price quoting for tig welding question

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I did a search but i couldnt come up with much on this topic. i was hoping you guys could give me some insight as to how i can go about pricing my tig work. i am a self employed fabricator and i have been working out of my residential garage for a while. i am still not sure how to fairly price small tig welding jobs. by fair i mean for the customer and for myself. i want to offer a good price but not charge as much as a professional company and at the same time i do not want to undercut myself. my question is: is there a rule of thumb for figuring out a general price for small tig welding jobs? such as price per inch of weld and type of metal or by the estimated amount of time it will take? i usually weld automotive parts. any suggestions and advice will be greatly appreciated. thank you.
Reply:i usually charge 40.00 an hour plus materials with a 50.00 minimum and i charge 60 an hour for after hours thats pretty reasonable around hereComplete Fabrication Shop specializing in pipe fabrication. Also offering heavy steel fabrication and sheet metal work.
Reply:My Mig/Tig rate is $67 hr, plus materials.
Reply:For fixing broken brackets and such, $40 an hr plus consumables is fair. If you are having to make artwork out of it, then be sure to charge for the entire amount of time spent on the project.And then, after so much work...... you have it in your hand, and you look over to your side...... and the runner has run off. Leaving you holding the prize, wondering when the runner will return.
Reply:$1 per minute $20 minimum here in east TN.. I do mostly smaller jobs, little brackets,  aluminum stuff etc.. Stainless or Cast I charge a little more, to offset the cost of filler materials and clean up / prep time.. I try to make sure for engine parts or greasy / dirty that they at least pressure wash the parts first.. If not its just that much harder on tig gloves wire brushes and abrasives etc.. Some guys charge more, I just can't see charging $40-$60 for a cast aluminum bracket that needs 1 1/2" of weld.. To each there own though..Carl
Reply:your comments help alot, thank you guys for the info. if anyone else has anymore suggestions i would like to hear them. i think i have a decent idea now. thanks again.
Reply:Decide on your hourly rate. Check other shops in the area so you can be competetive.Then have a minimum charge. Like a  15 minute minumum.Always treat the customer with respect. it is not their fault they do not know all about welding. You have to cultivate and educate the customers in your area.You charge for the amount of time to clean the part. For preparing it to be welded,including grinding, assembly, clamping etc.,. Let the customer know that if they bring in a filthy greasy part that you will be charging your hourly rate for the cleaning. Just say to the customer that if they clean the weldment it costs less. You cannot weld a part untill it is clean. If it is not clean you may miss a crack or or some kind of fitting clue.Your materials like, gas, filler rod and electricity.Always get the customers address,and phone number and get them to sign a standard shop agreement.Here is what can go wrong:The customer leaves the part. does not come back for 3 months. Storage fees.The customer comes to pick up the part and says they do not think it is worth what you charge. Small claims court charges.The customer wants you to weld a part that is illegal to weld....Like a prop spinner for an airplane.You are not responsible for repainting welded repairs.Do not make a window guard without a inside fire escape lock devise.Never weld non weldable rebar. Needs the C60 stamp on the end of the rebar.The list goes on.NEVER charge more for a job than a rough estimate you have given.Try not to give rough estimates unless you are absolutely sure.Last edited by Donald Branscom; 11-02-2008 at 01:32 AM.AWS certified welding inspectorAWS certified welder
Reply:Originally Posted by Donald BranscomDecide on your hourly rate. Check other shops in the area so you can be competetive.Then have a minimum charge. Like a  15 minute minumum.Always treat the customer with respect. it is not their fault they do not know all about welding. You have to cultivate and educate the customers in your area.You charge for the amount of time to clean the part. For preparing it to be welded,including grinding, assembly, clamping etc.,. Let the customer know that if they bring in a filthy greasy part that you will be charging your hourly rate for the cleaning. Just say to the customer that if they clean the weldment it costs less. You cannot weld a part untill it is clean. If it is not clean you may miss a crack or or some kind of fitting clue.Your materials like, gas, filler rod and electricity.Always get the customers address,and phone number and get them to sign a standard shop agreement.Here is what can go wrong:The customer leaves the part. does not come back for 3 months. Storage fees.The customer comes to pick up the part and says they do not think it is worth what you charge. Small claims court charges.The customer wants you to weld a part that is illegal to weld....Like a prop spinner for an airplane.You are not responsible for repainting welded repairs.Do not make a window guard without a inside fire escape lock devise.Never weld non weldable rebar. Needs the C60 stamp on the end of the rebar.The list goes on.NEVER charge more for a job than a rough estimate you have given.Try not to give rough estimates unless you are absolutely sure.
