What am I going to weld? A story...

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So, I just have to post this where people will understand.  I started out with a John Deere tractor I wanted to trade for a TIG welder (I couldn't sell it.)  Dad died in 1998, he worked in Mobile, AL in the summertime (between college to be an engineer) as a welding apprentice in the shipyard.  Not a very good job.  As I grew up, he had a stick welder, and was pretty good at it from his summer job.  Every time we wanted to stick aluminum or stainless together, he would say "We would need a 'heliarc' for that."  Since I was a kid, I always wanted one of those exotic machines.So, I started researching TIG welders, figuring out what the good ones are, what the bad ones are, American versus Chinese, 110V versus 220V, high frequency, DC, AC, pulse, preflow, post-flow, water versus air cooled.  I had to know when someone came with a trade that I'd get something equivalent to my tractor.  It kinda became an addiction.I found a welder on Craigslist, 300 miles from Nashville, an Airco 350 amp single phase TIG, built in water cooler, high frequency, pulse, for $1500.  I hadn't seen this one.  But it was way overkill, but had all the advanced features for welding exotic metals, thick or thin.  When I went to researching it, I found it on ebay too!  $450 and he didn't mention the word TIG anywhere in the listing.  So I bid on it, even after only finding that Airco OEM'ed Lincolns, Millers and ESAB - exotic!  You can't imagine how excited I was when I bid $450 on it and won!  So I emailed the guy to make sure it would fit in my Honda Element.  He then informed me that it weighed 950 pounds, 5' long, >4' high with the cart.  Oh crap.  So, I decided I'd ask the guy if he'd deliver it.  He said he would, but that was going to be $250.  After waiting for it for a month, I figured I'd switch to plan B.  I'd rent a pickup and go get it.Oh, now I need an argon tank!  I had been eyeballing them too.  I found one 150 miles into my trip, a 286cf tank brand new!  Apparently the guy was injured and couldn't TIG anymore.  He was getting rid of his owned bottles for cheap!  So that's working out.So on Friday when I pick it up (took a day off from work), the seller has a forklift and is going to load it in my rental pickup.  When I get it back home, I have a buddy with a barn and a chain hoist, I have another less reliable friend with an engine hoist.  We'll get it out of the truck somehow.  It's going to live in my small home garage.Tonight, I'm three days from my journey to go get my giant argon tank and the huge Airco TIG welder with every feature you'd ever want, and I'm tickled to death.  I'm watching Youtube videos on how to weld all kinds of metals.  I'm reading about filler rods.  I'm talking about it at work (I work on computer networks for a living) and I'm driving everyone crazy.The most common question I get from my white collar friends is "what are you going to weld?"  My answer has become "I don't know.  I need to learn to weld first, then I'll tell you what I'm going to build."  Then everyone thinks, and they say "Oh, I have something that needs to be welded."  I tell them that's the point.So, my wife thinks I've totally gone crazy this time, my friends think I'm nuts, only a small number of my friends understand (and at least one is sharing my enthusiasm - he's building a "velo bike" with electric motors from scratch.)  All I can think about is TIG welding.  Everything except this has become boring.Come on Friday!  OK, so my question is, what's my first project?  Maybe I'll make something for my tractor - it's still sitting there!Junky Airco Heliwelder 350 TIG (ESAB)Hobart Beta-MIG 250 with Miget spool gunJunky LTec 225 MIGESAB PowerCut plasma cutterOA welding and cutting"Better grinder than a welder."
