Step Up Transformer

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New to welding and am looking for some input.  I am looking for a good welder for hobby use. Is it possible to plug a 220v welder into a step up transformer and be able to weld?  I currently dont have 220 in my garage and really want to start welding.  I am in the military and live on base so adding 220 to the garage is not possible right now.  Thanks,Chad
Reply:Hi Chad... Welcome to the WeldingWeb!It's not really possible because of the power requirements of a 230 volt welder.A typical transformer-based 230 volt welder will draw about 30 amps while welding.Power = 230 volts x 30 amps = 6,900 watts.The largest 115 to 230 volt step up transformers I have seen were about 1,500 to 2,000 watts - far short of meeting that 6,900 watt requirement.The most power you have available on a 115 volt circuit is usually 15 amps (1725 watts) using a 15 amp breaker and #14 AWG size wire.  An oversize circuit may use a 20 amp breaker and #12 wire to deliver 20 amps (2300 watts).  Still far short of the typical 230 volt welder requirement.Perhaps a better approach is go for a high efficiency inverter that can operate on 115 volts (and perhaps 230 volts as well).  I have a typical 115 volt inverter and it puts out about 25 volts at 80 amps - good enough to weld with 3/32 inch diameter electrodes - but it runs off a 20 amp, 115 volt circuit..The best brand names. like Miller, have some dual voltage welders that can put out close to 100 amps operating off 115 volt 20 amp circuit and on a 230 volt circuit can put out 150+ amps.I'm certain other will chime in here with similar suggestions.... but the step up transformer is not going to cut it and there are better ways to proceed.Last edited by Rick V; 10-08-2011 at 09:47 PM.Reason: Spell errorRick V 1 Airco Heliwelder 3A/DDR3 CTC 70/90 amp Stick/Tig Inverters in Parallel1 Lincoln MIG PAK 151 Oxy-Acet
Reply:short answer- no. 220 volts is acheived by having two hot legs of power (with ground) available. a step up transformer on a standard outlet would still only have access to one leg of power plus a neutral. it won't work. You could look into getting a dual voltage machine though. That way you can plug and play now, and have the 220 volt option for the future.(to get a little more technical, it is possible to step up 120 to 220, on a standard outlet you would have 220 to ground on one leg. for the welder to function, you need two hot legs (220 between the legs, 120 to ground or neutral on each legs). Another way to explain it, you cannot turn a circuit on a single pole breaker, into a two pole circuit. not possible)Last edited by Birdwell4; 10-08-2011 at 09:50 PM.Reason: technical info
Reply:You would do better to see if you have a 240 outlet for an electric stove or a dryer.
Reply:Originally Posted by BlueweldersYou would do better to see if you have a 240 outlet for an electric stove or a dryer.
Reply:DSW got the right idea. Either the extension cord from another 220 VAC service in the house or use the services on the base. Probably something there in terms of welding. You can just buy the extension cords, they are available. usually 25' or 50'. Might have to monkey around and make yourself a "Cheater Rig" to plug in where ever. Just a short chunk of cord with plugs / jacks of the right persuasion so nothing in the house needs to be changed.Technically you could get a transformer. All you need is a step up 110 / 220 VAC with the secondary center tapped. But it will probably just get you in trouble. Not enough capacity in most 110 Vac circuits to support major projects, or even some other welders / methods, you probably got 20 amps at best. 30 amps at the most out there in the garage.Or for just messing around you can get one of the 115 VAC "Buzz box" stick welders. They will do the smaller rods. Could do that directly out in the garage off the 115 VAC. Want to pay attention to the duty cycle. Some are like 10% but if they have auto shutdown ain't to bad. You didn't say if you actually have a welder yet.You didn't say what you really want to do. That makes a bit of different. Just use some common sense and don't get into trouble. I might also check and see if it is allowed in military housing. Got to follow the rules.
Reply:a step up transformer would limit you to to just 10 amps or less at 220va better option would be to find 2 outlets on separate 110v legs of power. that would give you twice the power of a step-up transformer at 20 amps.extension cord running to an electric dryer plug would give 30 amps, and one running to a range would give you 50 amps.Is your panel right in the garage?  I'd just pop in a 50 amp breaker wired to a plug, then remove everything fill the hole with a couple cheap 20amp breakers when it time to leave.