Reply:I would be very wary of liability issues for any parts welded up in a garage where you charge for it.  Make sure your standard agreement specifically states the part is nopt guaranteed to have any structural integrity and part is not a component of any safety devise, and post that information in BIG lettering all over your receiving desk.I can imagine building a shop table and having some customers wife use it for a scaffold and tripping on a clamp you added-  your home-owners insurance won't cover anything you build for sale!
Reply:Great discussion here http://www.millerwelds.com/resources...=labor+pricingFind a community college and take a class on basic business. To know how much to charge is the biggest question any business faces, figure it wrong and you go broke.The first step is to calculate your real expenses.
Reply:Good advice.When i do welding jobs i ALWAYS ask what the part is for, and what does it do.Also ask who it is for. Sometimes the person that brings you the job is only a messenger.Many times I call the end user and find out there was missing information the messenger did not give me. Like the weldment was for a (fill in the blank- surprise).Sometimes you find out the part broke because it was not strong enough in the first place.Last edited by Donald Branscom; 11-02-2008 at 12:00 PM.AWS certified welding inspectorAWS certified welder
Reply:One of my customers gives me a pice and asks for a per piece price.  I tig it, figure my time. If I get the job, I pulsed spray them if I can and I make better money.OR its a buck a minute.....David Real world weldin.  When I grow up I want to be a tig weldor.
Reply:Having someone tell you how much they charge tells you next to nothing, unless they are in your community and doing the same work your are doing.  Look at who you are competing with. If the competition is all big established shops, with well developed relationships with suppliers, you will  not be able to compete by lowering your price. They are buying at materials and supplies at a price level you won't see for years to come. So what you have to offer is SERVICE. SERVICE: you act quicker, provide better quality, focus on one project at a time. For this service you charge a premium. If the competition is other guys in garages with day jobs.....? Not gona happen so ...
Reply:i am well versed in business, i just wasnt sure on the average tig pricing. asking you guys on the internet is easier than calling all the local shops to get a b.s. price quote. also, i am not an attorney so i am not comfortable writing my own contracts but i guess i will have to do some research and get it done myself. thanks for the pointers, guys. i really do appreciate the information. i am off to the garage!
Reply:Originally Posted by turboitalli am well versed in business,
Reply:NEVER do piecework !They will just take that stuff you welded and sell it for 10 times what you got paid.The businessman who got you to do that will get all the money and he does no work except for making a few phone calls. Bunch of @^%#$%$$%!!!!!!!!!This is not a third world country yet.AWS certified welding inspectorAWS certified welder
Reply:Here is the contract.Customer will pay for the job in cash when the job is completed.Customer will pick up the job within the time frame agreed to, otherwise there will be a storage fee of  $10.00 per day charged. This is not a junk yard. The customer will be contacted at the end of the time ageed to, and if there is no response with in 72 hours then  storage fees will be charged.If the customer dies while the job is being completed no storage fees will be charged for 30 days. After 30 days the job will be discarded if not picked up and paid for in the time agreed to.We are not responsible for any losses caused by the use of the weldment.We will not weld any job that is suspect. We will determine what is suspect.Customers will not enter into the shop area unless escorted by a shop person.The customer is responsible for transport of their project.The customer is required to give all information about the weldment or repair that they know at the time they drop off the project. If the project is for another person or business that will also be disclosed at the time of drop off.The customer will disclose what the weldment is and how it will be used at the time of drop off.The customer will be responsible for treating the weldment for corrosion protectionimmediately after recieving the weldment unless we determine that the weldment needs special corrosion protection.We are not responsible for corrosion or stress damage to the weldment do to the welment being placed in close