Reply:I have the same illness.  A firewood rack or welding table are good first projects.  Just don't start with something you will hurt yourself or others with ( ie a trailer for road use).Hate to burst your bubble, but I realized when I got my TIG why welding was a craftsman profession.  I thought after a few hours and reading I could master it. Heed the advice on the forum.  Start with steel coupons/drops and work up from there.  I went out and bought a bunch of aluminum tubing to build some racks for overhead storage in my garage.  I was pipe dreaming.  My mind saw this beautiful rack, but my hands made blobs of melted aluminum.TA Arcmaster 300CM3XMT 304S22P12 suitcase feederX-Treme 12VSOptima pulserTA161SMaxstar 150STLHypertherm PM45OP setupStihl 020AVP, 039, 066 Magnum
Reply:Ha!  Thanks for that advice!  And I'm glad someone can sympathize.  And I'll stay away from projects that have life safety implications.  I've been working with Oxy/Acetylene for a couple of months on dozens of coupons.  The guys in the LWS say the transition is pretty painless.  Next stop will be the community college if I don't get anywhere.  I also bumped into a guy when I was trying to trade my tractor that teaches welding.  I might pay him to come over for a couple of hours of one-on-one.  I'll probaby blog on my website and share my failures and successes.Junky Airco Heliwelder 350 TIG (ESAB)Hobart Beta-MIG 250 with Miget spool gunJunky LTec 225 MIGESAB PowerCut plasma cutterOA welding and cutting"Better grinder than a welder."
Reply:Originally Posted by patclemHa!  Thanks for that advice!  And I'm glad someone can sympathize.  And I'll stay away from projects that have life safety implications.  I've been working with Oxy/Acetylene for a couple of months on dozens of coupons.  The guys in the LWS say the transition is pretty painless.  Next stop will be the community college if I don't get anywhere.  I also bumped into a guy when I was trying to trade my tractor that teaches welding.  I might pay him to come over for a couple of hours of one-on-one.  I'll probaby blog on my website and share my failures and successes.
Reply:First project is going to be to hire an electrician to upgrade your garages service panel!! I would say go nuts and sit down one day and dont stop laying beads till they look right, get a piece of 1/8" plate and cover it, once its covered turn it 90* and go across the beads you just put down. Youll pick it up pretty quick
Reply:Good morning, Patclem.Welcome to the WeldingWeb forum. There is a lot of valuble information here, but sometimes you have to dig it out and cull some of the comments. Welders, as a rule, are some pretty tough guys and they will want to take your measure. Just keep asking good questions, research to see if the question has already been asked a million times, post some pictures, and most of all be honest about your ability. Most of the professional welders and guys with years of experience are very eager to help you learn.I also work at a desk job for a living, but have enjoyed welding for going on 5 years now. And yes, I spend a lot of my time thinking about how I'd rather be welding something. The projects will come along as your skills increase. It seems most of my welding is done on things for my shop - welding tables, tool stands, etc. But that's ok, the point is not to close down all the welding fabricators and manufacturers around the world because they can always do it cheaper and better anyway. The point is you enjoy getting dirty, doing something creative, and learning a new skill.And beware - welding is addictive. I started with a 110V MIG, then traded and bought new and used equipment until I have the equipment to do much more than my skill level allows. I recently acquired a couple of TIG torches and am trying to learn scratch-start TIG with my Thunderbolt. Boy, is it fun. Hard, but fun. Makes you admire and respect the guys that do such great work.Just fire that baby up, and start burning metal. You will probably burn a lot of it before you start getting good at it.    Burt _____________________Miller Syncrowave 250Millermatic 211Miller 375 Plasma Cutter Hobart Handler 12010FtDrillBit.com
Reply:Airco is a long gone company but I think you will find you have a Miller in an orange suit. Most of these were made by Miller and parts should be available if needed. So for 450 you have a very nice and competent machine. It will also arc weld if you don't already realize that."Si Vis Pacem Para Bellum"Lincoln Idealarc 250 AC/DCMillermatic 251   Syncrowave 300   30A spoolgunLincoln MP210Hypertherm 45(2) LN 25(2) Lincoln Weldanpower 225 CV(4) SA200   1 short hood    SA250    SAM 400
Reply:Cool story. I am self taught tig welder and do just fine. I also was extremely excited to get a tig many years ago and it only took me about a week to make a strong joint. Took many months to get some nice beads. I don't use it as much these days and it takes some practice before I due a cosmetic weld to make sure everything looks uniform. You will get the hang of it as long as you are patient and not expecting results immediately. Good luckMillermatic 252Lincoln 175 plusTA 185tswTA 161stlhypertherm pmax 45Victor torchHenrob torchAn S10 for each day of the week
Reply:Thanks for the replies and encouragement.  I have a 200amp service to my house, and I'm going to wire that sucker straight into it, probably with a 50 amp breaker, at least for now.  If I'm going to weld something thick, I'll have to install a bigger breaker, then go shut the air conditioner and lights off!  I think I have a pretty new transformer on the pole.  LOL!I've already picked up some cutoffs at a local metal supply, so I'm ready to practice.  But boy do I hate mill scale - discovered that with OA.  All a wire brush in the grinder does is polishes it.  Glad it's getting cold here so I can warm my garage with amps.  LOL!I've already picked up a bunch of tools for other projects - angle grinder, cutoff saw, etc.  I'll probably pick up a little bench grinder with a fine grit wheel for grinding tungsten.  I'll probably end up at the LWS for torch supplies until I figure out how to buy some of it online.Over the weekend, I went to see a guy about a couple of auto-dark helmets - one is a Jackson.  $100 for two, and he threw in a stick welder.  It's an Airco 225amp (rebranded Miller Thunderbolt.)  I figure I'll trade it to someone for some tool I find I'll need since I'm gonna have the 350.I'm sure my dad would be tickled to know I was getting a "heli-arc"!Junky Airco Heliwelder 350 TIG (ESAB)Hobart Beta-MIG 250 with Miget spool gunJunky LTec 225 MIGESAB PowerCut plasma cutterOA welding and cutting"Better grinder than a welder."
