Question about plate to pipe

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Was curious what was the strongest way to weld a tab or section of plate to a piece of pipe, the method on the left or the right?I read up on zap's method of centering plate on pipe and will go through with that way if it is deemed the stronger method. But all things being equal (distance-wise), it is better to weld the plate to the side of the pipe?Or will either method work and I'm just over-thinking?This will be implimented in a twin-stick shifter arrangement for something and I'd like it to have as little deflection as possible. Thanks.Cheers,Pat Attached Images
Reply:For as "little deflection as possible" the view on the right would be best. That is as long as it was welded on both sides of the junction. That would effectively turn a wide straight into an angle.Anything worth doing is worth doing RIGHT
Reply:I would think that the one on the right would give more room to move since there is a void between the weldments, hence giving the 'tab' room to move in between the welds.  But I suppose it all depends on the scale that you are talking.Common sense in an uncommon degree is what the world calls wisdom.
Reply:I think I like the one on the left, but I am not sure of the picture.  If it has a weld all the way around the pipe, it should be strongest.DavidReal world weldin.  When I grow up I want to be a tig weldor.
Reply:Gentlemen, I re-submit for your approval, and early-morning mspaint schematic.I do apologize about the quality of the work. I didn't have time to load up SolidWorks The one of the left has the ear welded in the center of the rod, the one on the right is essentially welded with the piece on the side of the rod. Both can be made to achieve the same task, but I'd assume one would have to be stronger than the other. Which, is the question.Consider there is a weld on the entire perimeter of the contact surfaces between plate and rod. Scale is slightly larger than what you may see on your screen (the tab or "ear" is roughly 1.50"x3.00", the rod is .50" solid bar) Attached Images
Reply:What sizes?And what are you trying to hold?Me!
Reply:It depends how the thing is loaded. I think that in MOST cases, if the weld is done well, there won't be much difference. For real thin wall, the one on the right will be a little better under some loadings, since the weld will encompass a larger area of the tube wall, but the weld will be tougher to do and likely to end up with more distortion.
Reply:I vote left......zap!I am not completely insane..Some parts are missing Professional Driver on a closed course....Do not attempt.Just because I'm a  dumbass don't mean that you can be too.So DON'T try any of this **** l do at home.
Reply:If appearence matter the one on the left will allways look better. I believe the left will left will be stronger also.
Reply:is it possible to slit the bar and have the tab slide into it?  that way you can weld it up on both sides of the bar and won't have to worry about the weld breaking.
Reply:Originally Posted by EnderGentlemenScale is slightly larger than what you may see on your screen (the tab or "ear" is roughly 1.50"x3.00", the rod is .50" solid bar)
Reply:The shifter is not for a manual, it is for a transfer case (NP203) which will only see, at tops, 3-4 shifts a week.I think I've decided to go with the tab on the center of the bar, but I'm still eagerly anticipating hearing some other opinions.
Reply:If you weld the tab to the center of the bar (LEFT) it will be as strong as can be.   Probably more practical too.David.Real world weldin.  When I grow up I want to be a tig weldor.
Reply:Originally Posted by rusty rippleis it possible to slit the bar and have the tab slide into it?  that way you can weld it up on both sides of the bar and won't have to worry about the weld breaking.
Reply:Its not " what weldment would be stronger " its how well the welder & weldor can weld and the proper penetration of the weldment .For what your doing both will work well above your needs. If the welder and weldor are not an issue go for what works best for your set up..
Reply:Either one is fine.Deflection? Is the NP 203 prone to deflection induced failure?The only thing that counts is fitment.Deciding on a shifter knob to use is way more important.You did not mention what this will be installed in. Yugo, perhaps?Call a doubler friendly shop.jmoCity of L.A. Structural; Manual & Semi-Automatic;"Surely there is a mine for silver, and a place where gold is refined. Iron is taken from the earth, and copper is smelted from ore."Job 28:1,2Lincoln, Miller, Victor & ISV BibleDanny
Reply:Tangler,To answer some of your points:The cast-iron cased 203 is not prone to any sort of deflection what so ever, unless you were to drop it out of the back of a DC-10 and it decided to land on a piece of 5" thick plate steel from 30K feet... My concern of deflection is that the shifters are not going to be directly mounted on the transfer case, they will be stationed a foot away on a bracket (3/8") mounted to the front of the case. The point of deflection, if there will be any, will be the joint between the new "ears" that attach to the shift forks (also 3/8") and the solid rod. Want to make sure the weld is nice and strong and has no chance of "warble"Shifter knobs will be 8-balls with the top 1/2" machined off and a threaded insert in the underside.No Yugo here, boss. This mod will be performed on a 78 Dodge pickup. After this will be turning the rock-solid NP435 4 speed from the "4 foot shift from 1st to 2nd" into a slightly shorter throw threw geometry and linkage.I'm not currently using the 203 as a double, its my standalone t-case. The single stock shifter handles the double-duty of not only shifting the case from HI-N-LO but also from a Locked internal differential to an unlocked internal differential. I'll be splitting it up and giving each task one stick.
Reply:In no particular order:Given equally skilled machining and welding, the one on the right will be generally stronger (the weld beads have a greater straddle across the tube/pipe/rod/bar and hence have a greater resisting strength to certain loadings)."can't slit solid bar".  Sure you can, it's called a milling machine with an end mill or a slitting cutter, almost like cutting a keyway in a shaft.  But there would generally be no reason to go to the trouble and expense of milling a slot in the bar to put the plate into just to weld it all up.  Fit it up and weld it, no milling needed.  Unless you want to show off your milling skills or have a need to have a single plate pass through the slot in the bar and thus have ears on both sides of the bar.Note that changing linkage lever arms around may have an effect on the needed muscle power needed to shift.  Long linkage lever means less muscle needed but a longer shift throw.  Short lever does the opposite.
Reply:I guess I'm confused. I dunno if you're gonna use an elongated solid shift lever, or are you setting up linkages. The weldment will come down to the basics of the process you use, but prep is nearly the same across the board. Clean metal = best weld. Tack evenly and weld in the proper sequence to counter heat distortion.(Darn, I want to see someone build a TTC Yugo contender!)City of L.A. Structural; Manual & Semi-Automatic;"Surely there is a mine for silver, and a place where gold is refined. Iron is taken from the earth, and copper is smelted from ore."Job 28:1,2Lincoln, Miller, Victor & ISV BibleDanny
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Reply:Ender,Either should work well for your application.  But, from strength of materials standpoint here are my observations:Bar attached to centerline of rod:  If loading is in the plane of the plate the load will be transferred to the bar concentrically and not produce any twisting.  Therefore, no lateral deflection.  Weldability may be a bit easier since you could machine the edge of the bar to the diameter of the rod and then fillet weld all around or run a filler into the gap and then fillet.Bar attached to side of rod:  Loading in the plane of the bar will produce twisting of the bar.  Depending on the amount of force and length of bar this twisting may be so small it is not a concern.  Assuming the same size of bar a lateral load on this arrangement will produce less twisting since the bar centerline will be closer to the rod centerline.  Weld will need to be a flare bevel grove weld on both sides of the bar.  May be a little tight?  Or not an issue.Derek
Reply:I like number one, looks clean. Give it a bevel and a good weld it is'nt going anywhere.Disclaimer; "I am just an a$$hole welder, don't take it personally ."