trailer formulas

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I have a chance of getting a 2-horse (side by side) trailer for free.  It has tandem axles.  I thought maybe I could build a nice heavy weight utility trailer out of it.  I have been working on some plans for trailers and wanted to find out about formulas.  I'm hoping Dabar39 will see this and help out.  These are some of the questions I am looking for answers to...1.  Ratio/formula for placement of the axles2.  Application of #1 if for tandem axles3.  Tongue length4.  Length/width ratios5.  Width restriction for street use.6.  Other legal issues, like lights, and getting a title/VIN for a home made
Reply:I wish I could be more help.  This would be a great (sticky )   a title in minnesota is pretty easy , go to the DMV and ask for a homemmade form,  fill it out and pay the money. all the state what's is MONEY!daye
Reply:About all you can salvage from  a stock trailer will be the axles, and maybe the hitch.Stock trailers depend on sheet metal sides for load support instead of channel like a utility trailer.  It's sheet metal sides with maybe 3-4 inch angle iron under the floor tieing it together.Not a real good candidate for a flatbed utility trailer.  Enclosed trailer maybeLast edited by farmersamm; 05-12-2009 at 08:39 PM.Reason: "all""Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/
Reply:Sam is right.  Stock trailers aren't designed to be utility trailers.  At best you could salvage the tongue, and the axles.  Possibly an enclosed trailer as Sam suggest...I'm a Lover, Fighter, Wild horse Rider, and a pretty good welding man......
Reply:Go to http://www.championtrailers.com Great plans, dimensions, and axle/tongue split explanation.  It's usually 60/40.  I think it's on their site, been a while since I looked at it.Overall width is limited to 102 inches.  Lighting, I couldn't tell you offhand, but I think it's covered in most trailer catalogs.  Only thing that's changed since I was younger is the requirement for reflective dot stripes on the sides, and I don't know what length that kicks in atI hope the link works, this is a fast type, and I ain't too good at linksIt's really not rocket science"Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/
Reply:My home state Utah, doesn't require a title, license plate, or registration on home built as long as the length is 10' or less excluding tongue and has the proper tail/brake/turn signals. I'm not sure if tandem axles change the requirements but I suspect that it does as it must be used for under 2500 lbs GVWR. Better to ask forgiveness then permission. Just build it.Kevin's Welding Service.Miller Bobcat 250.Millermatic 212.Hypertherm Powermax 600.Victor Journeyman torch set.Speedglas 9000XL
Reply:IT WORKS!!!!!!!!!!check it out.  No gurus needed"Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/
Reply:It's not a matter of asking forgiveness.  it's a matter of the trailer not being strongenough without the sheetmetal sides for support.  If you can get it for free get it and use the parts you can and build you a good frame that will be strong enough to carry what the axles are rated for.I'm a Lover, Fighter, Wild horse Rider, and a pretty good welding man......
Reply:I have not seen Dbar39 on www for some time.  When I built my 14ft enclosed a local trailer fab shop convined me to keep the tongue length to around 45 inches.  He found most people overlaod the trailer and the shorter tongue helped stop stress and still provides ample turning clearance.  We also put a third member from the front of the tongue to a point just in front of the 1st axle....minimum expense for the added support.We kept the tongue weight to about 10% of trailer weight.
Reply:don't know nothing about trailer building that everyone else already knows, but if you don't want that sheetmetal hanging around your yard, i'd be more than happy to drive to mississippi to get it.
Reply:Hey I'm no horse trailer expert (guru). I was ONLY addressing question #6. Sometimes you guys give good thoughtful info. but most of the times just keyboard Kung Fu. Read the post very s-l-o-w-l-y then put your 2 cents in.Kevin's Welding Service.Miller Bobcat 250.Millermatic 212.Hypertherm Powermax 600.Victor Journeyman torch set.Speedglas 9000XL
Reply:Horse pixx dissolves everything it touches.  Not really but beware of well used horse trailers for sale cheap. They deserve a double or triple check out. They can have more rusted out spots in more places than vehicles run on salty hiways.
Reply:Originally Posted by geezerI have not seen Dbar39 on www for some time.
Reply:The link Sam gave has a good example of the axle hanger location, rule of thumb is 60 percent of bed length on bumper pull trailers. Try this for the DOT lighting specs. http://www.redneck-trailer.com  not a big fan of them but they do have some good info.Your local DMV will have to tell you about titles. Tongues are usually 42" to 46" from frame to ball center. 102" max width, 8' is usually standard because some states only allow the 102" on designated hiways only.