Reply:admitting the addiction is the first step in enabling the problem. I'm a welding addict. Have been since the first time I lit metal on fire. I have no intentions of fixing this problem. I would much prefer to encourage it and feed the moster that is my addiction. Welcome, and enjoy the ride, because there's no going back once it's started.There are no problems. There are only solutions. It's your duty to determine the right one.Hobart Handler 210Airco 225 Amp MSM Stinger
Reply:If you are going to run a breaker for your new welder make sure you put a large enough one in.  I have a 200 amp feed to the house.  I just ran a 100 amp sub panel off of the main panel to the other side of my garage to feed my Syncro 250 and Weld Pak 175 and anything else I decide needs power over there.  It was cheaper than running 5 or 6 circuits.  50 amps seems too small.  Good deals are out there and it sounds like you scored.  You just have to be patient and buy things when you find them.  Look around for a local fab shop that will let you "borrow" their scrap.  Weld on it and then bring it back.  Its a win win because their scrap weighs more when they get it back.
Reply:I think his plan is to run a 50 amp breaker off his existing pannel and then wire the welder directly to the pannel.There are no problems. There are only solutions. It's your duty to determine the right one.Hobart Handler 210Airco 225 Amp MSM Stinger
Reply:Assuming the welder is like a syncrowave 350, the recommended breaker size is probably on the order of 125 or 150 Amps!!!If you do wire it up with a 50 Amp breaker, you will probably be OK if the machine starts up.  If the machine powers on and immediately pops the breaker, it could be just the in-rush (power on) current.If it powers on, just make sure you keep a short arc.  If you stick weld with higher amps on AC, you might just pop the breaker when you trying to break the arc at higher current levels.Bottom line, if you can get it go at 50 Amps, you should be fine.  The only issue is if you need a bigger breaker, you also need bigger wire and you more or less wasted all that 6 gauge wire.   If there is a way to roll it up to the fuse panel, do that and test it out.  If you do need to go with a bigger breaker, save you some money doing it right the first time.Con Fuse!Miller Dynasty 350Millermatic 350P-Spoolmatic 30AMiller Multimatic 200Hypertherm PowerMax 1000G3Miller Maxstar 200DX
Reply:ha, this sounds like when I was looking for an extra tig welder... I found a miller  330 a/bp at a great price on craigslist... called the guy up & said hey, I want this welder, I'm coming to pick it up  guy warns me it's big & heavy, make sure you bring some muscle... yeah, that was an understatement to say the least. probably similar to what your dealing with, around 900lbs & around the size of a refrigerator... man it was a trip getting that thing into my buddies pickup... thank god the guy had a loading dock that we were able to descend the welder from instead of lifting it cause that just wasn't going to happen, even with the 5 extra guys I winded getting to help anyway, as far as your power. if you have a 200a service & you can go to the panel for this hookup, I'd say to just use a 100a breaker... you will never ever draw that kind of amperage at a continuous load but having the larger breaker will make sure it doesn't trip on the heavy spike loads of start up & stuff... there is no reason why you can't use a 100a breaker for this & not have to worry about tripping a 50 from time to time...  also depending on the length of the run a #6 wire may be adequate. for welders I think it is considered ok to use a wire gauge that is smaller than the breaker would otherwise dictate. this is because in a welding circuit the constant draw will be much less than the occasional spikes. as far as I know, even to code you are able to use a smaller wire with a larger breaker for a welding circuit. can't rattle off all the specifics but I'm pretty sure this is true on welding circuits. I have my big welder on 100A breaker & it's run with ~25' of #6's, never had a problem, never overheated the wires & have had some shorter bursts of maxing this thing out at the full 450 amps, but at full blast it just blows holes in everything anyway  still never tripped the 100A breaker even once ...miller 330a bp TIGmiller dynasty 200DX TIGmillermatic 185 MIGthermal dynamics cutmaster 101 plasma cuttersnap-on YA5550 plasma cutterhypertherm powermax 30 plasma cutterbaileigh CS225 cold sawetc....
