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Ok so ive posted a couple threads about this, but im just wondering about another thing now. Im going for my associates like ive stated in other threads, but i  will be finished with all the welding required but my academics will not be completed. so the question thats been bugging me is, are most people really honestly worried about the science and history bs or just really want proof that you can weld and pass there test and what not?Ive been wondering and its annoying me lol so just give me you 2cent on the topic.
Reply:Depends where you want to be in 10 years.Competency in math, geometry, a little trig, some algebra, blueprint reading, reading & writing is needed to be a real fabricator--opening lots of doors for you.Developing a capacity for independent thought serves one well. Simply knowing how to lay beads, without being able to fit up, etc.--relegates youto the bottom of the stack.Blackbird
Reply:well im not saying i wont take those things. just saying for right now can u get a job doing a lil welding. it would take no time to finish the academics or a few semestersWhile have some print reading and fitting skills already too. just wanting to do a lil welding and make a lil extra money while finishing the math/english coursesLast edited by k20beast; 03-21-2010 at 05:02 PM.
Reply:If you don't finish it now, it won't ever be finished.  I've tried to continue on with my education, but lack of time or family/job needs outweighed the education.Start fabbing some small parts in your garage & sell them on craigslist.  Or work part time in a fab shop.MarkI haven't always been a nurse........Craftsman 12"x36" LatheEnco G-30B MillHobart Handler 175Lincoln WeldandPower 225 AC/DC G-7 CV/CCAdd a Foot Pedal to a Harbor Freight Chicago Electric 165A DC TIG PapaLion's Gate Build
Reply:yea thats basically what im wondering. would it be an issue to work part time at a fab shop maybe makin like 10hr or so, idk whats average? thats really all im wondering so like you said i can finish my school
Reply:Well, considering the grammar and spelling in your last few posts, you should probably stay in school a little longer. Sorry, but I'm just being honest. You are wondering how far you will go in the welding world while you can hardly piece together a complete sentence, I think the answer is obvious. The truth is any monkey can get a job burning steel, if thats all you want then go ahead a drop out.
Reply:Welds ive completed so far in school are, Stick filler/ full penitration all postions, tig and mig fillet all postions. stick plate test passed, some basic print reading and now doing stick on pipe, and of course some oxy acetylene experience.   So is that realistic to work part time at a fab shop?thanks for any help!
Reply:Im not going to use proper grammar on forums, im on forums all the time so im not so worried about spelling or making complete sentences on here. so thats an unnecessary post.Edit* and im finishing school anyways so thats not a correct answer to the question at allLast edited by k20beast; 03-21-2010 at 07:06 PM.
Reply:Originally Posted by k20beastyea thats basically what im wondering. would it be an issue to work part time at a fab shop maybe makin like 10hr or so, idk whats average? thats really all im wondering so like you said i can finish my school
Reply:umm yea? part time at a fab shop with the skills i have now?Or maybe your just the dumbest person thats replied to me on forums?
Reply:What "skills" are you talking about? Your communication skills, then no, you won't be able to get a job flipping burgers. Your welding skills? How the heck would any of us know? Because you 'completed' the welds you listed off doesn't mean anything. Anybody with 10 minutes of instruction can run those. To master all of them will take a lifetime. You are no doubt somewhere in between, but who knows where. Can you get a job at a fab shop? How the heck would any of us know? It's unlikely any fab shops in your area are looking for inexperienced helpers (thats what you are) right now, but if they were we'd have no way of knowing because we don't even know where you live. If you want a job why don't you just go apply, rather than making a post on a welding forum? Do you really have so little confidence that you need a bunch of faceless posters telling you to 'go for it'? Or do you not really want a job? And by the way, you got the answer to your question in the very first reply.
Reply:ill be in san antonio which im no where near right now so i cant go look for jobs. your thinking to deep, im just asking if some fab shops hire people that can weld but haven't been welding for years. im not talking about making a lot of money while i finish school.