Reply:With 'on base' housing a lot may depend on when it was built. Post war (50's) stuff the elctrical was sized for a light bulb in each room. Who knows what the service panel looks like. Can't put breakers in a fuse box."The things that will destroy America are prosperity at any price, peace at any price, safety first instead of duty first, the love of soft living and the get rich quick theory of life." -Theodore Roosevelt
Reply:Originally Posted by Grooa step up transformer would limit you to to just 10 amps or less at 220va better option would be to find 2 outlets on separate 110v legs of power. that would give you twice the power of a step-up transformer at 20 amps.extension cord running to an electric dryer plug would give 30 amps, and one running to a range would give you 50 amps.Is your panel right in the garage?  I'd just pop in a 50 amp breaker wired to a plug, then remove everything fill the hole with a couple cheap 20amp breakers when it time to leave.
Reply:Just because "Don't Ask. Don't Tell" was repealed doesn't mean you have to tell  Has anyone ever asked you if you added a new circuit, when you checked out of a place before?I've never been in the Military, but I wouldn't bat an eye about doing what I suggested in a rental. I was also suggesting it only if it was a real convenient set-up to do so with the panel right there with empty or unused breakers. What I was suggesting was not a jury rig either. That would be the proper way of doing things.If that is not an option, there is always the 220v extension cord idea. If that won't fly, how about an engine driven welder?My 2-leg idea would hardly be my first choice. I only said it was better than a step-up transformer. I bet the 2-leg thing would power a 180 class machine though. That suggestion was a jury rig. I'll grant you that one, but I don't see the potential harm in it, unless you wiring job starts a fire, but that should be no more likely than with a lamp.Don't worry so much about "What happens if things go wrong?" Thing go wrong all the time even if we do everything right. That is why we have insurance Last edited by Groo; 10-09-2011 at 10:58 PM.
Reply:Don't worry so much about "What happens if things go wrong?" Thing go wrong all the time even if we do everything right. That is why we have insurance
Reply:Originally Posted by WeldingMachineAttitudes like that are why insurance currently costs what it does...
Reply:As a practical matter, the idea was good (better than many of my own) but it will not work.To get an output of 40 Amps at 220 volts, in basic round numbers you wil need an input of 80 Amps at 110 volts [actually more because the transformer is less than 100% efficent].  Keep thinking, you will come up with a good idea; sometime.I offer three choices: Good, Fast, & Cheap. You may pick two.Hobart AC/DC StikMate LXHarbor Freight AD HoodHarbor Freight Industrial Chop SawDeVilbis 20 Gallon, 5 HP Compressor
Reply:Originally Posted by catmshtr89New to welding and am looking for some input.  I am looking for a good welder for hobby use. Is it possible to plug a 220v welder into a step up transformer and be able to weld?  I currently dont have 220 in my garage and really want to start welding.  I am in the military and live on base so adding 220 to the garage is not possible right now.  Thanks,Chad
Reply:OK.  I have decided to purchase a welder.  I am at and impass as to which one.  I have narrowed it down to a Hobart 140 and an Eastwood 175.  My next question is, I have the outlet in the picture that I can use.  It is a 30-amp 125/250v outlet.  I am assuming I will have to re-wire the welder for the plug.  Am I correct in my assumption?  Thanks for your help.  Im glad I came accross this site. Attached Images
Reply:SorryLast edited by catmshtr89; 10-11-2011 at 11:29 PM.Reason: Dual Post
Reply:No, you don't have to mess with the welder, best not too.You can just make up a cheater cord that will allow you to mate the welder to a dryer outlet. Below is a typical way to do it. First pix shows the cheater cord, 30 amp dryer plug / cord set up with a 50 amp box on the other end. Second pix shows a typical 220 VAC extension cord, all 50 amp service rated. This is a commercial bought cord for the service.Last two pixs show typical way to use it. Plug welder into extension cord if required, plug extension cord into cheater cord, 50 amp end, plug cheater into dryer outlet. Optional to use the entension cord, depending on the location.This will give you 30 amps safely to the welder. Everything is protected just like using the dryer, cords are sized to accept 30 amps in all places. There are no real safety issues. When / if the breaker trips, you have reached the limits of what the welder can be set up to do.Cavet: You should only do this in a location where the rules allow it. Example - I can use this to weld over at my girlfriends house, friends, etc. Some locations may ban the activity no matter how you have it wired. Must know and follow the rules. Attached Images
