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Well thanks To Jim Colt thinking it was not the work board that went bad .It was DON'T USE IT LOSE IT SYNDROME.I took the cutter apart the Fourth time yesterday.I determined get the work board out.After taking the Top and 2 sides off and 20 screws out of the work board.It would not come out unless I took the screws out of the bottom.I was afraid of the accordion effect so I stopped there. But did a thorough cleaning and put it back together.This morning I started cutting and and for 2 Hrs it did not stop cutting once.The fan kicked in for the first time after taking it apart 4 times. What ever I did yesterday must have worked.I cut from 20G to 1/4".I think it is Fixed.But will give it a good work out tomorrow to make sure. Again Thanks Jim. I just could not spend that kind of money on a work board.Tony
Reply:My late Dad use to fix electronics as a hobby, and many time he just took apart and put back together and it would work fine, all it takes is a little corrosion or dirt in the wrong spot to cause issues..
Reply:Good to hear you got it working again. Issus like this can be frustrating.Lincoln, ESAB, Thermal Dynamics, Victor, Miller, Dewalt, Makita, Kalamzoo. Hand tools, power tools, welding and cutting tools.
Reply:I think I spoke to soon.I went back down the shop last night and it did it again. I will give it one more try before I list it .I am sure someone with more experience then me can do something with it .
Reply:try spraying all the connections with an electronic safe anti corrosion spray, the smallest tarnish or corrosion you may not see can be causing this..
Reply:
Originally Posted by Hobbytime
try spraying all the connections with an electronic safe anti corrosion spray, the smallest tarnish or corrosion you may not see can be causing this..
Reply:if the board was bad I would think once its toast it wont work again, somewhere is a bad connection, did you check with a magnifying glass for any cracks in the board that could cause an intermittent break in a circuit?
Reply:Another thing you can try that I have run across before: On the PM30's where the gun goes into the case, over a period of time and from use, the torch will get twisted in that area and will constrict the air line resulting in the error lights. Loosen up the strain relief and "untwist" the cable a turn or two. Also, as Duane said in post 3 of your beginning thread, I've replaced several ON/OFF switches on this model due to intermediate and/or total shutdowns. Hypertherm came out with a replacement switch and was different enough that they gave it another p/n because the rear panel that the switch set in had to be replaced also so the switch would fit.
Reply:
Originally Posted by Hobbytime
if the board was bad I would think once its toast it wont work again, somewhere is a bad connection, did you check with a magnifying glass for any cracks in the board that could cause an intermittent break in a circuit?
Reply:
Originally Posted by AGW
Another thing you can try that I have run across before: On the PM30's where the gun goes into the case, over a period of time and from use, the torch will get twisted in that area and will constrict the air line resulting in the error lights. Loosen up the strain relief and "untwist" the cable a turn or two. Also, as Duane said in post 3 of your beginning thread, I've replaced several ON/OFF switches on this model due to intermediate and/or total shutdowns. Hypertherm came out with a replacement switch and was different enough that they gave it another p/n because the rear panel that the switch set in had to be replaced also so the switch would fit.
Reply:Call Hypertherm Tech Support (800) 643-9878. Ask them for the upgraded p/n for the on/off switch and rear panel kit assy for your PM30, have your serial # handy also. Then you'll have to order it through an authorized Hypertherm distributor.Go here to download your service manual https://www.hypertherm.com/en-US/cus...=downloadcountLast edited by AGW; 12-19-2018 at 08:56 AM.
Reply:Well thanks for all the help. I found a Hypertherm Repair center about 15 Miles from here.They want 117.00 to go over the unit.Then a price for repair If I give them the OK.So I think I am going to take it down after the holiday I already got shocked once.That did not feel good. Tony
Reply:
Originally Posted by tonylumps
Well thanks for all the help. I found a Hypertherm Repair center about 15 Miles from here.They want 117.00 to go over the unit.Then a price for repair If I give them the OK.So I think I am going to take it down after the holiday I already got shocked once.That did not feel good. Tony
Reply:
Originally Posted by Hobbytime
I would see how much to ship back to hypertherm direct rather than some 3rd party place looking to make as much $$ off of you, im guessing its out of warranty...
