Help with Horizontal Fillet Welds using E6010

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I am trying to learn horizontal fillet welds using 1/8" 6010 electrodes. One of the main problems that I am having is getting the first pass in straight. Once I start the arc I can't see the joint anymore and I almost always end up putting the bead up on the metal instead of in the root. I am using the whipping technique. Is there a better way to lay in the root pass. Can anybody give any advice on how to see the joint better. I have already done it with E7018 and I could see the root just fine. But I need help with 6010. I appreciate any help that anybody could give me. Thanks.
Reply:Maybe use one step lighter shade lens in your helmet?   Or if you're welding in a dark area, shine a light on the joint.
Reply:Hello, ScottB,What is your age?
Reply:DesertRider, I am using an autodarkening helmet and I have it on 9 and I have never got above shade 10. I can see the puddle and arc fine. It's just I have a problem seeing where I am going by following the root.Weldordie,                I am 31.
Reply:I'd be using a shade 10 if welding around 100 amps (you should be around 90(+/-5)).  It could be too bright on shade 9, and cause you not to see the weld pool.  Try drawing some lines with your soapstone 1/2" from the root along the joint.  That should help you see where you need to go.You shouldn't be whipping on a root pass.  Just use consistant travelspeed.With 6010 you should almost push the rod into the joint because it penetrates so well and fast.  Your arc-length should be 1/8" or less.What helps me is to put the rod in the holder in the 90* position, use a 10*-15* upward work angle, position your hands at the end of the joint, or on a bigger piece, where you want the rod to be consumed by, start the arc, and the only movement should be your hands moving directly toward the workpiece.(Wish I could show you)Hope that helps!Last edited by Narco; 11-19-2006 at 12:20 PM.
Reply:Thanks for the advice Narco. I will try to run the root pass in straight instead of whipping it. Let me see if I understand you. What you are saying is put my hands and rod holder at the end of the work piece. In this case a 6" long 3/8" thick steel plate and start my arc at the beginning of the plate and keep my hands it the same spot and keep the same work angle and just keep my hands and the end of the metal and going towards the metal as the rod is consumed. Thanks Again I will give it a try. After Thanksgiving when I get back to school.
Reply:I hoped that I explained that in an understandable fashion...lol.Sounds like you got it.If your only motion is inward, the weld should lay down perfectly straight.I used to hate 6010, because of the amount of work it took to weld with it, now it's my favorite because of that reason.
Reply:Narco, Just one more quick question. When you say a 10 to 15 degree work angle. Do you mean if my rod is at a 90 degree angle to the metal tilt the rod 10 to 15 degrees forward the way I want to weld. Like would be done if I was doing the whipping motion. Or if the rod was flat against the metal raise it up 10 to 15 degrees. I understand the work angle when welding on flat plate. Are you talking about the same thing. I started to picture it as I started thinking about more. Sorry I don't understand fully, I am still learning. Thanks ScottB
Reply:No, for example, the work angle on a fillet weld in the flat position is 45*.  In the horizontal position it is 45* minus 10* to 15*.  So your electrode should be pointing slightly up at the end.  You do this because gravity is trying to pull your weld pool away from the top piece in the joint, so you want to deposit more metal there.Hope that makes sense.  If I wasn't at work I would take a picture.
Reply:I think I understand it fully. Will you have a chance to take a picture? I think it would really help out. Thanks
Reply:First off how exactly do you have the piece positioned like pic 1 or 2 Attached Images
Reply:Hey Narco. It is like the 2nd picture. Thanks for the help.
Reply:Ok, some people consider horizontal like the 1st pic.The first pass should be a 45 degree work angle, pointing right at the middle of the joint.
Reply:Ok, I will try that. I thought that the first picture was the flat position.
Reply:flat and horizontal tjoint are both the same thing....lolnot all welders are the same but for stick welding i would hit tat joint at a 30 degree angle.Last edited by steve28; 11-25-2006 at 11:57 AM.