Cast Iron Welding Table Top

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I can get a hold of a cast iron top that has been ground flat.  I believe it is an old antique overhead pin router that has hardware that is screwed to the top.  If I remember correctly, it is about 36" x 42" or something like that.  It is very thick and extremely heavy.  Would this top be a good use for a welding table.  It is supported with a wood base at the moment but I would make a metal base with heavy duty casters.What do you think?Thanks!Miller Dynasty 200DXLincoln SP175Grizzly 14" Band SawRigid CM1450 Chop SawJD2 TN-100 Tube Notcher
Reply:I had a cast iron welding table long ago and loved it. The splatter will not stick to it so the surface stays clean. However, you cannot easily tack something to it so keep that in mind.Gadget
Reply:Sure.Drawbacks would be you really can't tack to the tabletop for temp jigs/fixtures/etc (as mentioned).  Also that cast iron is not for work that needs a BFH to 'adjust' the work, the cast iron may chip or crack.  The best laid schemes ... Gang oft agley ...
Reply:We had cast iron welding tables when I was an apprentice, as already said the splatter comes off real easy and small welds that get on the table can easily be chiselled off.Haven't seen one for nearly 40 years.Clive
Reply:Thats funny, I was about to make the same post. Im also in the same boat with a similar size piece. I got it at an auction for 7 dollars and weighs a ton!!!Nick
Reply:The top has arrived.  My question to you folks is how tall would you make this thing.  The top is 29" x 47 1/2" and extremely heavy.  Thank God I have a skid steer.  I also have about 75" of 2"x3" rectangular tube, quite a bit of 1 1/2" square tube, 7/8" square tube and some flat stock.  I'm thinking 2"x3" corner posts with the 1 1/2" cross pieces.  I'm thinking that the corner posts will stick up and go up into the flat spots on the bottom side corners that you can see in the picture.  Heavy duty casters on the bottom and a bottom shelf to hold misc welding equipment.  I just want to make sure that this thing is not tippy in case I run into something on the floor when I'm wheeling it around.  Any suggestions about attaching the top or do I let it float.Any thoughts about must have design elements.  I only want to do this once.  I would like to add a vice using a receiver hitch as shown in some of the other designs.Thanks!! Attached ImagesMiller Dynasty 200DXLincoln SP175Grizzly 14" Band SawRigid CM1450 Chop SawJD2 TN-100 Tube Notcher
Reply:Do you prefer to sit or stand?  I like standing. So with me being 6'2",  I put my tops no lower than 42" or so.  I would suggest mocking up a work height by suspending a piece of metal between two step ladders resting them on the rungs and bending or leaning over it raising and lowering the height until it feels right. Don't forget to allow for working on tall or raised objects when you find your "ideal" height.  Too low is a pain in the back. Too high is a pain in the neck.  Now if you find a need to sit,  consider what you will be sitting on and raise it about 12" inches or so above it.Esab Migmaster 250Lincoln SA 200Lincoln Ranger 8Smith Oxy Fuel setupEverlast PowerPlasma 80Everlast Power iMIG 160Everlast Power iMIG 205 Everlast Power iMIG 140EEverlast PowerARC 300Everlast PowerARC 140STEverlast PowerTIG 255EXT
Reply:Table height for work surfaces is an individual thing and Lugweld has covered it well. I don't know what you're thinking of doing in the event that it does become "tippy" in terms of holding the top on but by the look of the section, it should be possible to drill and tap into the bottom of it. Also as it's a casting, it's unlikley that the bottom has been machined and you may be able to effect a way of levelling it for your frame with locknuts etc or shims or packers. It would be bad enough tipping it over but the last thing you'd want is to have the top come free, too. Good quality and large casters with real bearings will help avoid this, as will a clean floor with no hollows. mounds or old concrete fasteners to negotiate.I think it'll make a great surface. It's probably already done its first fifty years in the timber machining industry. Now it's being recycled"One of the things we have to be thankful for is that we don't get as much government as we pay for." (Charles Kettering)Mitch 180 (NZ)Lincoln SAM-400-220 + ?-400 Fordson Major + 2 x Tractapac Humber 80 + Procut 40 PlasmaMiller Spectrum 375
