wire feed problem - millermatic 210

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So, I've got a Millermatic 210.  Bought it new a few years ago.  I generally only weld heavier stuff, so I ignored this problem when I first bought it figuring I wouldn't be using .023 wire.Here it is:  When I attempt to use .023 wire, it always wraps up around the rollers.  I do have the .023 rollers on and I just replaced the line, so there aren't any kinks.  Any ideas.  I can feed the wire through to the tip, but as soon as I strike an arc the wire kinks up and wraps around the rollers.
Reply:It's called a 'birds nest', and yep, it can be a real pain. That .023 can be pretty subject to birds nesting depending on the setup and manufacture. One question, have you had any decent weld times at all with it so far or is this an every time affair?
Reply:it is my understanding from my friends welder that you need to use the .023 liner.  you will run into problems running an .30-35 liner.
Reply:Sandy - Thanks for the reply; It happens everytime.  Very frustrating.  I have never been able to get a run with .023.  I only tried it in the past to experiment though, so it wasn't a big deal.  I usually am welding 1/4" and up, but I am trying to do some panel work on a car (which I have no bodywork experience as it is!) and this is only making it worse!!!I'll have to check and see if there is a separate liner for .023.  Hopefully that will solve the problem cause I've tried everything else; Roller tension, new liner, new tips, etc...Thanks again
Reply:I just put some .023 in my Miller 252. I had to change to a .023 liner along with the .023 rolls, otherwise it would birdsnest. The liners are available. I actually just ended up getting a whole separate gun to run the .023, so I don't have to bother with swapping liners (my "main" gun is a 25 ft Profax, I couldn't find a 25' .023 liner anyway... I bought a 15 ft HTP gun with the .023 liner for the Miller). Runs .023 fine now.The soldering toys pay for the welding toys.Hakko 928 dual iron, 4xHakko 936Madell 850D Hot Air SMT ReworkMiller 252, HTP Invertig 201 AC/DC, and a Hypertherm 45.
Reply:Great to know.  Thanks a lot for the advice.  I never would have though a bigger liner would cause bird nesting.  Looks like I'll be spending a few bucks to fix this problem.  Thx
Reply:Originally Posted by trevGreat to know.  Thanks a lot for the advice.  I never would have though a bigger liner would cause bird nesting.  Looks like I'll be spending a few bucks to fix this problem.  Thx
Reply:It sounds to me like you're burning it back into the tip, then after that the bird nesting occurs.  If that's the case, you need to increase the wire speed or decrease the voltage.I definately agreee, run an .023-specific liner, tip and drive roll with the .023 wire.  The bigger liner allows the wire to 'snake' inside the liner and feed erraticaly, which could cause it to burn back into the tip when it slows down when snaking and tend to want to stub out when it un-snakes.   I haven't noticed this problem in a 10 foot torch yet, but it is noticeable in a 15 foot torch.MM350P/Python/Q300MM175/Q300DialarcHFHTP MIG200PowCon300SMHypertherm380ThermalArc185Purox oaF350CrewCab4x4LoadNGo utilitybedBobcat250XMT304/Optima/SpoolmaticSuitcase12RC/Q300Suitcase8RC/Q400Passport/Q300Smith op
Reply:Glad I read this thread,having a second gun with a different liner(great idea) is what I'm going to get when I get ahold of a millermatic,I hope you get it worked out,trevDrink a Guinness Draught....Millermatic 140Do you still rememberDecember's foggy freeze --when the ice thatclings on to your beard isscreaming agony.
Reply:Increase the wire speed/make sure the hose is not looped and all over the place.I make sure mine oges straight or a gradual bend as best as possible.Tighten up the tension just a bit more than you usually do.I use .024 like that and really don't have alot of problems for the most part.Make sure the tip is clean.Good Luck
Reply:A couple additional points:1) Make sure the gun's "plug" inis perfectly aligned and almost into the rollers. If there is any gap, that is where the birdnesting occurs. Typically caused by burnback as mentioned. 2) Put a new .023 tip on even though you may have just done that. If you had significant burnback, the obstruction may cause this repeatedly.3) Do NOT over tighten the drive rollers. This will force any obstruction into a bridnesting situation. You will want to rollers to feed just enough but not "force" the wire.Granthttp://jackalopefab.com/MM210Synchrowave 200DXMiller XMT350 w/60series feederMiller Bobcat 250 with SGA 100 and spoolgunHTP PlasmaFull Machine shop with everything