Reply:Welcome to the sickness, not only for welding but for fabrication also.....Lincoln pro mig 180Lincoln Square Wave Tig 300/wp 20/home built water cooler Victor, Purox, Harris, O/A welding/cutting setupsVintage Craftsman drill pressVintage Craftsman/Atlas 12"x 36'' lathe7''x 12'' w/c band saw Everlast 140 st
Reply:That's great.  Sometimes you just have to 'do'.  Most of my friends don't understand why I weld and tinker and build things.  They would much rather make a phone call and have it done...but sometimes I make them second guess themselves when I do it in a fraction of the time for a fraction of the cost.  There's also that satisfaction of having something exactly the way you want or just knowing that you built it.  Can't put a price on that.  I made my wife a believer the first time I brought home 'junk' and turned it into one of the nicest pieces of furniture in our house.
Reply:Originally Posted by roadkillbobbyou better hurry and get help with that disease, cause the next phase is ALL the tools you will want to go with that welder and there LOTS of them.....
Reply:Originally Posted by dumb as a stumpthen new more understanding wife etc DUDE tread carefully you are on a slippery slope. proceed with caution the toys "cost" more then they appear.
Reply:You guys are funny.  Yes, the incidentals do add up.  Mask, gloves, breakers, rental truck, rods, argon tank, argon fill (found I can fill a 286cf bottle for $53 - maybe the last bottle I will ever need!  Ha.)  Thanks for the advice on the breaker.  I'll see about squeezing one into my panel.  Tomorrow my journey begins after I get off from my real job.  Pick up the rental truck, 2 hours to Cookeville for the night at relatives (shave a few hours off my trip.) Friday morning, first stop Knoxville and pick up my argon bottle (used of course), on to pick up the welder in Bristol.  Back to Johnson City for lunch with a friend, then drive back home.  Don the steel toed boots and begin the unload!  Ha.  Haven't heard from my neighbor with the "swing set."My wife is asking if I'm excited about going to get my welder.  That's a good sign!  Ha!  If she was pissed, she wouldn't bring it up.Junky Airco Heliwelder 350 TIG (ESAB)Hobart Beta-MIG 250 with Miget spool gunJunky LTec 225 MIGESAB PowerCut plasma cutterOA welding and cutting"Better grinder than a welder."
Reply:When, my wife says, "you must be really excited about that", then I know I  have to reevaluate my plans.    Look forward to your project posts.Last edited by tapwelder; 10-27-2011 at 12:35 AM.
Reply:Steel toed boots won't save your toes, that machine is gonna mash steel toes flat as sheet metal if you let it! Stay out fromunda it!Take pictures man!! City of L.A. Structural; Manual & Semi-Automatic;"Surely there is a mine for silver, and a place where gold is refined. Iron is taken from the earth, and copper is smelted from ore."Job 28:1,2Lincoln, Miller, Victor & ISV BibleDanny
Reply:Just explain to the wife that you could be out at a bar with your friends instead of in the garage on a weekend night.  After the first few times you point this out, they kinda get it.TA Arcmaster 300CM3XMT 304S22P12 suitcase feederX-Treme 12VSOptima pulserTA161SMaxstar 150STLHypertherm PM45OP setupStihl 020AVP, 039, 066 Magnum
Reply:Originally Posted by patclemMy wife is asking if I'm excited about going to get my welder.  That's a good sign!  Ha!  If she was pissed, she wouldn't bring it up.