Reply:If you decide to weld the legs to the table, high nickel rod works well when joining steel to cast iron.  Preheat, preheat, preahet.  And keep it hot for a while while the weld cools.  There's guys more up on it than I am.  Peening is a good stress reliever too I SAID PEENING, NOT PEEING"Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/
Reply:I'll probably drill and tap.  I have the O/A torches and cart but no tanks yet.  Haven't had a big demand for it so I keep putting it off.  My plan is to put the cast top upside down on my current woodworking workbench.  Once I figure out where I want the holes, I'll move the drill press over to the workbench where the top is sitting.  That way I don't have to rely on the small drill press table when I'm drilling the holes.  I don't own a magnet base drill so the drill press will keep me straight and vertical.  Then I'll hand tap from there.Miller Dynasty 200DXLincoln SP175Grizzly 14" Band SawRigid CM1450 Chop SawJD2 TN-100 Tube Notcher
Reply:Sounds like a tough way to go, but a good one.I wish I owned a mag drill.  Those things are the bomb.  It ought to hold really well on the thick casting.   I read somewhere that it takes a certain thickness before the magnetic base on the drill develops the full hold down potential."Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/
Reply:Now THAT's a bench top.  I'd go with the drilled and tapped bolt holes too.I know it's thick and ribbed but being cast iron, how much pounding do you think it can take?MM200 w/Spoolmatic 1Syncrowave 180SDBobcat 225G Plus - LP/NGMUTT Suitcase WirefeederWC-1S/Spoolmatic 1HF-251D-1PakMaster 100XL '68 Red Face Code #6633 projectStar Jet 21-110Save Second Base!
Reply:Samm.HF has a mag drill.  It's affordable.  Of course, it isn't what some of them are in strength, but if you really want one then check them out.Esab Migmaster 250Lincoln SA 200Lincoln Ranger 8Smith Oxy Fuel setupEverlast PowerPlasma 80Everlast Power iMIG 160Everlast Power iMIG 205 Everlast Power iMIG 140EEverlast PowerARC 300Everlast PowerARC 140STEverlast PowerTIG 255EXT
Reply:There are several Mag Drills on eBay right now.  I bought one there several years ago.  It paid for itself on the many "steel hanging" jobs I was involved in at the time.  Mine is a Milwaukee and uses annular cutters.  I bought the cutters on eBay also.It's one of those deals "you get what you pay for".  Don't go cheap, go good from the get go.  You won't regret it.
Reply:Here is a quick sketch of what I'm thinking about.  The corners are 2"x3" and I have two cross pieces using the 1 1/2" square tube and attached with flat stock and bolted to the ends.  I have 2"x3" cross peices on the end so that I can weld the receiver on for the detachable vice.  Do you see anything that stands out that you would change with this design?  Do you think that the 1 1/2" square tubes will be strong enough to hold up the top and anything I'm working on?  Keeping in mind that this is mainly a hobby and I don't anticipate welding any major structural pieces.  Also, most of the pounding that I do will be with the work mounted in the vice that is attached to the base only. Attached ImagesMiller Dynasty 200DXLincoln SP175Grizzly 14" Band SawRigid CM1450 Chop SawJD2 TN-100 Tube Notcher
Reply:That cast iron needs support undneath it. It should be resting on those cross members.Esab Migmaster 250Lincoln SA 200Lincoln Ranger 8Smith Oxy Fuel setupEverlast PowerPlasma 80Everlast Power iMIG 160Everlast Power iMIG 205 Everlast Power iMIG 140EEverlast PowerARC 300Everlast PowerARC 140STEverlast PowerTIG 255EXT
Reply:So you're saying that I should try and support it only on the ribs of the casting or should I try to support it on the corners and the ribs at the same time?Miller Dynasty 200DXLincoln SP175Grizzly 14" Band SawRigid CM1450 Chop SawJD2 TN-100 Tube Notcher
Reply:Your basic idea is fine but as lugweld said you need to move it down onto the cross supports. In the current design the pieces weight rests on each of the four corners in that design any pounding puts the stress onto the corner closest to the pounding. Eventually that stress would cause hairline cracks where the piece is supported on the stand. It could eventually break on the corner.I would also add some addition cross supports to add strength to the center of the piece.Be sure to take some pics of you stand and the unit when its finished.TomCo-Own CNC shop:Miller :1251 plasma cutter, MaxStar 700 TIG/Stick, & XMT 456 Multiprocess Welder.&  2 Hypertherm HPR260's Plasma CutterSorry I had a bad stroke but now I am back.