Reply:Think we had a couple of pm30 that had the flashing light problem. Had a hard time getting them to fail. Had to leave them turned on for a while and get hot before they would fail.ended up replacing the power pcb.
Reply:
Originally Posted by ccawgc
Think we had a couple of pm30 that had the flashing light problem. Had a hard time getting them to fail. Had to leave them turned on for a while and get hot before they would fail.ended up replacing the power pcb.
Reply:Well just an update on my PM30 .Took it to a Hyperthermia authorized repair center They said the main board needs to be replaced The Bill would be $1076.00.So I am being very generous by saying I have 4 hours of cutting time on this thing So I paid 1400.00 for the cutter 1000.00 to Repair. That comes to $600.00 an hour of cutting.Now every time i hear the word Hypertherm I get the chills
Reply:
Originally Posted by tonylumps
Well just an update on my PM30 .Took it to a Hyperthermia authorized repair center They said the main board needs to be replaced The Bill would be $1076.00.So I am being very generous by saying I have 4 hours of cutting time on this thing So I paid 1400.00 for the cutter 1000.00 to Repair. That comes to $600.00 an hour of cutting.Now every time i hear the word Hypertherm I get the chills
Reply:It could be a open or cold solder joint that is opening a circuit some where but I don't know how the boards are built and there is not a lot of knowledge being passed around on what is a common failure point if a cold solder is opening a specific circuit. I can remember people using heat to re flow solder on video cards and playstations consoles ect by either using a high heat gun or baking them in the oven for a specified amount of time at specific temperatures. I am not recommending this. I am just saying what people have been known to do with open/cold solder joints when that is what is known to be the issue.Lincoln, ESAB, Thermal Dynamics, Victor, Miller, Dewalt, Makita, Kalamzoo. Hand tools, power tools, welding and cutting tools.
Reply:A cold solder joint on a component on the power supply would be my guess as well. I would pull that board out and go over every solder joint with a magnifying glass looking for tell-tale circular cracks around each solder point. A failed component would not normally resurrect itself for a 2 hour run.Miller Syncrowave 350Millermatic 252/ 30A spoolgunMiller Bobcat 225g w/ 3545 spoolgunLincoln PowerArc4000Lincoln 175 Mig Lincoln 135 Mig Everlast 250EX TigCentury ac/dc 230 amp stickVictor O/AHypertherm 1000 plasma
Reply:Keep your eyes peeled on Ebay... I had the same thing happen to my PM45 .... found a brand new board for 400 bucks... got me back in action...then hypertherm sent me a new board also... so I have a spare.
there are places that repair boards... innovat I think is the name...... But they told me that they could not repair a PM45 board because Hypertherm does not release any schematics or whatever they need to diagnose.... I looked at my old board damn close and I didn't see any loose joints or anything obvious.... anyway, there are about 1000 and I'll be damned if I was gonna spend 3 days poking around with a soldering iron.best of luck.Miller 211Hypertherm PM 451961 Lincoln Idealarc 250HTP 221 True Wisdom only comes from Pain.
Reply:No I had enough of this POS I will sell it for parts Between The gun ,consumables and other extras I should get something out of it .I already replace it with a Eastwood Versa Cut and used the hell out of it for 1/3 the price of this thing.
Reply:Tony I might be interested in the consumablesI think the 30 and the 45 torches are the sameShoot me a PMOr text203-695-1010Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk ProMiller 211Hypertherm PM 451961 Lincoln Idealarc 250HTP 221 True Wisdom only comes from Pain.
Reply:
Originally Posted by John T
Tony I might be interested in the consumablesI think the 30 and the 45 torches are the sameShoot me a PMOr text203-695-1010Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
Reply:
Originally Posted by tonylumps
I don't think they are the same.But just check the Numbers.The PM30 has a small torchI will take some pictures when I get a chance .But First I will try to sell as a package deal .I am waiting for the unit to come back from the repair shop.
Reply:weird. you musta just had bad luck. I beat the crap outta my 30xp for hours on end and it hasn't been any trouble. I got it cheaper than the hobart 27 amp model and used it to cut scrap Ac compressors apart all of last winter and summer until prices got weird. now its just for scrap here and there and occasional welding projects until I get back up and running next winter.
