ac verses ac/dc

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I'm new to welding and just have a few questions. I have a welding need mostly for farm equipment(small equipment)and small projects. I wish to start with stick welding and would like your opinion on ac only or ac/dc welders. Also 110 verses 220. The two welders that have me interested are Lincoln ac225s($239.00) and hobart 205ac stickmate($229.00).I will welcome your opinions.
Reply:if you have 220 wired to your shop then it is definately worth it to get a 220 machine vs. a 110. 110 loses its oomph real quick when you start welding on thicker pieces (even as thin as 1/4" is a pain, with multi passes).  you probably wont need DC, but it may come in handy later on, so if you can swing a little more it MAY be worth it to you. i assume others will post on this subject that have more experience and better advice.im not familiar with the hobart u mentioned but im sure its a good machine. I have access to a Lincoln ac225 here in the shop and the few times ive needed it i have been very pleased with it.
Reply:Well, from what I've read the Hobart 205 stickmate is 110v and the Lincoln ac225s is 220. I could be wrong on that. I have 220 to my shed and generator. Thank you for your response but I still don't understand the uses for an ac welder verses ac/dc welders. Maybe someone here could explain?
Reply:I do farm stuff all the time.  Most of the metal starts at 1/4 inch and gets thicker fast.  Get the 220v, no question.  110 is good for getting you to the barn...sometimes, but 220 is the only way to go to get a good weld on equipment of any size.  If you are on a tight budget the ac225 will work fine, but having dc really is nice for safety, versitility, and for some rods you might want to use.  If it's in your budget, I'd definately opt for the lincoln ac/dc (or equivilant hobart or miller).  But, for several years, all I had was an ac225 and 6011 and 6013 rods (of differing sizes)...and stuff got fixed.Added info: http://www2.northerntool.com/product..._200304603.htmthe stickmate is 220v also.Miller site, they say it better than I do:"DC welding offers advantages over AC for most Stick applications, including: easier starts; fewer arc outages and sticking; less spatter/better looking welds; easier vertical up and overhead welding; easier to learn "how to weld" and a smoother arc. DC reverse polarity (electrode positive) provides about 10 percent more penetration at a given amperage than AC, while DC straight polarity (electrode negative) welds thinner metals better."Last edited by smithboy; 05-25-2006 at 04:07 PM.Smithboy...if it ain't broke, you ain't tryin'.
Reply:Great timing MRICANE I am looking at buying a petrol powered 4 1n 1 power pack that is made here in OZ, and was wondering if I should spend the extra $440 to get the 220amp DC welder in place of the 200amp AC.http://www.hondaagencies.com.au/content/index.cfm?id=4Simonhttp://members.optusnet.com.au/~abba/index.html
Reply:Go with DC capability; you'll never regret it.  Much larger selection of electrodes and they run smoother with greater penetration in DC+.The Hobart Stickmate series is my preference over the Lincolns because you can fine tune your amperage instead of the multiple taps on the Lincoln.  The Lincoln is still a great and perfectly usable machine, though.For a Stick machine, you need 240V.  120V will not cut the mustard unless you buy an inverter-based power supply, like my Maxstar 150 STH.
Reply:Originally Posted by welder.manI am looking at buying a petrol powered 4 1n 1 power pack that is made here in OZ, and was wondering if I should spend the extra $440 to get the 220amp DC welder in place of the 200amp AC.
Reply:I was where you are about 30 years ago. I started out with a 220v, 230 amp AC welder. It served the purpose for many years. I eventurally got a portable Lincoln which was AC/DC. Then when my cracker box bit the dust I got a good Miller AC/DC for the shop.To start off with I would go with the 220v AC since you are just getting started. Might be able to find a good used one or a good deal on E-Bay. Then take the rest of your money and get you a good Oxy/Acetelyne torch set, you will need it also. Get some books and learn to weld with both you will be glad you did.I have a farm also and you will probably be dealing mostly with mild steel. A good 3/32" or 1/8" E6011 will do anything you need to do. Then when you get proficient you can step up to an AC/DC rig. If money is no problem get the AC/DC now. Some rods for some metals work best on AC, some work best on DC straight polarity and some work best on DC reverse polarity and some can go either way.Like I said before, just to get started, you could do it with an AC rig. Just remember like anything else you have to crawl before you can walk. If you do get an AC rig remember the safety factor someone else mentioned. An AC rig can bit you from both ends. Never assume that ground clamp will not hurt you. Back when I had my AC rig I was standing on a wet concrete floor and the best I can remember I grabbed that ground clamp without gloves and it bit me. If I didn't have some sort of resistance to electricity (or the Good Lord was watching out for me) I would be dead. Always remember these rigs you either have low voltage and high amps or high amps and low voltage. In either situation the key word is amps. It only takes about 5 milliamps to stop the human heart and muscles start contracting at about 4 milliamps. I'm not trying to scare you, but I have heard of several instances over the years im my area where someone was electocuted with a crackerbox. Just remember safety, safety, and safety.Good luck
Reply:Thanks for all the info! I never really thought about safety, I guess it's important.
Reply:I'm on a farm, and ditto the comments regarding 240V welder and go for AC/DC if you can.  I can't think of the last time that I used AC on stick - it seems that everything I do is DC Reverse polarity.
Reply:Most of the posters have covered the basics here so this may not help much.    I grew up in farm country and just about every farm in the area had a welder, if purchased new they where offten Lincoln buzz boxes.    There is nothing fragile or light with regards to farm equipment and the conditions aren't usually that good either so a goood stick welder is needed.First off do not even consider a 110 volt AC welder they simply won't cut the mustard.    So X all of those off your list.Second; for a stationary installation a 220 volt AC welder is required.    Both the Lincoln and the Miller buzz boxes wll do the job.    Do get one with DC output.    If you have the electrical capability and this is a stationary installation, I'd seriously thing about getting a bit more power than a buzz boxx would offer.   Mainly because the duty cycles suck on DC, like 20% at 150 amps.    That of course depends on what you are doing, but I've seen some farmers spend considerable effort on fabrications such as wagons, elevators, fences, and other itens.   Just as many don't go to that depth of course.Third; if the cash flow permits you should seriously consider gettting an engine driven welder.    Not so much for more poer but rather for portability.   It is often easier to patch something up in the field and to get it back to the shed than it is to drag in broken back to the shop.     Yes a bit more expensives and no where near as cheap welding but something to consider depending on your failures.   The extra cost might be justifiable if you also consder it a backup generator.Fourth;  it would be difficult to go into all the whys and why nots of DC capability, so I will glose over.    Realize first that you can do a lot or most of the repairs on farm equipment with an AC welder,    Farmers have been doing that for years.    DC though gives you more options in the electrodes you can use and how you can use them.    Considering the life span of a buzz box the cost of DC capability is pretty cheap.thanksDave
Reply:I started with the lincoln ac225. thought I was great. One day i got on a dc rig. I was good enough to be a shipbuilder. sold the ac rig that afternoon and bought a Dc rig. If god help I will never weld AC again. On a dc rig your weld will be 200% better overnight. splatter is way down, heat is lower. dosent tire you out.  you can get dc rods almost free. For the extra $100 on a lincoln ac/dc 225 its a no brainer.I know you want the cheaper machine but you willl be swaping it out for a dc machine within a year. dont believe me, weld on a dc machine before you buy.
Reply:The DC machine is the way to go.  The only time you would want to use AC is if you are getting sever arc blow.DennisThermal Arc 185-TSWMillermatic Challenger 172VictorO/AAtlas Craftsman 12 by 24 LatheEsab PCM-875Wholesalem Tool Mill-Drill