Old Idealarc AC/DC to TIG?

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Working on my welding skills, and been researching the ability to TIG with my old Idealarc....don't really need the ability to weld aluminum, today anyway, but if I could add a high freq box and torch setup for a reasonable cost, it appeals to me....Read several old posts about making the modification, but I'm just a hobby welder and not up on subject other than what I have read, and of course I only understand the concept at this point, maybe If you guys with the knowledge were going to plus up an old Idealarc with a high freq box ect, which components would you look for, and what budget would you set for them?Been reading about the ESAB on here so considering it's under $600 that is obviously another route...However saving money for a new Plasma cutter so any money saved is money saved....Thanks for any help,Andy
Reply:I'm not sure if you say you do want to do aluminum so you are looking for an HF box, or not. You do not need a HF box to scratch-start TIG steel. You can do it easily with that Idealarc AC/DC.Plenty of threads on here on what you need and how to hook up. You need an air-cool torch, bottle of argon, regulator or flowmeter, and consumables.Do a search, you will find what you need.Burt _____________________Miller Syncrowave 250Millermatic 211Miller 375 Plasma Cutter Hobart Handler 12010FtDrillBit.com
Reply:Your best bet is to put an air cooled TIG torch with a gas valve on it and learn to scratch start TIG and leave it at that.Putting an HF box on that welder will leave you with a jumbled mess of cables and boxes, and AC performance will be nominal without an amperage control. That's not to say it cannot be done, and done well, but for someone just starting out the learning curve will be sharp to say the least.Not also to mention, unless you find an old HF control laying around someplace cheap, you'll end up spending as much putting that together as you would finding an older analog TIG at such as an A/BP 330 or Dialarc HF on CL.There's lots of info on High Frequency starter controls, you'll have to do some looking. If you come across one for a couple hundred bux, then what the hell, give it a shot.IMHO of courseExpert Garage Hack....https://www.facebook.com/steven.webber.948
Reply:Thanks, that helps, I had read about several ways of making that type of modification, so was not sure which approach to take...Andy Originally Posted by 7A749Your best bet is to put an air cooled TIG torch with a gas valve on it and learn to scratch start TIG and leave it at that.Putting an HF box on that welder will leave you with a jumbled mess of cables and boxes, and AC performance will be nominal without an amperage control. That's not to say it cannot be done, and done well, but for someone just starting out the learning curve will be sharp to say the least.Not also to mention, unless you find an old HF control laying around someplace cheap, you'll end up spending as much putting that together as you would finding an older analog TIG at such as an A/BP 330 or Dialarc HF on CL.There's lots of info on High Frequency starter controls, you'll have to do some looking. If you come across one for a couple hundred bux, then what the hell, give it a shot.IMHO of course
Reply:Originally Posted by USADThanks, that helps, I had read about several ways of making that type of modification, so was not sure which approach to take...Andy
Reply:Do what I did.I picked up an air cooled miller weld craft torch.Part number WP-17V-12-2 ($111 from zoro tools). It has a terminal lug that will attach to the front of your idealarc and a gas line to attach to a regulator.Then select the gas lenses you want (I went with medium set $25) then get some Thoriated ($30) or E3 tungstens ($50+) for steel and stainless.It will get you tig welding for under $200, assuming you already have an inert gas bottle and reg.Don't rule out not being able to weld aluminum.The way the old timers did it they ran DCEP and try various gasses (argon and argon/helium mix) and use Zirconated Tungsten. But you will be very limited, thin aluminum, 40 amps or so with 1/8 inch tungsten.DCEP wrecks the tungsten but it cleans up the oxides off the aluminum real well (this is why pretty much everyone uses AC, you get DCEP oxide cleaning with out all the heat).A small air cooled torch on aluminum is treacherous no matter what machine you have powering it.I am going to try it, all I need to weld is 0.50 to 1/16 thick aluminum pipe, so hopefully I don't need a $3900 machine with a million setting.Last edited by mad welder 4; 02-15-2015 at 11:15 PM.old Miller spectrum 625 Lincoln SP-135 T, CO2+0.025 wireMiller model 250 and WP-18V torchCraftsman 100amp AC/DC and WP-17V torchCentury 115-004 HF arc stabilizerHome made 4 transformer spot welderHome made alternator welder
Reply:... unless you find an old HF control laying around someplace cheap...