Reply:Actually there are no Finecut consumables for the Powermax30, there is one set of consumables for that unit and they are 30 amp, non shielded consumables. They do not cut thin materials nearly as well as the Finecut consumables that are used on the Duramax torch on the Powermax45xd, 65, 85 and 105 systems. Jim Colt
Originally Posted by John T
Unless your machine is an XP, they should be the same. I have used the PM30 fine cut consumables in my PM45 what do you have? any pics?
Reply:Perhaps I got the terminology wrongBut I know for a fact that I have used PM30 Consumables on my pm45 torchThey screw right on and they certainly cut thin material a lot nicer than the 45 parts There was a chart with the part numbers on this forum somewhereSent from my iPhone using Tapatalk ProMiller 211Hypertherm PM 451961 Lincoln Idealarc 250HTP 221 True Wisdom only comes from Pain.
Reply:The T30v parts I use on thin ....Maybe Im crazy but I feel they cut a lot nicer on very thin material...30 amps or less .
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk ProMiller 211Hypertherm PM 451961 Lincoln Idealarc 250HTP 221 True Wisdom only comes from Pain.
Reply:Yes, the T30 parts (consumables from Powermax30, not 30xp) do work in the original Powermax45 torch, in fact there is a cut chart in the Powermax45 manual that provides cut specs. I only stated that these do not use the technology, therefore do not cut as well on materials thinner than 10 gauge as compared to the Finecut parts that are used in the newer Duramax torch. Many use the T30 ( unshielded, 30 amp) parts in the older Powermax45. I will say that when I used the old style 45 I always had better cut quality with the regular, 45 amp shielded parts all the way down to 26 ga. Longer life, faster speeds were my findings. Jim Colt
Reply:well I just got my PM 30 back from an Authorised Hypertherm service center.For 180.00 they told me when they checked the fault code It showed 2 blinks and that indicated a work board was needed .And that would be 1000.00 and after that there may be other parts needed. Hell I did that my self. So it is on ebay So much for Hypertherms Network of repair.
Reply:
Originally Posted by tonylumps
well I just got my PM 30 back from an Authorised Hypertherm service center.For 180.00 they told me when they checked the fault code It showed 2 blinks and that indicated a work board was needed .And that would be 1000.00 and after that there may be other parts needed. Hell I did that my self. So it is on ebay So much for Hypertherms Network of repair.
Reply:
Originally Posted by N2 Welding
It is a shame how an American company owned by company co-workers feels the need to gouge on parts prices making the machines consumer feel better off buying a new machine from a different company all together.
Reply:While I am not making any excuses for Hypertherm (and I am no longer an employee!) However I thought I would post a few facts regarding this. - The Powermax30 was last manufactured in March of 2014. The unit in question is 5 or maybe as many as 14 years old.- This is an advanced inverter based power supply. The biggest single expense in this unit is the main Power board, as is true with almost all inverter plasma and welders, regardless of origin.-There are two circuit boards in a Powermax30. The Power board has a suggested list price of $740.00. The Control board has a suggested list price of $199.00.- You can download the service manual at the Hypertherm web site for free. The service manual lists all parts, has troubleshooting and also instructions for replacing components, including the Power board.- Hypertherm tech service will provide (free) telephone and email advice, however cannot solve all issues remotely. Hypertherm has a number of remote repair locations with factory trained techs. These sites also work on welders and other related equipment, and are independently owned.- Generally when a product like the Powermax30 is discontinued, an adequate supply of replacement parts (including circuit boards) is inventoried in order to keep the systems running for 5 or more years in the field. The equipment used to manufacturer the boards is either updated to build newer models or is replaced with different equipment....so the same boards can no longer be manufactured. Powermax30 boards will be available for a number of more years.- Most circuit boards used in high volume manufacturing use surface mount technology, generally considered time consuming to troubleshoot and repair on a bench. In most cases the cost of repairing circuit boards is higher than the cost of a new board. Many surface mount components on circuit boards become obsolete after their demand drops......so long term replacements become more difficult.If this Powermax30 had been mine and this failure occurred: 1. I would have troubleshot the issue and determined what needed replacement. If it turned out to be the Power board at $740.00 I would have ordered the board and installed it, then plan for another 5 to 14 years of plasma cutting with a good quality plasma cutter that still has parts available after it has been out of production for 5 years! Try getting a board for most of the low cost imports. There is a difference in cut quality and cut performance between the Powermax30 and similar amperage imports, and there is documentation (service manual), support (free tech service phone and email) and parts availability.I understand that the board seems pricy (though it is $740, not $1000), however that is the single most costly part in the unit which sold for around $1600 when new. In my younger days I had a Lincoln 200 Amp mig that had the wire feed drive circuitry on the main control board. The main drive speed control power transistor kept failing, the only fix was a new board for close to $600 (in the mid 1980's). I found a similar transistor and everytime I would lose wire feed I would spend a few hours pulling the board and soldering on a new $15 transistor. If I calculated the time I spent on repairs I'm pretty sure I could have bought a couple of new boards...and probably would not have the repeat failures.Anyway, that is my response to this string. I tried to help, Hypertherm tried to help, unfortunately we were not successful and the original poster, tonylumps was not willing to spend for a new board, so he opted to purchase another plasma cutter. A better ending would have been nice! Jim Colt
Originally Posted by N2 Welding
It is a shame how an American company owned by company co-workers feels the need to gouge on parts prices making the machines consumer feel better off buying a new machine from a different company all together.