Reply:DittoEsab Migmaster 250Lincoln SA 200Lincoln Ranger 8Smith Oxy Fuel setupEverlast PowerPlasma 80Everlast Power iMIG 160Everlast Power iMIG 205 Everlast Power iMIG 140EEverlast PowerARC 300Everlast PowerARC 140STEverlast PowerTIG 255EXT
Reply:I'd like to see a picture of the bottom side. My thought would be to use the "pad" that looks like it's in about 4-6" in from the sides, to mount the leg to. This looks heavier than the edge, allowing for good bolting and most important, it will keep the edge open and available for clamping.Another thought, you could drill all the way through, bolt the top on with standard bolts, flip it over, THEN, countersink the holes a few at a time, leaving at least half the bolts on for safety.  Additionally, if you had large, good grade flat head bolts in your top you could weld direct to them when you need to tack something to the table.I don't see any stock in that picture heavy enough for legs, only cross bracing.Just my  opinion, not from a book, just from the road.Howes Welding Inc.www.howesweldinginc.com
Reply:The braces flush with the edge under the top will interfere with the use of C clamps on/at the edge. I would overhand the top over the base a few inches.Also you have not drawn the ribs on the castiron top so hard to tell how it really fits. I would support it on the ribs only. It will be very difficult to support both the ribs and the edge in a way that will "share" the load between them. Most likely the loads on the ribs and edges  will fight each other when you bolt it all down if you try to have both supported.
Reply:Originally Posted by tessdadI don't see any stock in that picture heavy enough for legs, only cross bracing.
Reply:I've got the top flipped over.  No easy task by myself even with the skid steer.  I put it on two furniture dollies to get it moved around from time to time.  The top thickness officially measures out at 3-1/2" over all with a 1-5/16" thickness without the ribs and pads.There are 6 pads on the bottom.  The corners are 'L' shaped and the side pads are just straight.  I have them outlined in red.  I guess I know where my supports will be.  Any recommendations on how to configure the cross members so that I can get it flat for those pads.  Also, what should I do to connect the top to the base?  There are four through holes where the overhead pin router base was connected.  I circled them in yellow.  Any other thoughts on the design?  I'm glad I asked in the first place, otherwise I would have gone with my original design for the table.  Thanks guys! Attached ImagesMiller Dynasty 200DXLincoln SP175Grizzly 14" Band SawRigid CM1450 Chop SawJD2 TN-100 Tube Notcher
Reply:World's LARGEST Belgian waffle maker. mmm. yumm!Just put some supports under the the center.  I would use 2 cross braces evenly spaced.  I think it would work just fine.  This looks like an excellent lay out table.  But not too good for pounding the pooh out of something.Esab Migmaster 250Lincoln SA 200Lincoln Ranger 8Smith Oxy Fuel setupEverlast PowerPlasma 80Everlast Power iMIG 160Everlast Power iMIG 205 Everlast Power iMIG 140EEverlast PowerARC 300Everlast PowerARC 140STEverlast PowerTIG 255EXT