proximity to disssimular metals or salt water. If the weldment is for salt water use the customer must disclose that information at the time of drop off.Any NEW weldment for salt water use above or below the waterline will be constructed of new materials.All aircraft parts will only be welded if the Welding procedures have been established and approved by the FAA or a labratory approved by the FAA. The manufaturer of the part may be consulted as to the metal used to make the part.WE sill not weld any aircraft part not recommended to be welded or above the technical level of our shop. Only new materials will be used for new parts.We will not weld sailboat rigging parts under tension.We will not weld non weldable rebar.The customer will pay for all legal costs.We will not pay penalty costs for jobs not done on time due to strikes,wars,death,or any circumstance beyond our control.We will not do any special finishing of metal unless specified in the initial agreement.If the weldment is for the goverment, there will be an extra fee if the weldment is not drawn or engineered properly. (After all the people of this country should get good service and products). Fee to be agreed on at the time of drop off.If the weldment is a prototype and is going to be manufactured we will need to know so the proper actions can be determined about the weldments construction and assembly.Keep adding onto this agreement every time you get burned.AWS certified welding inspectorAWS certified welder
Reply:Nothing wrong with piecework, if you bid it right.   Figure out what it costs to make, if you get many, then easy enough to find efficiencies and time-savers along the way, if you gotta make more of the same item.  Try to beat your bid.   You can actually make 2-3 times your normal hourly rate, if you bid the job right.Best thing for anybody in this position (the OP) to do, buy a time-clock, every time you handle the job, punch in first, then punch out when finished with whatever operation, separate card for every job, whether thinking and engineering, cutting metal, or actually welding.   Or even moving steel around for the job, sweeping the floor afterwards, whatever.   Don't forget time on the phone ordering metal or parts, and time spent, doing the paperwork.  You will see, very fast, why many shops, and many businesses of all types, have a "minimum charge".  And you would be surprised, many of the big shops, do exactly this, the time-card goes with the job thru the shop.Last edited by mark8310; 11-02-2008 at 05:11 PM.
Reply:Originally Posted by mark8310Nothing wrong with piecework, if you bid it right.   Figure out what it costs to make, if you get many, then easy enough to find efficiencies and time-savers along the way, if you gotta make more of the same item.  Try to beat your bid.   You can actually make 2-3 times your normal hourly rate, if you bid the job right.Best thing for anybody in this position (the OP) to do, buy a time-clock, every time you handle the job, punch in first, then punch out when finished with whatever operation, separate card for every job, whether thinking and engineering, cutting metal, or actually welding.   Or even moving steel around for the job, sweeping the floor afterwards, whatever.   Don't forget time on the phone ordering metal or parts, and time spent, doing the paperwork.  You will see, very fast, why many shops, and many businesses of all types, have a "minimum charge".  And you would be surprised, many of the big shops, do exactly this, the time-card goes with the job thru the shop.
Reply:Originally Posted by mark8310Nothing wrong with piecework, if you bid it right.   Figure out what it costs to make, if you get many, then easy enough to find efficiencies and time-savers along the way, if you gotta make more of the same item.  Try to beat the bid.   You can actually make 2-3 times your normal hourly rate, if you bid the job right.Best thing for anybody in this position (the OP) to do, buy a time-clock, every time you handle the job, punch in first, then punch out when finished with whatever operation, whether thinking and engineering, cutting metal, or actually welding.   Or even moving steel around for the job, sweeping the floor afterwards, whatever.   Don't forget time on the phone ordering metal or parts, and time spent, doing the paperwork.  You will see, very fast, why many shops, and many businesses of all types, have a "minimum charge".
Reply:Originally Posted by Knotbored Make sure your standard agreement specifically states the part is nopt guaranteed to have any structural integrity !
Reply:Originally Posted by turboitalli am well versed in business, !