Reply:That's a very good list, the detail helps, thanks much for taking the time to put it together...Not ruling out aluminum at all, want to learn the skill, and do want the equipment to do so, but have no real world projects at this time that require me to weld aluminum on a semi regular basis. Stainless is my near term goal....Andy Originally Posted by mad welder 4Do what I did.I picked up an air cooled miller weld craft torch.Part number WP-17V-12-2 ($111 from zoro tools). It has a terminal lug that will attach to the front of your idealarc and a gas line to attach to a regulator.Then select the gas lenses you want (I went with medium set $25) then get some Thoriated ($30) or E3 tungstens ($50+) for steel and stainless.It will get you tig welding for under $200, assuming you already have an inert gas bottle and reg.Don't rule out not being able to weld aluminum.The way the old timers did it they ran DCEP and try various gasses (argon and argon/helium mix) and use Zirconated Tungsten. But you will be very limited, thin aluminum, 40 amps or so with 1/8 inch tungsten.DCEP wrecks the tungsten but it cleans up the oxides off the aluminum real well (this is why pretty much everyone uses AC, you get DCEP oxide cleaning with out all the heat).A small air cooled torch on aluminum is treacherous no matter what machine you have powering it.I am going to try it, all I need to weld is 0.50 to 1/16 thick aluminum pipe, so hopefully I don't need a $3900 machine with a million setting.
Reply:Have read many different posts about adding an HF box, but just not sure which HF is the "best choice"...CL is limited here, nortwest of San Antonio, southwest of Austin, and most likely would have to buy off of ebay or a site like this....  Originally Posted by OldendumThey pop up occasionally. Just saw a beat AC225 with Linde HF and DC converter boxes, tig torch and about an 80CF argon cylinder for $150. on Winchester, VA CL.  Looks like it sold in a few days.  Had it been closer, I would have bought it for the cylinder alone.
Reply:If you ever do add an HF box to the Idealarc 250, read the manual first.  Something about a bypass filter cap required.http://weldingweb.com/vbb/showthread.php...citor-question"USMCPOP" First-born son: KIA  Iraq 1/26/05Syncrowave 250 w/ Coolmate 3Dialarc 250, Idealarc 250SP-175 +Firepower TIG 160S (gave the TA 161 STL to the son)Lincwelder AC180C (1952)Victor & Smith O/A torchesMiller spot welder
Reply:If you search Arc Pig on the internet (cheaper on ebay to buy) they make an add-on HF unit. I can't give an opinion on how well it works because I don't have one nor have I tried one but they are cheaper than the name brand units are often even used. I also want to try scratch start tig but I just haven't put it all together yet. All I need now is argon. Today it is -22 Celsius in my garage so I don't think I'm going to do anything out there anytime soon. If anyone tries one of these Arc Pig things I like to read a review. By the way Arc Pig's web site is worth a read. It's well written and funny.---Meltedmetal
Reply:I should have added that the weld craft torch part number I gave is for a 12 foot long torch. I do believe they offer longer ones.12 foot is plenty for me because I have extension leads plus I only plan on powering that torch with my easy to move around 100 amp craftsman welding machine and 80cf argon bottle.With that 300+lb dialarc and big argon cylinder you may want a longer torch.old Miller spectrum 625 Lincoln SP-135 T, CO2+0.025 wireMiller model 250 and WP-18V torchCraftsman 100amp AC/DC and WP-17V torchCentury 115-004 HF arc stabilizerHome made 4 transformer spot welderHome made alternator welder