Reply:Originally Posted by Drf255Just explain to the wife that you could be out at a bar with your friends instead of in the garage on a weekend night.  After the first few times you point this out, they kinda get it.
Reply:Wait until you all see all the other metal working tools your gonna be wanting soon!So I finally got it back to Nashville last night, after a long day of driving in the rain.  Found out most of the size and weight was because of a humongous cart they had it mounted to.  It was like an industrial trailer, looked kinda like something they drag around behind one of those Tug things at the airport.  That thing got left in Bristol, so first project is going to be a cart.  It's on a furniture dolly right now, seems to be barely working.  The guy that loaded it said the forklift scale showed about 800lbs. Here are some actual detail pictures, still in my buddy's barn.  http://www.flickr.com/photos/2385599...7627876513197/Quickest thing to notice is it's made by ESAB.  Must be one of the first ESAB's they made directly under the Airco brand.  Now I'm hunting a manual for it.  Because I have some questions:First, you'll see it has all the water pump control switches, outputs, and even has a switch wired up as a remote pump control (which I'm gonna do different.)  But it also has a red and blue hose out the back, which I guess should hook to an external tank/radiator?  If that's the case, I guess I need to rig up some kind of temporary tank until I can do something cool.  There's also a small access panel in one corner that warns to use Glycol-bla-bla-bla, but there's nothing in there.  Maybe it's an optional tank that's not there.  One of the guys there looked puzzled and said he'd "never put coolant in it."Anyhow, today's job is to borrow my buddy's trailer, get it to my house, hook it up and melt some metal.Junky Airco Heliwelder 350 TIG (ESAB)Hobart Beta-MIG 250 with Miget spool gunJunky LTec 225 MIGESAB PowerCut plasma cutterOA welding and cutting"Better grinder than a welder."
Reply:OK, so last night, I finally got the welder hooked up, the gas hooked up, didn't have any TIG supplies (tungsten, cups, collet, etc.)  So, I connected a stinger and the machine stick welds perfectly.  That's the good news.Bad news is, today I got the tungsten, collets, cups.  Switched the machine to TIG and I can't get a spark.    Can't get gas to flow when I push the pedal either.  However, I do not have water flowing.  I took the cover off, no pump.  It uses an external cooler, the water pump switch only operates a water valve.  I searched for anything that resembled a sensor that would tell whether the water was flowing or not, preventing the torch from firing up.  There doesn't appear to be one.  I switched "current control" from remote to local. I switched HF from DC to AC to off.  I tried AC and DC.  I tried hot start and crater fill in different positions.  I tried low current, high current, low range and high range.I Ohm'ed the pedal out - found pins that varied with the foot pedal, found another tied to the switch (infinity to zero with the lightest pedal push.)  Guess I need to open the cover up and start hunting a bad relay?  Or maybe I'll email the seller and try to understand what the problem is.Or, it could be a dirty or bad connection at the pedal.  Looks like the pedal connector was bumped at one time or another, ever so slightly bent.  Guess I could make sure the pedal has continuity all the way back through the connector.So, I'm back here looking for suggestions.  Why no spark - anything I can try?  >Junky Airco Heliwelder 350 TIG (ESAB)Hobart Beta-MIG 250 with Miget spool gunJunky LTec 225 MIGESAB PowerCut plasma cutterOA welding and cutting"Better grinder than a welder."
Reply:It just dawned on me.  The guy that sold it to me didn't recall putting any coolant in it.  I think I need to ohm the torch out.  Maybe he burned the torch out.Junky Airco Heliwelder 350 TIG (ESAB)Hobart Beta-MIG 250 with Miget spool gunJunky LTec 225 MIGESAB PowerCut plasma cutterOA welding and cutting"Better grinder than a welder."
Reply:Originally Posted by patclemIt just dawned on me.  The guy that sold it to me didn't recall putting any coolant in it.  I think I need to ohm the torch out.  Maybe he burned the torch out.
