MIG vs FLUX Core for outside autobody

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I'm a beginner, so please excuse if i botch terms... I've decided to take on a personal project of redoing the wheel wells on my Ford Bronco. I have never done any auto body, and i'm a basic welder at best (trying to learn). I've gotten plenty of sheet metal to practice on before i hit the bronco with anything...What I'm looking for some opinions on is Mig vs Flux for auto body work... I know the differences between the two as it pertains to the mess related to flux and the issues around wind for MIG... I dont have the MIG tanks, so i'm currently only doing flux, but for this project, i want it clean, so i'm curious if i should be investing in the tanks or just sticking with the flux.I will be doing my welding outside (i dont have a garage), i can hang tarps for some  shielding, but thats it.Please let me know your thoughts on what i should be doing to prep, any recommendations on gas combos or specific flux wire... and please keep in mind, i am a novice.Thanks in advanceI am a new guy, please don't be to harsh.Welding Equipment so far:First Welder: Blue Hawk Flux-MIG 100 (no tanks, so only Flux for me right now)Second Welder: Miller MillerMatic 211 Auto-Set with MVP
Reply:Just my opinion, but body work might be a tad thin for flux core.  Solid mig wire in smaller size would be best.   75/25 should work.  Wish my uncle was still alive as his skill with auto body was excellent.  Make sure metal is clean on both sides.  Watch for distortion as well.  A wet rag to cool the weld area can help with that.  Will be a steep learning curve.  Best of luck, Mike
Reply:I think you will run into corrosion issues with flux core. Also burn through will be a problem. .025 solid wire with co2 or 75/25 would be my choice.
Reply:I doubt flux core will give you good results.I would use .025 wire and argon co2 mix, copper backing plates where they could be used would also help.You will need to practice a lot if you are going to do vertical and overhead for your first project.
Reply:I have welded body panels with both types of mig. Honestly IMO, the flux core is a pain in the a$$. It can be done but its a pain. I would much rather use solid wire. String up some tarps to block the wind from blowing the gas away and you should be set. Besides, your welds will only be 1/4" stringers at the most. Thats about 1.5 seconds of welding at any given time. Like Dieselbass said, make sure its clean and keep a wet rag handy. It doesn't take much to warp a body panel. Trust me! Anyways good luck!Operating Engineers Local 3Lincoln SA 200Victor TorchDewalt Grinder10 lbs SledgeWhat more do ya need!
Reply:Allstate/Esab EasyGrind wire was formulated especially for autobody work. The original had a very low tensil strength which limited distortion, heat input, and hardness. Indeed it was very easy to grind and could hammer out well. The later blend increased the tensile and hardness, but is still very nice burning and grinding wire.Weld like a "WELDOR", not a wel-"DERR" MillerDynasty700DX,Dynasty350DX4ea,Dynasty200DX,Li  ncolnSW200-2ea.,MillerMatic350P,MillerMatic200w/spoolgun,MKCobraMig260,Lincoln SP-170T,PlasmaCam/Hypertherm1250,HFProTig2ea,MigMax1ea.
Reply:Thanks for the feedback everyone. From the sound of it, flux is not the way to go and i will be investing in some tanks.Any recommendations outside the .025 solid wire with argon/co2I am a new guy, please don't be to harsh.Welding Equipment so far:First Welder: Blue Hawk Flux-MIG 100 (no tanks, so only Flux for me right now)Second Welder: Miller MillerMatic 211 Auto-Set with MVP
Reply:Bluewelders, What are copper backing plates? how do they help?I am a new guy, please don't be to harsh.Welding Equipment so far:First Welder: Blue Hawk Flux-MIG 100 (no tanks, so only Flux for me right now)Second Welder: Miller MillerMatic 211 Auto-Set with MVP
Reply:If you are welding something that will tend to burn through, the copper backing will keep an over heated spot from falling through.The reason to use copper is that the weld will not stick to the copper, so the copper acts as sort of a mold.
Reply:When you cut your patch panel, leave a gap around the whole panel about .024 to.030 wide (check with mig wire). This gap coupled with a copper backer and a hotter setting on your machine will give you full penetration while limiting distortion. I'd recommend single small tacks only, basically just squeeze the trigger and let go. Make your tacks as far apart from each other as possible. All of this will limit distortion but not completely eliminate it. You'll have to bring your welds down and hammer/dolly the welded area to stretch it back out.  Harbor freight has a decent cheap copper spoon that you can hold on the backside and Eastwood has a cool little magnetic one that you can use hands free.
Reply:A perfectionist learns how to do things under adverse conditions  because a monkey can get results  in a lab. There is nothing wrong with learning sheet metal with flux core. You may not want to do it on the actual work though.
Reply:Originally Posted by mikecwikA perfectionist learns how to do things under adverse conditions  because a monkey can get results  in a lab. There is nothing wrong with learning sheet metal with flux core. You may not want to do it on the actual work though.
Reply:Is your welder a tapped or infinite adjustment machine? Of its a tapped machine I think you're going to have trouble flux core welding on thin stuff. Like Mike said, it's good to learn different things in adverse conditions so you're prepared when conditions are less than ideal, but I think you'll be much happier with your results if you use .024 solid wire and 75/25.
Reply:Auto body welding is basically a series of tacks joined together. How are you going to clean all the flux off each tack? Use solid wire, place tacks several inches apart and then fill in between them as they cool off.