Reply:You'll probably need an extension cord any way so might as well buy 25' of SO or SJO cord and put the Dryer plug on one end and the Welder 6-50r on the other end.Ed Conleyhttp://www.screamingbroccoli.com/MM252MM211 (Sold)Passport Plus & Spool gunLincoln SP135 Plus- (Gone to a good home)Klutch 120v Plasma cutterSO 2020 benderBeer in the fridge
Reply:Originally Posted by Birdwell4short answer- no. 220 volts is acheived by having two hot legs of power (with ground) available. a step up transformer on a standard outlet would still only have access to one leg of power plus a neutral. it won't work. You could look into getting a dual voltage machine though. That way you can plug and play now, and have the 220 volt option for the future.(to get a little more technical, it is possible to step up 120 to 220, on a standard outlet you would have 220 to ground on one leg. for the welder to function, you need two hot legs (220 between the legs, 120 to ground or neutral on each legs). Another way to explain it, you cannot turn a circuit on a single pole breaker, into a two pole circuit. not possible)
Reply:catmshtr89   Ed's suggestion about making the extension cord and simply using the 30 amp plug on the one end to fit your outlet and a 50 amp one on the other to fit the welder is the way I did it when I was running a 220v welder at the apartment. That's the best way to go rather than messing with the welders plug.As far as you choice for the machine, here's my thoughts. The Hobart HH140 is a nice machine, but it's only 110v capable. That will limit you to sheet metal for the most part. Despite what the manufacturer claims in their literature, it will do up to 1/8" steel under real world conditions, but with a very short duty cycle. You would be better off choosing a 220v capable machine instead.Personally I'm not a big fan of the import machines like the Eastwood. Been down that road when I first started and found out that despite what the sales people want to claim, parts and repairs are next to impossible to get. If you have a mechanical issue with the machine once the warranty is up, and you are not fairly handy at hunting down substitute parts and doing the repairs yourself with no repair manual, figure it's a disposable machine. When it breaks, you trash it and buy a new one. Thats not the case with name brand machines like Hobart, Miller and Lincoln. Personally if I was on a budget, I'd look at one of the 220v Hobarts for a 1st machine. Northern tool still lists the HH187 for $680, and the newer replacement for it the HH190 for $850. I'd go with the HH187 myself if price was a critical factor. Lots of guys here have used them and they are a nice machine.You might also want to keep an eye on CL and see what you find used. It's usually not to hard to find nice inexpensive stick machines on CL. Migs are a bit more difficult, but if you look, they show up, just not as frequently. A good CL aggregator like crazedlist or searchtempest will help. I use searchtempest and put in "welder" and the go thru the results myself to see if there's any thing I'm interested in in say a 150-250 mile radius..No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:Originally Posted by GuardrailThis is not correct, a 220 welder will run just fine with one neutral leg and one 220v leg.
Reply:Instead of a 110 machine, at least get a dual input machine or the Hobart battery machine.http://www.hobartwelders.com/product...wered/trek180/http://www.lincolnelectric.com/en-us...roduct=K3018-1http://www.millerwelds.com/products/...p?model=M00245http://www.millerwelds.com/products/...p?model=M00197Of these, you'll probably get the most performance out of the Hobart on 110 because the 110 is just for charging the battery, it is battery powered, not wall plug powered, so it wont be crippled on 110v powerI have had a 110 machine for years. I am not impressed with it. I recently went for a miller 252If you go the 220v machine route, just get some SOOW cord in 6/3 or 8/3 put your dryer plug on 1 end and stick a welder outlet on the other end.here is a decent source for SOOWhttp://www.wireandcabletogo.com/Port...0V-Non-UL.htmlhome depot is another sourcehttp://www.homedepot.com/Electrical/...atalogId=10053RV extension cords would be another sourceLast edited by Groo; 10-12-2011 at 02:12 PM.