Reply:Just depends on the shop.  Some hire part timer's, some don't.  Some won't even talk to you unless you have an established relationship as a customer with them.Basically, you just need to get the Yellow Pages out & let your fingers do the walking.  Sell yourself, that's what needs done.MarkI haven't always been a nurse........Craftsman 12"x36" LatheEnco G-30B MillHobart Handler 175Lincoln WeldandPower 225 AC/DC G-7 CV/CCAdd a Foot Pedal to a Harbor Freight Chicago Electric 165A DC TIG PapaLion's Gate Build
Reply:Originally Posted by k20beastill be in san antonio which im no where near right now so i cant go look for jobs. your thinking to deep, im just asking if some fab shops hire people that can weld but haven't been welding for years. im not talking about making a lot of money while i finish school.
Reply:Ahh I see now, 3 new topics and 14 posts in a week all basically rambling on about the same 'question'. All while the 'question' was basically addressed in the first replies. I see I'm just waisting my time. Moving on...
Reply:Well im pretty sure markball2 was the only one that gave me something i can go off of. and yes please move on now.. thanks
Reply:Originally Posted by k20beastWell im pretty sure markball2 was the only one that gave me something i can go off of. and yes please move on now.. thanks
Reply:Dave, you said a mouthful.  Attitude is everything when it comes to a job.  Getting along with others, dealing with upset customers because they don't like the price quoted or your haircut that day can be tough to teach.Myself, I always have a smile for customers & a "can do" attitude.  When I find out I cannot fix their problem, I let them know, tactfully if possible, straight up if necessary.  Attitude can get you through the door & into trouble at the same time.  Just remember, you are asking the questions/looking for the work, not the other way around.MarkI haven't always been a nurse........Craftsman 12"x36" LatheEnco G-30B MillHobart Handler 175Lincoln WeldandPower 225 AC/DC G-7 CV/CCAdd a Foot Pedal to a Harbor Freight Chicago Electric 165A DC TIG PapaLion's Gate Build
Reply:Originally Posted by k20beastumm yea? part time at a fab shop with the skills i have now?Or maybe your just the dumbest person thats replied to me on forums?
Reply:Originally Posted by dave powelsonExperience, skill or non-skilled---one critical item is attitude of the prospective employee.They need to be able to play well with others. I rate attitude higher than any other attribute. Attitude is what enables all kinds of other things to happen.Like it or not, you've been given some helpful hints and comments.You've already bantered a starting wage for yourself of $10/hour.Before I even give someone looking for a paycheck an application, they haveto pass a little 5 minute test sequence; which does not entail running any beads. I'll pass on you, thanks for stopping in, watch the door as you leave.BTW--I pay one unskilled, part timer, $18/hour--due to attitude and his ability tohelp/solve/anticipate problems as opposed to creating problems for me. Worth every cent!
Reply:Hey guys,Well, it's quite evident of those who cannot take a bit of criticism without going into a "waa-waa" about the "bad attitudes" & "you guys are the worst".....duuuhhhh!  Is that the position you are going to take with your supervisor when your welds get criticized or your production is lacking? I also agree that Dave Powelson's initial response was quite dead-center. What is it with the last two generations who are so inept with the use of the English language, grammar, & simple punctuation? No wonder their communication skills are the reason they can't find good-paying jobs or a career that elevates them with their hunger to learn to be an asset to a company. A company hires to maintain a PROFIT.... the PROFIT is what keeps you working & allows for a pay increase. An educated individual with good communication & comprehension skills who is willing to be productive will never fail.....every company hires those. Get a life.....only you can decide if you want it or not.DennyComplete Welding/Machine/Fab. ShopMobile UnitFinally retired*Moderator*"A man's word is his honor...without honor there is nothing.""Words are like bullets.... Once they leave your muzzle, you cannot get them back."
