What happens to E71T-11 gasless wire if run with C25

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On the job I'm on we've given a procedure to run .045 E71T-1M dual shield, but the wire supplied is .035 E71T-11 self shield, the question has been raised about the wire being wrong and gas not being needed and we've just been told to use the wire that's been supplied and weld it with gas.So what happens to -11 self shield if you run it with C25?
Reply:I read somewhere that using shielding gas with E71T-11 actually degrades the chemistry of the weld metal or makes it more brittle, or something like that. But for the life of me, I can't find that link in my bookmarks. So don't take this as gospel.Miller Multimatic 255
Reply:I can tell you one thing for sure:The weld properties will not be the same as they would be if used the way the manufacturer recommended.Murphy's Golden Rule: Whoever has the gold, makes the rules.
Reply:It is any one's guess. I have seen a few times data on E71-1 using different gas.This one I used for 30 years with CO2.Today I use E71-11 no gas it works great.If I had C25 I would try it out on E71-11 Dave

Originally Posted by ttoks

On the job I'm on we've given a procedure to run .045 E71T-1M dual shield, but the wire supplied is .035 E71T-11 self shield, the question has been raised about the wire being wrong and gas not being needed and we've just been told to use the wire that's been supplied and weld it with gas.So what happens to -11 self shield if you run it with C25?
Reply:It was a thread from long ago, but the data sheet for the lincoln, or hobart states NOT TO USE SHIELDING GAS, something about preventing the flux from having enough Oxygen to work properly.Here's a Hyundai data sheet for Super 11 , take note of page 2 :  http://www.hyundaiwelding.com/data/f...hield%2011.pdfHere's what Lincoln has to say about it  :    https://www.lincolnelectric.com/en/W...W-S-ElectrodesCheersAirco 250 ac/dc Heliwelder Square waveMiller Synchrowave 180 sdMiller Econo Twin HFLincoln 210 MPDayton 225 ac/dcVictor torchesSnap-On YA-212Lotos Cut60D
Reply:Thank you Great data on E71T-11 Dave

Originally Posted by albrightree

It was a thread from long ago, but the data sheet for the lincoln, or hobart states NOT TO USE SHIELDING GAS, something about preventing the flux from having enough Oxygen to work properly.Here's a Hyundai data sheet for Super 11 , take note of page 2 :  http://www.hyundaiwelding.com/data/f...hield%2011.pdfHere's what Lincoln has to say about it  :    https://www.lincolnelectric.com/en/W...W-S-ElectrodesCheers
Reply:I did it many years ago as an experiment.  Cannot recall the actual results.  Not impressive in eliminating cleanup as that was my goal.
Reply:Back to old saying {What not broken do not fix}Dave

Originally Posted by tapwelder

I did it many years ago as an experiment.  Cannot recall the actual results.  Not impressive in eliminating cleanup as that was my goal.
Reply:

Originally Posted by albrightree

It was a thread from long ago, but the data sheet for the lincoln, or hobart states NOT TO USE SHIELDING GAS, something about preventing the flux from having enough Oxygen to work properly.Here's a Hyundai data sheet for Super 11 , take note of page 2 :  http://www.hyundaiwelding.com/data/f...hield%2011.pdfHere's what Lincoln has to say about it  :    https://www.lincolnelectric.com/en/W...W-S-ElectrodesCheers
Reply:I think the Oxygen reacts with the aluminum for a cleaning action, without the oxygen the aluminum doesn't burn off.   Pretty sure that's why there is so much white smoke and white soot, from the aluminum . I try to keep my head out of the smoke, but it still clouds up my faceshield , and turns my gun white. Its hardly noticeable on my pink 3m filters for my respirator, but shows up greyish on my white 3m facemasks(disposable).It may also be a factor in whether a wire is multi-pass or not.I just guessed you might be using Hyundai or Kobelco over there.Be SafeAirco 250 ac/dc Heliwelder Square waveMiller Synchrowave 180 sdMiller Econo Twin HFLincoln 210 MPDayton 225 ac/dcVictor torchesSnap-On YA-212Lotos Cut60D
Reply:

Originally Posted by albrightree

I think the Oxygen reacts with the aluminum for a cleaning action, without the oxygen the aluminum doesn't burn off.   Pretty sure that's why there is so much white smoke and white soot, from the aluminum . I try to keep my head out of the smoke, but it still clouds up my faceshield , and turns my gun white. Its hardly noticeable on my pink 3m filters for my respirator, but shows up greyish on my white 3m facemasks(disposable).It may also be a factor in whether a wire is multi-pass or not.I just guessed you might be using Hyundai or Kobelco over there.Be Safe
Reply:I've used blue demon MIG, and TIG wires, tungstens, and welding rods without any problems. They're just a re-seller , not a manufacturer , that became popular in the 1990's because they were one of the few companies that offered specialty welding products in smaller reels, and boxes. All their stuff has AWS certs for the standard materials, they also sell some specialty stuff with no ratings for bolt removal, gouging etc. . Strange enough, they list a distributor in Guam, not sure what they are, listed as furniture, and building supplies.Certs :https://weldingmaterialsales.com/cert/10313/Guam distributor  :https://weldingmaterialsales.com/dea...ericana-group/Best RegardsAirco 250 ac/dc Heliwelder Square waveMiller Synchrowave 180 sdMiller Econo Twin HFLincoln 210 MPDayton 225 ac/dcVictor torchesSnap-On YA-212Lotos Cut60D