Reply:i guess this forum is full of dramatic egotistical maniacs just like the rest of the internet. who are you to tell me what i do or do not know? just because i am not an expert in this industry doesnt mean i dont know anything about business. how do you know im not calling shops around the area and asking on the internet as well? maybe im doing many different things and you only see one of them. i dont want any more information in this thread, it is turning into a highschool girls locker room in here. everything that has been said in this thread i already knew, i was just being nice to the people that put up the effort to help me out. i was hoping to walk away with some information that i wasnt aware of but now i see that this is not going to happen. so please dont waste your time on telling me that i dont know business. thankyou for the people that commented who were sincerely giving good information. good day.
Reply:Well dude, you're the one who ask the question. If you're such a high powered businessman, then figure your own stinkin rates for crying out loud. It's not hard. I'm not one of the names you called me. I am a guy who has made his sole living by running my welding business for over 16 years now. I certainly can't set your rates, I don't know your local economy and I don't know your costs. If I did then I could set a very competitive range of rates for you but being the big business boy you are you already knew that, huh?Typical whining internet weenie, wants everyone to do his homework for him.Idiot.JTMcC.
Reply:Originally Posted by turboitalli guess this forum is full of dramatic egotistical maniacs just like the rest of the internet. who are you to tell me what i do or do not know? just because i am not an expert in this industry doesnt mean i dont know anything about business. how do you know im not calling shops around the area and asking on the internet as well? maybe im doing many different things and you only see one of them. i dont want any more information in this thread, it is turning into a highschool girls locker room in here. everything that has been said in this thread i already knew, i was just being nice to the people that put up the effort to help me out. i was hoping to walk away with some information that i wasnt aware of but now i see that this is not going to happen. so please dont waste your time on telling me that i dont know business. thankyou for the people that commented who were sincerely giving good information. good day.Originally Posted by mark8310Nothing wrong with piecework, if you bid it right.   Figure out what it costs to make, if you get many, then easy enough to find efficiencies and time-savers along the way, if you gotta make more of the same item.  Try to beat your bid.   You can actually make 2-3 times your normal hourly rate, if you bid the job right.Best thing for anybody in this position (the OP) to do, buy a time-clock, every time you handle the job, punch in first, then punch out when finished with whatever operation, separate card for every job, whether thinking and engineering, cutting metal, or actually welding.   Or even moving steel around for the job, sweeping the floor afterwards, whatever.   Don't forget time on the phone ordering metal or parts, and time spent, doing the paperwork.  You will see, very fast, why many shops, and many businesses of all types, have a "minimum charge".  And you would be surprised, many of the big shops, do exactly this, the time-card goes with the job thru the shop.
Reply:Originally Posted by turboitallI did a search but i couldnt come up with much on this topic. i was hoping you guys could give me some insight as to how i can go about pricing my tig work. i am a self employed fabricator and i have been working out of my residential garage for a while. i am still not sure how to fairly price small tig welding jobs. by fair i mean for the customer and for myself. i want to offer a good price but not charge as much as a professional company and at the same time i do not want to undercut myself. my question is: is there a rule of thumb for figuring out a general price for small tig welding jobs? such as price per inch of weld and type of metal or by the estimated amount of time it will take? i usually weld automotive parts. any suggestions and advice will be greatly appreciated. thank you.
Reply:Originally Posted by turboitallI did a search but i couldnt come up with much on this topic. i was hoping you guys could give me some insight as to how i can go about pricing my tig work. i am a self employed fabricator and i have been working out of my residential garage for a while. i am still not sure how to fairly price small tig welding jobs. by fair i mean for the customer and for myself. i want to offer a good price but not charge as much as a professional company and at the same time i do not want to undercut myself. my question is: is there a rule of thumb for figuring out a general price for small tig welding jobs? such as price per inch of weld and type of metal or by the estimated amount of time it will take? i usually weld automotive parts. any suggestions and advice will be greatly appreciated. thank you.
Reply:Say what you want, I make money on piecework.  Enough to buy a positioner so I can do more piecework.  Its nice sitting on a stool welding all day.David Real world weldin.  When I grow up I want to be a tig weldor.