Reply:Thanks for all the replies..and im not sure how i have had a bad attitude? im just wondering if i could maybe get a job and how much i might look at making then ppl talk **** over nothing. so thanks for those who didnt waste my time
Reply:Play the student card when looking for a part time job.  Most folks are more than willing to hire a student trying to make some extra cash while in school.  You will only be able to take advantage of being a student looking for work for a short time.  As to school.  Stick with it even though it guarantees nothing but education.  I have a 4yr degree from Baylor and at 35 I am in welding school following another direction of life.  Oh yeah, the crackerjack votec school I am attending won't accept my college math from a university.. know why... they want my money also.  Schools are in business to make a profit.   I have been self employed for 20 yrs through high school and college.  My 2 most financially successful friends graduated high school and did not go to the next level.  One is a welder/fabricator the other works in peoples gardens (maybe he doesn't anymore).  Anyhow, what I like about you k20beast is you stood up for yourself.  If you don't no one else will.  On the other hand listen to what all these older folks say and try to hear the important parts while discarding the junk.Stay in school because that is just how the world works now and I guarantee you can get a side job as a student in San Antonio.  If you are not a student then you will be considered another bum adult with nothing to really offer the company.  As a student a company or mentor is offering you a job trying to help you and teach you something.Enjoy SA.  Good place.
Reply:Originally Posted by sixPlay the student card when looking for a part time job.  Most folks are more than willing to hire a student trying to make some extra cash while in school.  You will only be able to take advantage of being a student looking for work for a short time.  As to school.  Stick with it even though it guarantees nothing but education.  I have a 4yr degree from Baylor and at 35 I am in welding school following another direction of life.  Oh yeah, the crackerjack votec school I am attending won't accept my college math from a university.. know why... they want my money also.  Schools are in business to make a profit.   I have been self employed for 20 yrs through high school and college.  My 2 most financially successful friends graduated high school and did not go to the next level.  One is a welder/fabricator the other works in peoples gardens (maybe he doesn't anymore).  Anyhow, what I like about you k20beast is you stood up for yourself.  If you don't no one else will.  On the other hand listen to what all these older folks say and try to hear the important parts while discarding the junk.Stay in school because that is just how the world works now and I guarantee you can get a side job as a student in San Antonio.  If you are not a student then you will be considered another bum adult with nothing to really offer the company.  As a student a company or mentor is offering you a job trying to help you and teach you something.Enjoy SA.  Good place.
Reply:Hello k20beast, it's unfortunate that this thread has gone south so quickly. I don't believe I have read your other threads, maybe I have, none-the-less you have asked a good question, one that so many others would probably ask for themselves when they're in school or nearing completion. I get that same sort of question in many different variations and at various stages of the game. My replies generally cover the overall question with various points and additional questions attached. First point, is this career choice one that you plan to be pursuing for most of the rest of your life? If so, then pay close attention to learning all the welding and related vocational skills that you can and as well as you can, also, and probably one of the biggest, learn how to learn and perfect this skill to the best of your abilities. Getting "through" with school isn't the end of anything, it is only the tip of the iceburg and the beginning of a very lengthy journey on your road to becoming proficient and trusted in your abilities. All of the "academic" type classes that are generally attached to Applied Arts and Sciences degrees in welding are there for a reason, they're needs aren't readily apparent to most students up-front and aren't really realized until quite some time later as an individual's focuses are generally shifted. When you transition from a "simple" welder to a co-worker, fabricator, craftsman, leadman, teacher(yes you will be teaching too), business owner, etc. Those times will be when other skills will be necessary and appreciated. Additionally, there are many soft-skills that need to be a part of a successful tradesperson. I know you've likely heard them, yet I'll still include them for anyone who might read this besides yourself. Work Ethics: be the one who shows up on time and ready to work, be the one who doesn't have to worry if they can pass a drug-screening, be the one who isn't afraid to give a full days work for a full days pay, be the one who is willing to listen to differing points of view before simply shutting the ears off and doing as planned anyway, be the one who takes into consideration your employer's customer base and look, speak, dress, and act in a manner that promotes a positive view of the business that pays your wages. Work with your co-workers and not against them, a team will do far better than a bunch of individuals who can't manage to coordinate their efforts. Another very important point and one that I can't take the credit for, but is so true and will take you a long way, learn to listen and separate the