Reply:Pics of the inside would help, especially of the water lines. Sorry to hear you are having issues, as I know how excited you were to get this rig.It certainly seems as though it could be expecting wafer flow. Can you at least hook up to a garden hose and route the discharge outside as a temporary test?Lincoln Idealarc 250 (circa 1962)Lincoln Weldpak 155 w/Mig KitLincoln Squarewave TIG 175
Reply:Seems very odd you have NO power to the tig torch.  Is there a GTAW/SMAW switch on your machine?  If there isnt, you should have power to that torch if you had power to your stinger.  I guess it's possible you could have some safety that disables output when cooler is off.   I'd personally disconnect the cooler and try things one at a time to narrow down the problem.  Are you sure you hooked your torch up right and have the Argon on?If its a 17 series torch, just threading it into the gas out port will result in no power to the torch.  Post as many pics as possible.  The great news is that it worked in stick, so there shouldnt be some insane problem.Last edited by Drf255; 11-02-2011 at 06:34 AM.TA Arcmaster 300CM3XMT 304S22P12 suitcase feederX-Treme 12VSOptima pulserTA161SMaxstar 150STLHypertherm PM45OP setupStihl 020AVP, 039, 066 Magnum
Reply:Well, at about midnight last night, I finally got the tiniest spark.  Yes, it does have a GTAW/SMAW switch, and the switch is bad.  It essentially energizes a large contactor (relay) that energizes the TIG side.  It's so flaky that I don't think it's pulling the contactor down solid.  After I adjusted the gaps (used .008 for lack of better) I was able to switch from SMAW to GTAW, the HF would start, I would put the torch to metal and then the spark would fade and the HF would quit.  At that point, the contactor had opened.So I'm on the search for a switch this morning, and that sucker is hard to find.  It's a DPDT switch, PCB mounted (C&K 7201 U21 V6.  7201=on/on, U21=PCB with support bracket, V6=.460" height)  I did find a DPDT on/on with lugs locally, panel mount, so I can probably do some crap-tech engineering to make it workif I have to.  Tonight, I think I'm going to short the switch out with some alligator clips and see if I can get the thing to make sparks.I also called arc-products this morning to see if they could help.  The lady was really nice, but they couldn't find any of my model or part numbers.Oh, and I have a ton of pictures here: http://www.flickr.com/photos/2385599...7627876513197/  I have more of the insides that I need to add to the set.Junky Airco Heliwelder 350 TIG (ESAB)Hobart Beta-MIG 250 with Miget spool gunJunky LTec 225 MIGESAB PowerCut plasma cutterOA welding and cutting"Better grinder than a welder."
Reply:check your pm
Reply:PCB mounted switch should be easy to find. I just found some at Mouser electronics. There's a rigHt angle dpdt on-on listed.Some times , you can carefully disassemble those little switches and clean them up if they aren't broken.PapaLincoln Idealarc 250 (circa 1962)Lincoln Weldpak 155 w/Mig KitLincoln Squarewave TIG 175
Reply:Well, the switch kinda goes around in circles instead of up and down.  It may have gotten bumped in transport, or maybe it wore out.  Finally found the switch at Newark, or at least I think I did.  It's a total investment of something like $4.  I ordered the lugged version too in case I need to "rig" something in.Didn't get a PM.Junky Airco Heliwelder 350 TIG (ESAB)Hobart Beta-MIG 250 with Miget spool gunJunky LTec 225 MIGESAB PowerCut plasma cutterOA welding and cutting"Better grinder than a welder."
Reply:Start getting any training you can. Soon.The welding machine is worthless without the training.AWS certified welding inspectorAWS certified welder
Reply:Alright, dumb question, but what is a TWO-STROKE / FOUR-STROKE switch, and how does it affect TIG welding?  According to a manual that arc-products sent me, two-stroke "makes the torch behave as an on/off switch" and four-stroke means it has a push-button actuator that starts the up-slope, pushing again causes the downslope.  That said, the manual doesn't line up perfectly with my welder, but it's close.Another dumb question, I have a two-conductor wire that runs out to a switch that was taped on the torch.  The connection has a picture of what looks like a foot pedal.  But, this is in addition to 6 conductors (on a 12-pin connector) for the foot pedal.  I don't get it.Junky Airco Heliwelder 350 TIG (ESAB)Hobart Beta-MIG 250 with Miget spool gunJunky LTec 225 MIGESAB PowerCut plasma cutterOA welding and cutting"Better grinder than a welder."
