Any tips on rolling angle?

admin

I tried to roll some 1 1/2x1 1/2 x 3/16 angle leg out with my Eagle cp30 roller today and I cant get it to not twist. I have had this roller for 3 years and done tons of sq tube, channel, flat bar and pipe- just never any angle. I only have 3- 36" diameter rings to roll, but I spent about 2 hours today testing setups and it still twists. The main problem I see is the groove between the bottom rollers isnt deep enough for the "hard way" leg and the "easy way" leg isnt supported on both sides so it deforms. Any tips? Thanks!
Reply:Hello Eric C, it sounds like you need to invest in some different dies or else modify the ones that you have slightly. From your description, the bending is taking place away from the inside corner of the angle and this is causing the twisting that you are experiencing. The slot that supports/guides the leg that is in compression needs to be fully seated in it's groove and contacting fairly snugly on both sides of this leg keeping it as nearly vertical as possible. Hope this makes sense and gives you a bit more to consider. Best regards, Allanaevald
Reply:What about a sacrificial strip to close the gap.
Reply:Originally Posted by tapwelderWhat about a sacrificial strip to close the gap.
Reply:Originally Posted by aevaldHello Eric C, it sounds like you need to invest in some different dies or else modify the ones that you have slightly. From your description, the bending is taking place away from the inside corner of the angle and this is causing the twisting that you are experiencing. The slot that supports/guides the leg that is in compression needs to be fully seated in it's groove and contacting fairly snugly on both sides of this leg keeping it as nearly vertical as possible. Hope this makes sense and gives you a bit more to consider. Best regards, Allan
Reply:Tack weld another piece of angle to it so that it forms a square. Or roll square tubing and cut off the sides you don't need when done.
Reply:hossfeld benders
Reply:Originally Posted by ed machossfeld benders
Reply:[QUOTE=walker;357761]Tack weld another piece of angle to it so that it forms a square. Or roll square tubing and cut off the sides you don't need when done.[/QUOTE The tack another angle to it was something I was going to try for the fun of it. The tube would be too much work, I could roll two flat bars, one the easy way and one the hard way and weld together faster than cutting and finishing the tube. I think the stresses involved with rolling a boxed section are going to lead to a lot of spring back when cut free. Im going to do the two angle thing just to see.Last edited by Eric C; 02-02-2010 at 11:50 PM.
Reply:could u please attach some pictures.........i gotta see        thermal arc 252i  -  millermatic 350P -   miller XMT, cp300ts, 30a 22a feeders, buttload of other millers, handfull of lincolns, couple of esabs  -   Hypertherm 1250 G3
Reply:Here is a view of the angle in the roller. Note how the bottom of the horizontal leg isnt touching the top of the roller. This is due to the spacer in between the larger rolls being to big in diameter. My first solution was to make some smaller diameter spacers
Reply:Here is the old big spacer and the new smaller one. This seemed to work ok, but the angle still twisted and became less than 90* . I dont need this to work as much as I want to know whats wrong with my set up or what I'm doing wrong.
Reply:Hey Eric,Which way is it twisting.Have you put a straight edge on the roller dies to see it they are all in line.  Also, put in indicator on you rollers to see it all is turning smoothly.    Thanks for the invitation.  Good to see you using that lathe.  How did you cut the key hole?  Don't hate the hossfeld.
Reply:The top leg is being pushed in so that the inside angle is less than 90*. the dies on my machine are indexed so you know you have the right combo on each spindle. I still checked them though. I cut the keyways with a file- poormans broach. I dont hate the Hossfeld, I just wouldnt buy one. Not for full price anyway.
Reply:Looks like you have the Die backwards- the tapered side should be in the Corner of the Anglehttp://www.eaglebendingmachines.com/...epdfs/CP30.pdfEd Conleyhttp://www.screamingbroccoli.com/MM252MM211 (Sold)Passport Plus & Spool gunLincoln SP135 Plus- (Gone to a good home)Klutch 120v Plasma cutterSO 2020 benderBeer in the fridge
Reply:the dies are square. the angle of the pic makes the die look more radiused on one side. These dies have different depth "pockets" on either side so you get different widths if you turn them around.
Reply:Hmmm just looking at the Brochure and they have different Dies for the AngleEd Conleyhttp://www.screamingbroccoli.com/MM252MM211 (Sold)Passport Plus & Spool gunLincoln SP135 Plus- (Gone to a good home)Klutch 120v Plasma cutterSO 2020 benderBeer in the fridge
Reply:yeah they do sell angle dies, but I dont need them and they arent cheap. I looked at a larger machine at the shop that rolls large(up to 8"")angle for me and there dies are square- so I figured I should be able to do some dinky little 1 1/2 x 3/16.
Reply:What may be causing the problem is that the inside of angle iron is not square the legs have a slight taper. If your dies do not fit tightly to this taper  the legs can deform. The smaller the angle the more this effect will show.
Reply:I know some angle does have a taper, but not this stuff. I even check stuff on the rack(slow day) from 6" down to half none had any real taper.
Reply:We rolled this beam on the same machine.  I wish.
Reply:cool , cool , cool ..........thanks for posting the pics.        thermal arc 252i  -  millermatic 350P -   miller XMT, cp300ts, 30a 22a feeders, buttload of other millers, handfull of lincolns, couple of esabs  -   Hypertherm 1250 G3
Reply:Im with broccoli1 on this one. The die is backwards.  Also sometimes when you roll too tight of a bend in one pass, the steel can stress too much. You might try more passes (and flip the die) :-)Mike
Reply:There is no "backwards" on these dies. There are radiused corners that more than clear the inside radius of the angle. If you turn the die around you get a different size gap between the dies. If this gap is too large the material will deform until it fills the gap. Taking a little at a time does help, so does alot of side pressure from the lateral guide rollers. Once the ring gets down to about 40" dia is when the problems start. When I get a little free time I may try some other sizes angle, but I hardly ever need angle rings this small so its kinda a waste of time.
Reply:eric    i had the same problem with my eagle  roller, luckilly 1x1x 1/8 smaller project & i was able to take most of it out on the acorn table. next time I tried rolling in smaller bites & seemed a bit better, I checked eagles site & they have some sort of device to prevent twisting, but man like all there stuff it aint cheap.                                                                                BobI am on a hungry hunt for an Eagle CP 30 which brought me to this thread  I have a Hossfeld.  Actually I have 2.  Recently acquired the second for it's hydraulic package, the other one had a very good tooling package but no hydraulics.  Had a project last Sept needing 1 1/2 X 1 1/2 X 3/16 angle, HZ leg in rolled to a 28 Dia.  Wasn't ever going to happen without hydraulics and iffy  even then.  If you only have 3 of these rings to bend and the Section Roller wont get it you might resort to the tried and true method I was forced to reduce myself to......lay it out on the table,, tack your dogs to the lines, get out the heat and just bend that ittlebityy angle to the circle you need.  Keep a 3# hammer handy to beat out the distortion that's going to occur if your dia. is small enoufh and get the damn thing out the dooor, sold and paid for.  I hate unelegant solutions too, but have learned the value of "commercially perfect".  So, depending on the aesthetics, tolerances and specs of the job you're trying to accomplish you might just consider resorting to old fashioned ironmongering, that is if your conscience will allow it in this case, but........Im sure rooting for that Eagle CP30, cause I'm about to pull the triger on a new one if I can't buy used and I'm gonna be real ticked off if I ever have to heat bend a stinking piece of 3/16 metal again.
Reply:http://www.kbduct.com/angle-rings.html