Reply:Yeah, that's a heavy chunk of cast iron all right!512 pounds just in the solid part of the top, and add in the ribs and you are probably between 600 and 700 pounds of cast iron.Table ideas?  Go to your picture  of the upside-down table-top with the red outlines.  Make a perimeter frame of steel out of that 2x3 (3 inch dimension vertically) by connecting the four corner mounting pads areas and run one cross beam across the center mounting pad area.  Mount your 6 table legs underneath THAT underneath the mounting pad areas.  Put your bottom shelf and cross bracing under all that.  4x4 legs would probably be more in proportion to that beefy cast iron.As mentioned, don't rely on weight, gravity, or friction to keep the tabletop in place.  Maybe run some U channels to capture some of the cross ribs  and bolt through that and through some cross holes in the ribs and keep the top connected to the frame/legs subassembly.mock-up picture not to scale. Attached Images  The best laid schemes ... Gang oft agley ...Here is the new design.  I was able to get the top to rest on all 6 pads with 2"x3" tubes as shown.  I'll use 4 detachable cross members bolted to the sides.  There is also a receiver installed for a detachable vise.  I'll also throw some heavy duty casters on as well.  Thoughts? Attached ImagesMiller Dynasty 200DXLincoln SP175Grizzly 14" Band SawRigid CM1450 Chop SawJD2 TN-100 Tube Notcher
Reply:Additional thoughts on the design and another picture.  I used the flat side of the tube to help acheive a flat surface for the pads instead of trying to get 3 cross members to become flat.  Now I'm only dealing with two large supports for the entire table.  I would still like to be able to take the whole thing apart in case it needs to be moved some day but I'll weld the whole thing if I have too. Attached ImagesMiller Dynasty 200DXLincoln SP175Grizzly 14" Band SawRigid CM1450 Chop SawJD2 TN-100 Tube Notcher
Reply:Support it all the way around the top and run a couple across the middle.  Don't make it so complicated.Esab Migmaster 250Lincoln SA 200Lincoln Ranger 8Smith Oxy Fuel setupEverlast PowerPlasma 80Everlast Power iMIG 160Everlast Power iMIG 205 Everlast Power iMIG 140EEverlast PowerARC 300Everlast PowerARC 140STEverlast PowerTIG 255EXT
Reply:I really favor MoonRise's design.  It supports the full perimeter, and the cross brace is good too.  The middle leg will take the load better too.  It reduces the clear span lengthwise.The only problem I see is the fitup.I wouldn't make the frame as a complete stand alone unit.  I would lay the table on a flat surface, make the end legs/cross support, then fit the supports that run lengthwise along the table.  Doing it this way would help make up for any irregularities in the web casting.  In other words "build to" the table, instead of building "square and level" and hoping the table casting fits the leg structure.  I hope that makes some sort of sense.I might be all full of crap on this too.  It's a thought"Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/
Reply:Thanks for your help guys.  I'm going to head out and get some good sturdy steel tube to get this going. Attached ImagesMiller Dynasty 200DXLincoln SP175Grizzly 14" Band SawRigid CM1450 Chop SawJD2 TN-100 Tube Notcher
Reply:I think that's the one to go with.Try to get the thickest wall tubing you're budget will allow.  Money's always a problem on this end too"Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/
Reply:I'd say make the frame flat and square and level, and then fit the top to the frame via shims (hardened steel ones, not plastic or aluminum ones) or such.Should be easier than -trying- to make a crooked frame.  Although I have been known to end up with a crooked something when I was trying for flat, square, and level.  You have a pretty heavy top.  So I'd make the frame and legs beefy and heavy to go along with the general size and weight and capacity of the top.Besides, that thick chunk of cast iron would look really silly on some spindly little 1x1 legs.    The best laid schemes ... Gang oft agley ...
