs 16:2-3.2 "All a person’s ways seem pure to them, but motives are weighed by the Lord. 3 Commit to the Lord whatever you do, and he will establish your plans."
Reply:Thanks Diesel Don and your right tulsa is probably the capitol of pipeliners I'm hoping to join the 798ers after school. I know a lot of them run classics and vantages that's why I narrowed it down to them two. Hopefully everything goes the way I got it planned but only time will tellLincoln 225 RangerSa200            01 dodge  3500 welding rig
Reply:how do you get into pipe lining if if your already set up?\
Reply:how do you get into pipe lining if if your already set up?\
Reply:Originally Posted by Hammerwelderhow do you get into pipe lining if if your already set up?\
Reply:Yes I think it is very hard to get on with the 798ers but worth the try. They are very good and pay will be good. There is a lot of travel but it would be worth it to me. Diesel Don you should move to oklahoma lol.Lincoln 225 RangerSa200            01 dodge  3500 welding rig
Reply:I always wanted to go to Oklahoma, Furthest south I ever been was Kentucky.  What are you doing for the time being?  Are you Self Employeed?Some Blue , Some Red & Some GreyProverbs 16:2-3.2 "All a person’s ways seem pure to them, but motives are weighed by the Lord. 3 Commit to the Lord whatever you do, and he will establish your plans."
Reply:Originally Posted by DieselDon16I am a aspiring Pipeliner.  But I can give you a rough idea, I've researched the hell out of this.  Go on Local798.org fill out an Welders application.  Also on the site theres a Business Agent list, find one in your area, give him a call and see what he says.  I believe the test is a 24" Alabama Bell hole test.  I've found its really hard to get into Local 798, but anything great is worth waiting for.  These guys are the best of the best.
Reply:I've heard both.  Its a 24" Sched 40, 6G test.  Root and Cap, I believe its 6010 Root, 8010 all the way out.Some Blue , Some Red & Some GreyProverbs 16:2-3.2 "All a person’s ways seem pure to them, but motives are weighed by the Lord. 3 Commit to the Lord whatever you do, and he will establish your plans."
Reply:As of right now I am self-employed and a student. I do a lot of pipe fence for people, and me and my dad have done a few trailers and barn. Just whatever people need. I also go to welding school so I'm waiting to get done with that before hopefully pursuing my pipeline career. Are you self employed or anything?Lincoln 225 RangerSa200            01 dodge  3500 welding rig
Reply:I have a Trailblazer on the truck at all times, because it is compact, has lots of AC power, and I can run feeders and AC TIG off of it. I also have an SA-200 and an SA-250 on trailers that I will run if I am doing a piping job, or running boxes of baseball bat size rods. The Trailblazer is not even in the same class as the old mules, they spin at a nice mellow 1800RPM's (1550 on the 200) and are water cooled. The next truck I am getting will be big enough to have the Trailblazer and one of the Lincolns on it, or I will just buy a Vantage 500 compact case.Disclaimer; "I am just an a$$hole welder, don't take it personally ."
Reply:That's basically how I'm set up I have a lincoln ranger on a trailer and a miller bobcat on one. Now all I need is a truck and a 200 lol.Lincoln 225 RangerSa200            01 dodge  3500 welding rig
Reply:Originally Posted by bgrovesAs of right now I am self-employed and a student. I do a lot of pipe fence for people, and me and my dad have done a few trailers and barn. Just whatever people need. I also go to welding school so I'm waiting to get done with that before hopefully pursuing my pipeline career. Are you self employed or anything?
Reply:Ya work is slow here to its so dry were in a burn ban. Can't burn to many rods out in the field without starting a fire, so I decided to go to houston for a few days lol.Lincoln 225 RangerSa200            01 dodge  3500 welding rig
Reply:Yeah, I always said, the ecomony will affect you if you let it,  But now its bad and its effecting alot of people around these parts.Some Blue , Some Red & Some GreyProverbs 16:2-3.2 "All a person’s ways seem pure to them, but motives are weighed by the Lord. 3 Commit to the Lord whatever you do, and he will establish your plans."
Reply:Yes it is affecting everyone. I just got back from houston at 6 this morning and tomorrow I got a fencing job on the red river. Got a few corners to build there aint nothing like having to weld outside in 115 degree heat. But I have done it for the past 3 months I guess a few more won't kill me.Lincoln 225 RangerSa200            01 dodge  3500 welding rig
Reply:The 798 test is a 24" bellhole, not on a 45. many straps are cut. The test is (I believe) currently closed except to helper members looking to upgrade. Several years pipeline construction expierience is required. Better to check before thinking you can even get a shot at a test.Right now, in mainline construction there are several machines that are common, SA-200's (and everybody likes them), SA-250's (some people like them), the Classic series of 300's (some people like them), Vantages (some people like them) and Miller PipePro's (again, some people like them). That's it.This is a harsh field to break out in, an old cheap reliable 200 is the beginers best bet.If things work out you can always sample different machines. If things don't, you can always recoup your investment in an old pipeliner.JTMcC
Reply:Originally Posted by gizzardgutzPipeline welding has evolved over the years and there are several different disciplines. All of the machines you're asking about will work on the basic pipeline. After you use any of the machines you listed long enough to master the 6G pipe test and the 12" on 12" saddle you're good to go. Many pipelines are using flux core, dual shield, etc. Personally I prefer the SA 200. Many do, but they are limited to stick. Some are using them for flux core, inner shield, etc. but I don't know if the inspectors are allowing them on pipe lines as I have been out of that part of it for a long while now.
Reply:JTMcC that's what I figured and I know its hard to get your foot in the door. This might be a dumb question but I'm not really sure what a "bellhole" is?Lincoln 225 RangerSa200            01 dodge  3500 welding rig
Reply:Originally Posted by bgrovesJTMcC that's what I figured and I know its hard to get your foot in the door. This might be a dumb question but I'm not really sure what a "bellhole" is?
Reply:Thanks I was wondering what that meant. I to am wondering about the flux core on a pipeline. I always heard of the stick and occasional tig root on a pipeline but never flux core. I would like to become a pipeliner in the future but I will of course have to have experience and be a helper first but hopefully in the future I can be. I love welding and mostly  pipe.Lincoln 225 RangerSa200            01 dodge  3500 welding rig
Reply:Originally Posted by bgrovesThanks I was wondering what that meant. I to am wondering about the flux core on a pipeline. I always heard of the stick and occasional tig root on a pipeline but never flux core. I would like to become a pipeliner in the future but I will of course have to have experience and be a helper first but hopefully in the future I can be. I love welding and mostly  pipe.
Reply:Oh well I learned something else. What is usually the electrode application. I learned downhill and uphill. On downhill" which if I'm right is usually the process that is done on mainline" is 6010 root and hotpass and 7018 3/32 cover. That's what I was taught. Does that sound about right or am I off?Lincoln 225 RangerSa200            01 dodge  3500 welding rig
Reply:Originally Posted by bgrovesOh well I learned something else. What is usually the electrode application. I learned downhill and uphill. On downhill" which if I'm right is usually the process that is done on mainline" is 6010 root and hotpass and 7018 3/32 cover. That's what I was taught. Does that sound about right or am I off?