Reply:I caught that in my manual about adding the Linclon HF box, but it does not go into detail....I assume that the Linclon HF box came with the instructions.Thanks for the link, Andy Originally Posted by OldendumIf you ever do add an HF box to the Idealarc 250, read the manual first.  Something about a bypass filter cap required.http://weldingweb.com/vbb/showthread.php...citor-question
Reply:Originally Posted by OldendumIf you ever do add an HF box to the Idealarc 250, read the manual first.  Something about a bypass filter cap required.http://weldingweb.com/vbb/showthread.php...citor-question
Reply:DynaSteve, that must have been Lincoln's answer to Miller's Blue Lightning.  Red Lightning unless you installed the bypass cap.  And Lincoln had it first, LOL! Bzzzt!I don't weld, but I do have an interest in my young one's career and a former professional interest in high accuracy AC calibration equipment. And I enjoy buying old but capable welding equipment for pennies on the dollar."USMCPOP" First-born son: KIA  Iraq 1/26/05Syncrowave 250 w/ Coolmate 3Dialarc 250, Idealarc 250SP-175 +Firepower TIG 160S (gave the TA 161 STL to the son)Lincwelder AC180C (1952)Victor & Smith O/A torchesMiller spot welder
Reply:OK, looks interesting, so I contacted  Arc Pig, made right here in Texas, and asked about using their product on my Idealarc, and if it needed the modification.  According to their response, the Arc Pig will work without any modification to my Idealarc...This is where I'm out of my depth:You guys have any thoughts on using this HF on an old Idealarc? Originally Posted by MeltedmetalIf you search Arc Pig on the internet (cheaper on ebay to buy) they make an add-on HF unit. I can't give an opinion on how well it works because I don't have one nor have I tried one but they are cheaper than the name brand units are often even used. I also want to try scratch start tig but I just haven't put it all together yet. All I need now is argon. Today it is -22 Celsius in my garage so I don't think I'm going to do anything out there anytime soon. If anyone tries one of these Arc Pig things I like to read a review. By the way Arc Pig's web site is worth a read. It's well written and funny.
Reply:Originally Posted by 7A749I had never known that about that machine.Thanks for posting it Dick.
Reply:Originally Posted by USADOK, looks interesting, so I contacted  Arc Pig, made right here in Texas, and asked about using their product on my Idealarc, and if it needed the modification.  According to their response, the Arc Pig will work without any modification to my Idealarc...This is where I'm out of my depth:You guys have any thoughts on using this HF on an old Idealarc?
Reply:From a newer Idealarc manual:Reduce the Idealarc 250 duty cycle by 50%when AC TIG welding, i.e., the welder should beoperated for only two and one half minutes outof every ten at rated current of 200 amperes.Edit:About halfway down the page, this guy discusses the RF bypass cap and shows a picture.  http://hildstrom.com/projects/ac-225/He lists another cheap ($10.) source of the dual "bathtub" cap .05 microFarad, 1000V:  http://www.surplussales.com/capacitors/BathtubCaps.htmlLast edited by Oldendum; 02-17-2015 at 10:46 AM."USMCPOP" First-born son: KIA  Iraq 1/26/05Syncrowave 250 w/ Coolmate 3Dialarc 250, Idealarc 250SP-175 +Firepower TIG 160S (gave the TA 161 STL to the son)Lincwelder AC180C (1952)Victor & Smith O/A torchesMiller spot welder
Reply:Oops, the dual cap is $19."USMCPOP" First-born son: KIA  Iraq 1/26/05Syncrowave 250 w/ Coolmate 3Dialarc 250, Idealarc 250SP-175 +Firepower TIG 160S (gave the TA 161 STL to the son)Lincwelder AC180C (1952)Victor & Smith O/A torchesMiller spot welder
Reply:http://hildstrom.com/projects/ac-225/Interesting link. Thanks.---Meltedmetal
Reply:Well now, that's entertaining and very informative... Originally Posted by Meltedmetalhttp://hildstrom.com/projects/ac-225/Interesting link. Thanks.