How on earth do you Mig vertical up?

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First and foremost I’m a TIG welder, but nature of my job I have to do a bunch of Mig as well. Most of the Mig welding I do I can move to make it easier to weld in a flat position but many a time I’ve felt I could save a lot of time welding out of position. Only problem is I can’t figure out vertical up for Mig! I have watched videos on it and people make it look easy but when I do it winds up looking like a turkeys neck. I’m positive it’s a settings/technique thing but my Mig welding is self taught and I’ve never had anyone who can show me what on earth I’m doing wrong.Gear: Esab power compact 205 with tbi industries torch         BOC Smootharc 185dc tig         Miller Syncrowave 350LX
Reply:I can do it... not great, though.There are two things you definitely need:1. short-arc setting without too many amps. You need the weld pool to freeze and hold in place, not drop out.2. You need to pause on the sides to fill them, and the centre will fill itself.The easiest technique to learn is the christmas tree method. Just move the arc in a upwards arrowhead tracing the upper edge of the puddle (this gives penetration), pause on each side.Watch weldingtipsandtricks or weld.com videos on youtube, those guys are great teachers

Murphy's Golden Rule: Whoever has the gold, makes the rules.
Reply:My helper weld first couple up.

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Reply:Use short circuit for vertical up Mig. Can also move up to a globular transfer depending on thickness.I personally use flux cored for out of position work. Short circuit welds lack in the penetration department 😁
Reply:70s wire 17V to 19V and 170 to 200imp/ws. Bevel both edges to a point 3/32 to 1/16 gap. Stay on the leading edge tight weave to grab both sides. Lots of grinding edges of weld between passes. Widen out the weave up to 1/4" max for the rest of the passes, stringers only. No fat weaves. That's the procedure for the pipe booms of the draglines I repair. And pre heat if the steel is over 1/4" thick.
Reply:It takes practice.I can vertical up weld and brazed with a torch too but I have welding since1964.  But took time the videos are OK but most just does not replace doing the work. You find books do better job but both is even better. Remember too most on U-tube are try get name and face on U tube. I not saying they bad but they do give some idea how do the work.Dave

Originally Posted by William Payne

First and foremost I’m a TIG welder, but nature of my job I have to do a bunch of Mig as well. Most of the Mig welding I do I can move to make it easier to weld in a flat position but many a time I’ve felt I could save a lot of time welding out of position. Only problem is I can’t figure out vertical up for Mig! I have watched videos on it and people make it look easy but when I do it winds up looking like a turkeys neck. I’m positive it’s a settings/technique thing but my Mig welding is self taught and I’ve never had anyone who can show me what on earth I’m doing wrong.
Reply:One way to get the fusion is go up, so easy to melt as u go.www.urkafarms.com
Reply:WhoopsLast edited by Sberry; 03-29-2022 at 12:38 PM.www.urkafarms.com
Reply:Just remember the door chart settings are for the flat position, you need to go down 1-2 thickness settings when going from horizontal settings to vertical welding. So on vertical up if welding 1/8 material I will drop down to the settings for 18 gauge and adjust from there.Miller Multimatic 255
Reply:Thanks guys. Yeah I figured it was a turn things down and take my time type deal. I often felt I was putting too much heat into it and just melting the crap out of it. Thankfully knowing I hadn’t done I only ever messed with it in practice.
Reply:You notice,,, as someone else mentioned the pic 2 was too slow across the middle.   Louie,,, as best I remember the charts are too cold for me flat and they are more suited to up.  You can stringer up also.  I think the deal in pic 1 was we cut a bent bracket off, there was a gap about 3/8 and that was a weave fill uphill. That weld is really installed in between 2 pieces as much as fusing 2 together if that makes sense.

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Last edited by Sberry; 03-29-2022 at 05:38 PM.www.urkafarms.com
Reply:The 1 in pic 1 way above, the gap was big I remember.  It was a busted collision repair and we cut it loose to realign or whatever and it came up short.  It mighta been,,, watch this moment and instead of build it out etc simply weave it all up.www.urkafarms.com
Reply:

Originally Posted by William Payne

Thanks guys. Yeah I figured it was a turn things down and take my time type deal. I often felt I was putting too much heat into it and just melting the crap out of it. Thankfully knowing I hadn’t done I only ever messed with it in practice.
Reply:Your attn to detail is good.  Turning it down a little helped manage it but you got it to the point that it wouldnt get a second look which is a good thing.  If you got a little seat time you would be world class.  Maybe even a little coaching so to speak.www.urkafarms.com
Reply:Nothing wrong with short circuit if its melted, aint no way that isnt strong.www.urkafarms.com
Reply:[QUOTE=Oscar;8855623]100% self taught.  It takes quite a bit doing trial-and-error, but going through things 1 step at a time helps out.  As you can see, dropping the settings really helps, but one thing that no one has mentioned is that it really helps out if you have the tip at bare minimum flush with the gun if it is a narrow nozzle, but if you have a large nozzle, it really helps if the tip is protruding just a tad so you can get a really short stick out.  It helps to get a nice flat weld bead;  the little (amount of) filler that is being added is really flattened out by the short arc length which helps bump up the amps.  So technically the "amps" that I put in that pic are somewhat misleading.  They are what I set the machine to via the synergic settings, but I'm pretty sure the actual amps were higher in the upper beads (than what I set the machine to).It almost sorta starts to "transform" into TIG welding where by the arc is melting the base metals, and very little filler is being added so that it doesn't drop out of the joint and sorta freezes in place as you progress along.  That's the best way I can describe it.  In the bottom run at higher amps, the higher WFS did get the heat in there, but it came with the price of excess filler metal being deposited, and you can see it starts to drop out, just from looking at the shape.  The upper ones at lower WFS I had the contact tip as close as I possibly could;  I kept the amps up, just like the lower ones, but not using WFS, I used a very short stick out and the puddle was much more controllable because there wasn't an excessive amount of molten metal trying to follow the arc./QUOTE]Thanks! Material thickness looks like 1/4"?Millermatic 255Dynasty 280 DXReady Welder IHypertherm 30XP
Reply:[QUOTE=robert-r;8855780]

Originally Posted by Oscar

Thanks! Material thickness looks like 1/4"?
Reply:If your using 75/25 gas your going to be in the short circuit arena,  Most welders have a chart on them that shows approximate volts and wire speed. Practice is the key to anything.We've done so much, for so long, with so little. Were now qualified to do anything with nothing !