facts from the bull****, you will be exposed to any number of differing views and statements covering the right way and wrong way to do things, realize that there are likely many ways to achieve the "correct" way and not necessarily the "only" way. It is a job-skill to discern when you are being told incorrectly, it is also a job-skill to decide when you are being told correctly, pay attention to this process and try very hard to master it. Observe before you speak and when you speak ask your questions clearly, if you are chastized for asking what someone else might consider a "dumb" question just remember that the old addage about the only dumb question being the one that isn't asked really is true. Also pay attention to the answers you receive so that you don't continually ask the same ones over and over, you will aggravate someone if that is the case. Show an interest in learning, when someone is showing you something new pay close attention, ask relevant questions and if you have been shown in a different manner in the past tactfully ask for an opinion as to why one way over the other. Genuine interest will lead to comraderie and many more opportunities for learning.     School, school/work, apprenticeship, three options that are faced and acted upon by a bunch of folks all the time. For some school without breaks is the only way to ensure that they can finish school, as some of the other posters on here have stated it is really hard many times to come back to finish school when you step-out for a time. School/work, a lot of folks might possibly have the drive and ambition to go this route although it isn't for everyone either, working part-time/full-time and going to school can be very tough and requires a lot of discipline and dedication on the part of the individual. You generally have family, work, homework, and school to concern yourself with, it's very difficult to always give proper and fair attention to all of these components and be as successful as you should or would like to. Apprenticeship, although mostly associated with unions, this can also be done in non-union settings and progressive non-union shops will in a sense employ a similar model to those of their union counterparts. I have had contact with numerous individuals who have either gone directly into a union apprenticeship or have completed various degrees of schooling: partial welding programs, certificated welding programs, applied arts and sciences welding degrees and then gone into the union apprenticeships and non-union apprenticeships. The main differences in their outcomes have been based a lot on personal drive and abilities, as well, they have generally received advanced placements based on their prior learning and proof of these things, either through assessment tests or competency based testing.      If you are simply concerned with trying to learn hands-on while attending school and possibly supplementing your monies while in school be upfront about this with employers as you approach them. Many employers might be willing to do this sort of thing as it give them a good idea of the type of employee who might be coming to them upon their completion of schooling, in some cases they might even be willing to help shoulder the burden of tuition costs with the right person. Geographical areas and the general work atmosphere of a particular area will likely set the tone for whatever type of possibilities exist. Good luck to you and best regards, Allanaevaldas a note I worked as a welder through both my A.A degree in welding and my B.S in welding engineering.  The whole time i was working about 10-18hrs a week as a welder, I didn't have a lot of family support so I had to pay my own way and eat.it's very doable, you probably won't get any gravy jobs.  The best I ever commanded was about 12.50/hr working as a tig welder/fabricator   I started at 8.5 working as a MIG welder.  you put in your dues so that you have some good work experience when you graduate.  I highly reccommend working while in school as long as you can make it work.
Reply:In response to the OP's opening question.A few weeks ago I was part of a tour and then a presentation courtesy of Liebherr coporation at their NewPort News heavy mining truck facility.  A member of my group asked about what was required for someone to be a part of the build and repair field team that puts together the mining trucks on site and repairs them as needed around the world.  The HR person rattled off skill / education sets such as hydraulics, computer systems, engineering, diesel engine operation and repair, and last of all welding and welding itself was not a priority.  Another question asked was about certifications and degree's and he said that he would talk first with the person with a degree and certs over someone with just certs and over someone without certs so no certs and no degree puts you at the bottom of the barrel should you want to get into the kind of place that you would like to retire from.I'm going for all of my certs plus my associates even though its in business and has more to do with entrepreneurship than welding unless you want to manage or own your own business both of which I have no desire for that kind of headache.  What I will be doing is taking classes in pic controllers and computers to get a degree in computers so as to work with robotic welders and controls.  The area that I'm in has a heavy government presence and some high end manufacturing so degree's and certs will go a long way towards getting into either a government employee job such as with sealiftcommand.com or Northrup Grumman or BAE systems or Liebherr or the sea based wind turbine facility if the government ever gets off its arse and opens up things for alternative energy.