Reply:First project?A simple tool box.
Reply:OK, in my obsession to get this thing working right, I found this, which looks VERY similar to my machine, except for some slight variations in the position of the lights and connectors.  Pictures of the insides look the same.  http://www.murexwelding.co.uk/manual...CDC260-360.pdfPS - I'm posting some of this for future "researchers" that come along.Junky Airco Heliwelder 350 TIG (ESAB)Hobart Beta-MIG 250 with Miget spool gunJunky LTec 225 MIGESAB PowerCut plasma cutterOA welding and cutting"Better grinder than a welder."
Reply:Well, so after hours of fooling with this thing, still no power on the TIG side.  Here are the symptoms:When I switch it from stick to TIG (toggle switch) the HF will come on only for the time set on down slope / crater fill.  It's hot for that amount of time, then the buzzing stops and the torch goes cold.  Toggling between HF start and continuous makes no difference.  I can't get the TIG side to light up any other way.  The torch switch nor the foot pedal have any effect.  It also appears the gas solenoid is not kicking on either.Thanks to a PM, I contacted a local repair shop for some advice.  He said to troubleshoot it on the HF continuous and see if I can chase it down (I have formal electronics and troubleshooting training, though it was 20 years ago.)   Since the circuit boards on the schematic are basically represented as big empty squares with terminal labels, I can't tell what things are supposed to be doing.  Maybe someone has tricks on what voltages I should expect where.  I understand that I'm supposed to see 70V before the arc starts, and 40V after the arc starts, but that doesn't do me much good when it won't stay started.I also see a "MAIN CONTROL" board that shows a connection down to the SCR's.  I'm assuming that turns the SCR's on and off, or switches them to generate high frequency.What ticks me off is, the seller said it was completely checked out in September at a pro welding shop.     That leads me to think I'm doing something wrong.  The ONLY thing I haven't done is run water through it.  But it doesn't look like the machine has any way to determine if water is flowing.  However, there is a gadget where the water comes in, but I figure it's a solenoid that turns the water on and off.  Since it doesn't have an internal pump like I thought when I bought it, I have fittings on the way to adapt it to my water hose.  I think that's the next step.Junky Airco Heliwelder 350 TIG (ESAB)Hobart Beta-MIG 250 with Miget spool gunJunky LTec 225 MIGESAB PowerCut plasma cutterOA welding and cutting"Better grinder than a welder."
Reply:Danm, I'm thinking through it, and I think that thing is a sensor.  If that's my problem, I'm gonna cry.  Can I short it out to test the theory?Junky Airco Heliwelder 350 TIG (ESAB)Hobart Beta-MIG 250 with Miget spool gunJunky LTec 225 MIGESAB PowerCut plasma cutterOA welding and cutting"Better grinder than a welder."
Reply:Take a picture of said device. Also, I thought you said the front panel switch was bad? It probably is a flow sensor, but best to see a pic anyway.PapaLincoln Idealarc 250 (circa 1962)Lincoln Weldpak 155 w/Mig KitLincoln Squarewave TIG 175
Reply:I'm at my "real job" now, I'll have to post pictures later.  The more I think about this, it has to be a flow sensor.  This thing sits on top of a plumbed tee.  I thought the tee was the valve body.  But I'm seriously doubting it now.  One side electrically connects to a terminal that's shared with the remote torch switch and the gas solenoid.  The other side has its own dedicated terminal on the "slope control board" (front panel with the potentiometers for flow, current, slope, etc.)Yes, the front panel switch is now flaky.  I should have it in the mail today.  But I don't think that's my problem.  I bypassed it with an alligator clip and it didn't give me results.  For that matter, several of the switches are a little "loose."I may try to inject some water into the hoses tonight and see if I can fool it into firing up.  I know, I know.  I can burn the torch up.  But I need it for peace of mind.  Fittings for the water hose are supposed to be here Monday.  I'll probably close it back up on Sunday and stick weld a cart together for the welder.  It's sitting on a furniture dolly right now.  Less than ideal, but minimally functioning.Junky Airco Heliwelder 350 TIG (ESAB)Hobart Beta-MIG 250 with Miget spool gunJunky LTec 225 MIGESAB PowerCut plasma cutterOA welding and cutting"Better grinder than a welder."