Reply:Thank you for the explanation Jim. My main issue with the prices is what would seem to be the inherent mark up to a suggested retail value. My best guess would be 100% if not more mark up from cost of manufacture. I have no way to confirm this theory on my part. Just a wild hunch.Lincoln, ESAB, Thermal Dynamics, Victor, Miller, Dewalt, Makita, Kalamzoo. Hand tools, power tools, welding and cutting tools.
Reply:There (of course) is a markup. Hypertherm, like most large companies, sells through a dealer network. Hypertherm marks up the things they build, the dealer marks up the things they sell. The markup is nowhere near your guess. It would be nice though if we could all buy things at cost! Hypertherm manufactures here in the USA. The employees (Hypertherm calls them all "associates" because they own the company) get good wages, benefits and stock in the company as the company grows. (instead of sending stock dividends to investors, like publicly owned companies do) No one but the associates can have stock, and when an associate retires , gets fired or otherwise leaves the company the stock is 100% bought back by the company. The profits go back into corporate improvements, improving products, becoming more efficient and more green, not into the hands of someone that has never stepped foot in the buildings. I'd rather pay for products from a company built like Hypertherm.....than one that sends the majority of its profits to wealthy stockholders. Anyway, I understand the issues when a piece of expensive equipment fails, especially in a hobby shop or a small business, I have had a home shop for well over 35 years and have experienced my share as well. Jim Colt
Originally Posted by N2 Welding
Thank you for the explanation Jim. My main issue with the prices is what would seem to be the inherent mark up to a suggested retail value. My best guess would be 100% if not more mark up from cost of manufacture. I have no way to confirm this theory on my part. Just a wild hunch.
Reply:
Originally Posted by jimcolt
While I am not making any excuses for Hypertherm (and I am no longer an employee!) However I thought I would post a few facts regarding this. - The Powermax30 was last manufactured in March of 2014. The unit in question is 5 or maybe as many as 14 years old.- This is an advanced inverter based power supply. The biggest single expense in this unit is the main Power board, as is true with almost all inverter plasma and welders, regardless of origin.-There are two circuit boards in a Powermax30. The Power board has a suggested list price of $740.00. The Control board has a suggested list price of $199.00.- You can download the service manual at the Hypertherm web site for free. The service manual lists all parts, has troubleshooting and also instructions for replacing components, including the Power board.- Hypertherm tech service will provide (free) telephone and email advice, however cannot solve all issues remotely. Hypertherm has a number of remote repair locations with factory trained techs. These sites also work on welders and other related equipment, and are independently owned.- Generally when a product like the Powermax30 is discontinued, an adequate supply of replacement parts (including circuit boards) is inventoried in order to keep the systems running for 5 or more years in the field. The equipment used to manufacturer the boards is either updated to build newer models or is replaced with different equipment....so the same boards can no longer be manufactured. Powermax30 boards will be available for a number of more years.- Most circuit boards used in high volume manufacturing use surface mount technology, generally considered time consuming to troubleshoot and repair on a bench. In most cases the cost of repairing circuit boards is higher than the cost of a new board. Many surface mount components on circuit boards become obsolete after their demand drops......so long term replacements become more difficult.If this Powermax30 had been mine and this failure occurred: 1. I would have troubleshot the issue and determined what needed replacement. If it turned out to be the Power board at $740.00 I would have ordered the board and installed it, then plan for another 5 to 14 years of plasma cutting with a good quality plasma cutter that still has parts available after it has been out of production for 5 years! Try getting a board for most of the low cost imports. There is a difference in cut quality and cut