Reply:Maybe I'm going to extremesI've been burned a time or two when I've added something to a piece of equipment assuming that the mounting point is square and true.  I've always had better luck building out from where the bumper/hitch/whatever is to be mounted.  Usually tack it together as far as possible on the equipment, then take it off and weld it.Hell, I dunnoMy thinkin' centers around the possibility the web side of the table may not be finished as well as the surface.  Castings sometimes are irregular where there's no finish work required.Hell, I dunno(again)If you build square, I guess you could just tram, and grind the web to fit.  After all, it's only necessary where the frame meets the web.Ok, I convinced myself (grind not shim, and I'll fight ya to the grave on that one, unless it's just a small low spot)"Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/
Reply:Damn thats going to be one sweet table Can't wait to see some pic's.Got one of those Canadian Tire Lincoln welders .
Reply:Just an update.  Here is how it is coming along.  Slight change in design.  Please critique my welds.  Give it to me straight.  Don't hold back.I'm out of Argon and I need to pick up some 4" plate to mount the casters on. Attached ImagesMiller Dynasty 200DXLincoln SP175Grizzly 14" Band SawRigid CM1450 Chop SawJD2 TN-100 Tube Notcher
Reply:Welds are probably fine.  Take a look at the backside of where the weld is, if there's discoloration, and a line of raised metal, you got enough heat into the steel and it's good.Try to continue into and around the corner a ways.  Makes it easier to make the other weld on the other side without having to mess around tieing it into the first weld.  Even thought it's never gonna be outside, try to make sure it's a watertight weld, it's also stronger without unfilled gaps.It looks like it's gonna be a stout table.  Maybe add some corner gussets on the legs.  They don't have to be gigantimo, maybe 4-6 inches from tubing shoulder to tubing shoulder, not in the middle of the tubing."Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/
Reply:That's just perfect. Don't forget to grind the welds flat when you put your top on so it will sit level.Esab Migmaster 250Lincoln SA 200Lincoln Ranger 8Smith Oxy Fuel setupEverlast PowerPlasma 80Everlast Power iMIG 160Everlast Power iMIG 205 Everlast Power iMIG 140EEverlast PowerARC 300Everlast PowerARC 140STEverlast PowerTIG 255EXT
Reply:Well you did a good job of going from your  1st design to the new one. This new top is far better than the 4 post design. And the addition of the top cross support will not only help evenly distribute the weight but also the stress if you do some heavy pounding on that table.  Like Sam said the top posts to the cross supports should have additonal weldsall the way around to help even out the stress on the support posts. Given the weight of that table top its far better to over strenghten it than have it snap a weld and have that table fall apart on your foot.Also I see the base of the table does not have any footers spreading out the weight of the table on the surface below the leg posts. Over time a lack of those footers on each post will cause  the table to diig into the surface it is on especially if you havve any heavy pounding adding additional stress  on the footprint of each post. Originally you could have welded the cross supports toward the  bottom of the table onto the surface of the floor! The lowering of those supports would have given a much larger footprint on the baseof the table thereby fully distributing the weight evenly around the footprint. And the table base design would basically be a cube.If you decide to go with casters make sure you get the locking type so your table doesn't creep around the floor whille your working.Hope that helps,TomLast edited by specter; 01-10-2009 at 08:44 PM.Co-Own CNC shop:Miller :1251 plasma cutter, MaxStar 700 TIG/Stick, & XMT 456 Multiprocess Welder.&  2 Hypertherm HPR260's Plasma CutterSorry I had a bad stroke but now I am back.
Reply:Originally Posted by hflwaterskiHere is a quick sketch of what I'm thinking about.  The corners are 2"x3" and I have two cross pieces using the 1 1/2" square tube and attached with flat stock and bolted to the ends.  I have 2"x3" cross peices on the end so that I can weld the receiver on for the detachable vice.  Do you see anything that stands out that you would change with this design?  Do you think that the 1 1/2" square tubes will be strong enough to hold up the top and anything I'm working on?  Keeping in mind that this is mainly a hobby and I don't anticipate welding any major structural pieces.  Also, most of the pounding that I do will be with the work mounted in the vice that is attached to the base only.