Reply:What year bronco?  I need to do the same on my 94 but finding the time is always hard.Multimatic 200Ellis 1800Haberle S225 9" cold sawMM 300;  Spoolmate 30A w/ WC-24TB 302GDynasty 280 DX Tigrunner
Reply:Originally Posted by Sharon NeedlesIs your welder a tapped or infinite adjustment machine? Of its a tapped machine I think you're going to have trouble flux core welding on thin stuff. Like Mike said, it's good to learn different things in adverse conditions so you're prepared when conditions are less than ideal, but I think you'll be much happier with your results if you use .024 solid wire and 75/25.
Reply:Originally Posted by DrooopyWhat year bronco?  I need to do the same on my 94 but finding the time is always hard.
Reply:May I offer a bit of advice here. First off as everyone said don't do flux core on body panels.If you are cutting out rust get to good metal Then flange the metal. What that entails is using a tool like this http://autobodystore.net/Merchant2/m...egory_Code=CDBWhat that tool does is bend an offset flange into the body panel so that you can cut a repair piece and drop it in place.Drill a few holes in the replacement piece along the perimeter and plug weld into place.Several thing happen here, first you eliminate the need to get a piece cut perfectly to fit the hole you cut out, and the flange acts as backing so it will be harder to burn through. You will not warp the existing panel from having used to much heat creating warping or "oil canning" which is extra wok to deal with. When you are done just hit the area with a sander and use a thin plastic body filler filler to cover, then paint.
Reply:Originally Posted by amatoolbox1996 Eddie Bauer... i've had it since 97, i got it off a 1 year lease with 24k miles (it has 198k on it now), so i am kind of sentimental to keeping it on the road.
Reply:Originally Posted by gmakraMay I offer a bit of advice here. First off as everyone said don't do flux core on body panels.If you are cutting out rust get to good metal Then flange the metal. What that entails is using a tool like this http://autobodystore.net/Merchant2/m...egory_Code=CDBWhat that tool does is bend an offset flange into the body panel so that you can cut a repair piece and drop it in place.Drill a few holes in the replacement piece along the perimeter and plug weld into place.Several thing happen here, first you eliminate the need to get a piece cut perfectly to fit the hole you cut out, and the flange acts as backing so it will be harder to burn through. You will not warp the existing panel from having used to much heat creating warping or "oil canning" which is extra wok to deal with. When you are done just hit the area with a sander and use a thin plastic body filler filler to cover, then paint.
Reply:For patch panels, my friend uses the twin-tube epoxy mix (think large caulking gun that has two barrels that mix at the tip).He flanges the patch area, fits the patch panel to sit in it, then uses the epoxy.Quick, and no rusting between the patch and old metal.I like welding - but I'm thinking of trying his method - he's been doing it for 10-15 years now it seems like.I've been using an air flanger/hole punch to make the flange and punch the holes to spot weld with the mig.Not show quality, but it works Dave J.Beware of false knowledge; it is more dangerous than ignorance. ~George Bernard Shaw~ Syncro 350Invertec v250-sThermal Arc 161 and 300MM210DialarcTried being normal once, didn't take....I think it was a Tuesday.
Reply:Originally Posted by MinnesotaDaveFor patch panels, my friend uses the twin-tube epoxy mix (think large caulking gun that has two barrels that mix at the tip).He flanges the patch area, fits the patch panel to sit in it, then uses the epoxy.Quick, and no rusting between the patch and old metal.I like welding - but I'm thinking of trying his method - he's been doing it for 10-15 years now it seems like.I've been using an air flanger/hole punch to make the flange and punch the holes to spot weld with the mig.Not show quality, but it works
Reply:Flux core residue will come through your paint.Flux wire is never used on body work.
Reply:Originally Posted by DrooopyIt was a sad day when my father in law traded in his 92 on a pilot.  It had some issues, but he had it since new and the body was perfect.  I think he got $500 for it.  I got my 94 in 08.   Only about 140k on it now with an engine rebuild at 125k.  My 10yo daughter still thinks it will be her first car, but I have to figure out how to stop the rust first.
Reply:Read this thread http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/s...ad.php?t=53534 paying close attention to MP&C's methods.MillerMatic 252, HTP 221 w/cooler, Hypertherm PM45, Lincoln IdealArc 250 AC/DC"I'd like to believe as many true things and as few false things as possible"38+ years doing auto body and restoration work. Do NOT use the glues. They don't hold well and don't last. I recommend solid core with 75/25.
Reply:And on a side note, if you're not ready to drop the $200+ on a bottle your LWS will rent by the month for around $35. That should be plenty of time to do both fenders and a few other projects to make it worth while.
Reply:when i do this, i'll do it right . i'll get my own bottles.i was going to comment on the glue (Steve B already covered it)... it may be easy and look good, but i've seen it 5 years later where the glue has separated due to a few seasons of change.I am a new guy, please don't be to harsh.Welding Equipment so far:First Welder: Blue Hawk Flux-MIG 100 (no tanks, so only Flux for me right now)Second Welder: Miller MillerMatic 211 Auto-Set with MVP
Reply:Just hope you never have to fix something that someone has filled with spray foam.
Reply:Now THAT is mig vs flux!I am a new guy, please don't be to harsh.Welding Equipment so far:First Welder: Blue Hawk Flux-MIG 100 (no tanks, so only Flux for me right now)Second Welder: Miller MillerMatic 211 Auto-Set with MVP