Reply:60/40 is a good ratio front to back for axle placement. There is a post by Dabar in the following thread concerning tongue layouts.http://weldingweb.com/vbb/showthread.php...+tongue+designI like the Champion site plans Samm mentioned. They cover lots of bases.And it's true, horse trailers have something similar to a unibody and with the axles pushed all the way back. Not a great frame, but it would make a fine box trailer to customize, unless it's a rusting hulk. Gratuitous picture for the dog & pony show!  Attached ImagesCity of L.A. Structural; Manual & Semi-Automatic;"Surely there is a mine for silver, and a place where gold is refined. Iron is taken from the earth, and copper is smelted from ore."Job 28:1,2Lincoln, Miller, Victor & ISV BibleDanny
Reply:"It Works" refers to my link.  Very often they don't work  I don't know how to paste, so I generally type them by hand."gurus" is meant to be exactly what it says.  Most trailer loads are defined by how you place the load on the trailer.  There is a point of balance.  I think that's pretty much up to the guy that owns the trailer.  Designing to get around incompetence is a losing battle.  You can't out think an inexperienced owner.  I can reinforce something until the cows come home, but I don't think it necessarily makes me a better builder.There seems to be a phobia about trailers.  Gotta be tough to the max.  But we all don't consider the truck pulling it.  The truck is a knife edge, to the point of failure(engineering wise, with overload factors) vehicle.  Take a look at the actual structural members of most vehicles.  Not too much thereI'm over simplifyng, but I hope I get the point across.  Discussion of different metals aside, the average vehicle, if analyzed closely, is an accident waiting to happen.  Yet we trust our lives to them every day without a thought.  Every time I work on a suspension, I'm amazed that it actually takes the abuse it's handed.Just a little food for thought."Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/
Reply:I'm gonna get waxed on this one.  ROFLMAO"Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/
Reply:Ok, sorry about the kung fu comment. Nice dog trailer. Search and rescue?Kevin's Welding Service.Miller Bobcat 250.Millermatic 212.Hypertherm Powermax 600.Victor Journeyman torch set.Speedglas 9000XL
Reply:La Quinta Inn for poochesNo doubt, there's a sauna lurking there somewhere in that trailerI tie a rope to Clarence's neck, put roller skates on his lil' paws, and away we go down the highway"Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/
Reply:Originally Posted by farmersamm"It Works" refers to my link.  Very often they don't work  I don't know how to paste, so I generally type them by hand.
Reply:Originally Posted by duaneb55Gotta look quick - he was on tonight.
Reply:http://www.redneck-trailer.com/2009/J/J2-J4.pdfHere's the link directly to Redneck's lighting information.
Reply:To copy and paste, there is an easier way!Do the left click hold and move mouse to highlight as paweldor has said, but just after that, position your cursor arrow over the highlighted area and "right click" the mouse, a window will pop up, left click on Copy, you have just copied, go to where you want to paste it, position the cursor arrow over that spot, right click the mouse again, that little window will pop up again and then left click on paste.Pretty simple!And as long as you don't click on copy on anything else, you can paste that piece as many times as you like going from one web site to another!#1. If you don't like what I wrote, or if it offends you, then don't read it!#2. I am living life the way I see fit, if you don't like the way I'M living, tough sh**!
Reply:Unless you are wanting to build a trailer that is to its minimal usage of steel to get to its max weight capacity, I wouldn't follow the formulas used by trailer manufacturers!You can use them as a minimum guideline, but I always overbuild mine compared to what a manufacturer would.I don't like using the beds frame as the main frame, I use a full length main frame to attach the axles and tongue to, and then build the frame for the bed on top of the main frame, I do this because I do not like my trailer to wobble  and flex as I am going down the road!A good rule of thumb I follow for the tongue length is 4' as a base starting point, and adjust a few inches in or out depending on the size of the trailer "Width and length" and as stated above, 60% forward and 40% behind the center of what ever type axle arrangement you are using, measured from the front to the back of the bed area!Keep in mind that a manufactured 7000 lb trailer will not have a payload capacity of 7000 lbs, the weight of the trailer itself will use up a good portion of that capacity, so if you plan on having something for example, like a 7000 lb payload capacity, don't buy 2 3500 lb axles, you would need more like 2 5000 lb axles and figure in the weight of the trailer, deduct it and what is left will be your payload capacity!If you need to know the requirements for the lights, check out the D.O.T lighting requirements at the U.S department of transportation web site!All states are different when it comes to titling, registering and plating trailers, here in Indiana, you call your local police office and request a police check and have the officer verify that there isn't any VIN numbers already on the trailer, take that along with reciepts for materials used to the DMV and file a request for VIN, pay the $10.00, wait a few weeks for the VIN to arrive, stamp the VIN into the tongue, call and request another police check to verify that you did stamp the VIN, take that one to the DMV and pay for the title and registration and plate and there you go!Good luck!Ken.#1. If you don't like what I wrote, or if it offends you, then don't read it!#2. I am living life the way I see fit, if you don't like the way I'M living, tough sh**!
Reply:Thanks for all the help.  One last thing, does the 60/40 rule include the tongue length or just the bed?Bed. 192" x 60% =115.2" center of center hanger on a tandem. Round off to 115 if you want to
Reply:Just the bed!#1. If you don't like what I wrote, or if it offends you, then don't read it!#2. I am living life the way I see fit, if you don't like the way I'M living, tough sh**!