Reply:Did you ever figure out what the weight of this table will be?Co-Own CNC shop:Miller :1251 plasma cutter, MaxStar 700 TIG/Stick, & XMT 456 Multiprocess Welder.&  2 Hypertherm HPR260's Plasma CutterSorry I had a bad stroke but now I am back.
Reply:The top should be just shy of 600 lbs according to my calculations.  So all total, it should around 650 lbs.  I'm going to put it on large 6" casters so it shouldn't be too bad getting it around.Miller Dynasty 200DXLincoln SP175Grizzly 14" Band SawRigid CM1450 Chop SawJD2 TN-100 Tube Notcher
Reply:Make sure those casters have a wide footprint to help distrubute the weight and roll better. Also don't for those caster/wheel locks to prevent the table from rolling away as you work on it.Co-Own CNC shop:Miller :1251 plasma cutter, MaxStar 700 TIG/Stick, & XMT 456 Multiprocess Welder.&  2 Hypertherm HPR260's Plasma CutterSorry I had a bad stroke but now I am back.
Reply:hflwaterski:   what graphics program did you use to make your drawings?  Is the program inexpensive for the home user?
Reply:I'm using Google SketchUp.  The best part is that it is FREE!!  Just go through the tutorials and play with it for a day or two and you'll get the hang of it.Miller Dynasty 200DXLincoln SP175Grizzly 14" Band SawRigid CM1450 Chop SawJD2 TN-100 Tube Notcher
Reply:Well, I'm not quite done but I was able to get the top on using the skid steer.  Thank God for skid steers.  I need to put on a bottom for a shelf and then get a vice attached to a 2" tube for the receiver hitch.  When it warms up, I'll throw a coat of black engine paint on the base and call it a done deal. Attached ImagesMiller Dynasty 200DXLincoln SP175Grizzly 14" Band SawRigid CM1450 Chop SawJD2 TN-100 Tube Notcher
Reply:Hey, you're there!!That top looks massive once it's up on the legs.  Sorta looks like a carrier deck in a way.  NeatHow did the web match the frame.  Was I too anal about the fit??"Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/
Reply:That looks really good and I like the way that the frame is inside the perimeter of the table. It should be good to work at.Yep, thank heavens for skid steers, Sam's lifting device on his tractor, or, in my case, a tractor mounted forklift mast or a gantry. (I'd [B]really[B] like a skid steer though!)Let us know how you get on with the receiver mounted vice. It seems like a good idea but I'm apprehensive about the vice not being bolted down rock solid."One of the things we have to be thankful for is that we don't get as much government as we pay for." (Charles Kettering)Mitch 180 (NZ)Lincoln SAM-400-220 + ?-400 Fordson Major + 2 x Tractapac Humber 80 + Procut 40 PlasmaMiller Spectrum 375
Reply:I'm still working out the bugs.  The base is just a touch out of square and so I'm going to have to shim out under the caster pads and under the table top on the web frame.  I could have used the table for welding it up but it was upside down and I thought I could get closer than I did when I welded it all up.  I'll let you know about the vice once I get it all welded up and I use it.  I also need to get a locking swivel caster.  The ones I have on there now are what I had laying around.Miller Dynasty 200DXLincoln SP175Grizzly 14" Band SawRigid CM1450 Chop SawJD2 TN-100 Tube Notcher
Reply:Nice table. Thanks for the thread. Hmmm, Google SketchUp.  Originally Posted by hflwaterskiWhen it warms up, I'll throw a coat of black engine paint on the base and call it a done deal.
Reply:That table is going to be nice.There are still alot of really big cast iron tables in shops in this area, and in some of these shops, including where I work now, tacking anything to a cast table is a huge no-no.People tack a stop or what have you to the table and go back later with a hammer to break the tacks and it pulls a little chunk of the table up with it.Where in Wisconsin are ya from?Yup