Reply:Originally Posted by patclemThe more I think about this, it has to be a flow sensor.  This thing sits on top of a plumbed tee.  I thought the tee was the valve body.  But I'm seriously doubting it now.
Reply:So, my wife thinks I've totally gone crazy this time, my friends think I'm nuts, only a small number of my friends understand
Reply:skinner89, sounds like you bought a new one.  That's probably a good idea, unless this water thing is my problem.  My biggest problem is I don't know WTH I'm doing!  But I stayed at a Holiday Inn Express, and I read it on the Internet.  I'd advise folks to NEVER buy a used welder unless you can see it welding - either when you pick it up, or via a Youtube video or something.  It sure is cool when that spark jumps off the end of that torch and metal starts melting.  I volunteer with Big Brothers, and I had Little Brother over while I was testing the stick side.  I tried to get him to take a shot at it but he was too scared.  Welding is definitely something that takes courage the first time you do it.  I remember my dad trying to get me to try it, and being too scared to!  Ha!Junky Airco Heliwelder 350 TIG (ESAB)Hobart Beta-MIG 250 with Miget spool gunJunky LTec 225 MIGESAB PowerCut plasma cutterOA welding and cutting"Better grinder than a welder."
Reply:I seriously doubt it's a flow sensor. I think it's an electrical on-off valve that opens the flow when welding, closes it when not. I have the same thing on my old miller tig & even though I have a water cooled torch & a valve like that, everything still works fine even with none of the water connections done at all...miller 330a bp TIGmiller dynasty 200DX TIGmillermatic 185 MIGthermal dynamics cutmaster 101 plasma cuttersnap-on YA5550 plasma cutterhypertherm powermax 30 plasma cutterbaileigh CS225 cold sawetc....
Reply:patclem, I have to be honest I read your story and the first few replies before posting.  I'm sorry to hear you are having problems with yours.  I might be in the same boat, again.  I order mine off ebay and it IS used so I'll have to keep my fingers crossed.
Reply:Turbo, I hope you're wrong!  I'm getting my hopes up that I'm gonna go run some water through that thing and it's gonna fire right up.  (or I'm gonna short over it and see what happens.)  I guess I could take it apart, but my luck monkeying with it will cause it to leak all over my transformer.Skinner89, I'm hoping for the best for ya!  Don't let my skepticism pour cold water on the experience!  You'll likely be just fine.Junky Airco Heliwelder 350 TIG (ESAB)Hobart Beta-MIG 250 with Miget spool gunJunky LTec 225 MIGESAB PowerCut plasma cutterOA welding and cutting"Better grinder than a welder."
Reply:Chapter 1 of the story finally comes to an end.  Got home tonight, found a tiny part number on the device in question.  It's a B76575-4 - and yes, it's a pressure switch.  I put a alligator clip across it, and SHAZAM!  I am so happy that it's working, and so pissed that I spent the entire week looking for something more complicated.I also found out that with a 3/32 tungsten, you should have the current range on LOW before you hit that pedal.  It'll blow the end off the tungsten, and blast a hole in 1/8 sheet in a flash!  Ha!Chapter 2 - plumbing the garden hose into the cooling system, and maybe building a cooler with a Procon.  Chapter 3 - welding beads on scrap.  Chapter 4 - feeding rod and maybe it'll be building something.  Chapter 5 - building something that doesn't look like #$%^.  Chapter 6 - maybe that'll be welding some kind of nonferrous metal.You guys are great.  Thanks for being patient with me.  Maybe I'll come back to this thread and post some pics of my messes.Junky Airco Heliwelder 350 TIG (ESAB)Hobart Beta-MIG 250 with Miget spool gunJunky LTec 225 MIGESAB PowerCut plasma cutterOA welding and cutting"Better grinder than a welder."