performance between the Powermax30 and similar amperage imports, and there is documentation (service manual), support (free tech service phone and email) and parts availability.I understand that the board seems pricy (though it is $740, not $1000), however that is the single most costly part in the unit which sold for around $1600 when new. In my younger days I had a Lincoln 200 Amp mig that had the wire feed drive circuitry on the main control board. The main drive speed control power transistor kept failing, the only fix was a new board for close to $600 (in the mid 1980's). I found a similar transistor and everytime I would lose wire feed I would spend a few hours pulling the board and soldering on a new $15 transistor. If I calculated the time I spent on repairs I'm pretty sure I could have bought a couple of new boards...and probably would not have the repeat failures.Anyway, that is my response to this string. I tried to help, Hypertherm tried to help, unfortunately we were not successful and the original poster, tonylumps was not willing to spend for a new board, so he opted to purchase another plasma cutter. A better ending would have been nice! Jim Colt
Reply:Did you take a good look at all the capacitors? Any bulging or leaking at the base of the caps?Lincoln, ESAB, Thermal Dynamics, Victor, Miller, Dewalt, Makita, Kalamzoo. Hand tools, power tools, welding and cutting tools.
Reply:I have had it apart about 5 times looking at it and trying somethings that were suggested to try But did not notice any capacitors damaged .But then I did not take the mother board out so I may have missed something .The last time I had it apart I got bit .Forgot to unplug.I am not to savy about electronics like this .So I am afraid if I get the main board out I may not get it back together.
Reply:I'm sure it's too late in the game now, but the service manual has a step-by-step on how to replace the board.
Reply:
Originally Posted by AGW
I'm sure it's too late in the game now, but the service manual has a step-by-step on how to replace the board.
Reply:Don't forget to unplug machine
Lincoln, ESAB, Thermal Dynamics, Victor, Miller, Dewalt, Makita, Kalamzoo. Hand tools, power tools, welding and cutting tools.
Reply:
Originally Posted by tonylumps
No it is never too late .I just ended the listing on Ebay I want to give it one more shot.I feel like this thing beat me.And I don't like the feeling. To get the service manual .Do i have to download from Hypertherm.Thanks Tony
Reply:
Originally Posted by N2 Welding
Don't forget to unplug machine
Reply:
Originally Posted by AGW
Here's the linkhttps://www.hypertherm.com/en-US/cus...ode=Powermax30
Reply:I just got the main board out of the unit.Checked out everything Visially with a magnifying glass.Could not find anything that looked burnt or desoldered in any way As far as checking values.I do not have that expertise.So where do I go from here Do I look for a board.Where do I find one .Does anyone know where to look I just googled it and nothing came up I know it was inspected in 2010 according to an inspection label And according to the color coded wires It is a CSA series.I will try and download some shots Thanks Tony
Attached Images
Reply:all it takes is 1 loose solder joint to cause your issue, since the cutter works for a little then shuts down, it sounds like something making contact then not making contact...get a high powered magnifier and check every single solder joint and or cracks on the printed circuit board...
Reply:I’m no expert on this matter but do you see how the top of the right capacitor is kind of bulging and lumpy looking. Not saying that is the issue but I am hoping someone more experianced with repairs will chime in.Lincoln, ESAB, Thermal Dynamics, Victor, Miller, Dewalt, Makita, Kalamzoo. Hand tools, power tools, welding and cutting tools.
Reply:
Originally Posted by tonylumps
I just got the main board out of the unit.Checked out everything Visially with a magnifying glass.Could not find anything that looked burnt or desoldered in any way As far as checking values.I do not have that expertise.So where do I go from here Do I look for a board.Where do I find one .Does anyone know where to look I just googled it and nothing came up I know it was inspected in 2010 according to an inspection label And according to the color coded wires It is a CSA series.I will try and download some shots Thanks Tony |
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发表于 2021-9-1 23:15:22