4043 vs. 5356

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Ok so today i was messing around i wanted to try the diferences in Al filler.I personally like 5356 the best and i use it when the procedure doesnt specify filler type.  never really like 4043 just cause its harder for me to run and doesnt look as good for me.  Im wondering what some of your guys' preferences are?Specs:.125 pure Tung. .125 6061 (T6) AL.125 filler (4043 , 5356)100% ARGONapprox 150 amps (ran with pedal)AC balance more on the cleaning sidePrep:Stainless wirebrushed then fit, then final wipe down with acetone40435356-Justin6G zirconium 702 GTAW 2" xxheavy6G P.E.D. carbon steel GTAW 2" xxheavy3G titanium Gr. 2 - Gr. 7 GTAW up to 3/4" 3G 316L stainless GTAW up to 1" 3G carbon steel GTAW up to 1" 3G Hastalloy GTAW up to 3/4"1G tantalum GTAW up to .060"
Reply:I dont see a difference in the fillers per-se in the pics.  Looks more like a difference in the execution to me.I've been tig'ing 1/8" 6061 extrusions for the sign frames I make with 3/32" 4043 using 1/8" 2% thoriated tungsten, argon, 150 amps with pedal, 20% balance @  (I think) 80Hz.   If I have some 5356 in 3/32 size I'll try some on the same parts this week and see if it looks any different to me.MM350P/Python/Q300MM175/Q300DialarcHFHTP MIG200PowCon300SMHypertherm380ThermalArc185Purox oaF350CrewCab4x4LoadNGo utilitybedBobcat250XMT304/Optima/SpoolmaticSuitcase12RC/Q300Suitcase8RC/Q400Passport/Q300Smith op
Reply:ya 4043 just seems to produce a dirtier weld to me6G zirconium 702 GTAW 2" xxheavy6G P.E.D. carbon steel GTAW 2" xxheavy3G titanium Gr. 2 - Gr. 7 GTAW up to 3/4" 3G 316L stainless GTAW up to 1" 3G carbon steel GTAW up to 1" 3G Hastalloy GTAW up to 3/4"1G tantalum GTAW up to .060"
Reply:Originally Posted by welder155ya 4043 just seems to produce a dirtier weld to me
Reply:I did zapster and always do it always gets at the least a thorough stainless brush then usually acetone but most of the time after all of this i use aluma-kleen (or something like that)6G zirconium 702 GTAW 2" xxheavy6G P.E.D. carbon steel GTAW 2" xxheavy3G titanium Gr. 2 - Gr. 7 GTAW up to 3/4" 3G 316L stainless GTAW up to 1" 3G carbon steel GTAW up to 1" 3G Hastalloy GTAW up to 3/4"1G tantalum GTAW up to .060"
Reply:there are so many different fillers available.  I prefer 4008 & 4047, but then i am usually repairing  castings an i got a a bunch of free filler because the shop that had it only wanted to use 4043 and 53564047 flows really wellinsert thoughtful quote from someone else2000 Thermal Arc 300GTSW 3.5 hours1946 Monarch 20 x 54 Lathe1998 Supermax 10x54 Mill2004 Haco Atlantic 1/2" Capacity Lasernot mine but i get to play with it
Reply:Originally Posted by zapsterClean your aluminum....zap!
Reply:in my experience both will produce a similar looking weld, they just flow a little different.
Reply:ok apparently some people dont read what i said: its been cleaned thoroughly, maybe its the photo quality you cause the welds are shiny in person, and this wasnt a post on clean material it was preferences on filler6G zirconium 702 GTAW 2" xxheavy6G P.E.D. carbon steel GTAW 2" xxheavy3G titanium Gr. 2 - Gr. 7 GTAW up to 3/4" 3G 316L stainless GTAW up to 1" 3G carbon steel GTAW up to 1" 3G Hastalloy GTAW up to 3/4"1G tantalum GTAW up to .060"
Reply:Is there any difference between the two strength wise or anything? Or is one designed for thicker metal?Millermatic 180AS w/ spoolmate 100Craftsman 110v flux core migGolden Oldy Miller stick welderIn need of a plasma cutter....More tools and junk than i know what to do with!
Reply:Originally Posted by Fabc8torIs there any difference between the two strength wise or anything? Or is one designed for thicker metal?
Reply:4043 should be used when the finished product will/may be subjected to heat in excess of 350 deg F.  4043 should not be used on any material what will be anodized post welding (weld will turn black).5356 should be used if the part is to be anodized after welding.  5356 will produce a stronger weld.Syncro 250 DX Dynasty 200 DXMM 251 w/30A SG XMT 304 w/714 Feeder & Optima PulserHH187Dialarc 250 AC/DCHypertherm PM 1250Smith, Harris, Victor O/ASmith and Thermco Gas MixersAccess to a full fab shop with CNC Plasma, Water Jet, etc.
Reply:5356 is both stronger and more ductile than 4043In many cases this doesn't matter too much because the weakest point will be the softened HAZ. It does make a difference with regards to fillet weldsThe service environment is another factor to be taken into account when choosing a filler- alloys containing more than 3% Mg are susceptible to stress corrosion cracking at elevated temps which rules out the use of 5356
Reply:Hello,   I have found out that the 5356 is good for repairing items that get anodized. A few years ago there were some aluminum parts that we machined for a printing press and they got hard anodized afterwards  for the corrosion resistance.    The edges of the parts didn't clean up, so I welded them up and went through the  cnc mill again. They looked great.     After the anodizing they came back with black bloches everywhere the  4043welds were.  In the past my buddy Dave had welded them. When Dave got back from vacation he told me to always use 5356 when it will be anodized.    Since then, I also use 5356 at home when repairing aluminum castings, because they dip them in acid to clean them and this will show some discoloration in the repaired areas.    As for the visual difference, my instructor in college used to always take a piece of scotch brite or stainlees steel wool and clean his alum. tig rods before welding to remove oxides on them. He was a former navy vessel welder and worked for Westinghouse in the nuclear division. His welds made everyones look sick.Hope this helps,JAckal
Reply:In my opinion: 5356 produces cleaner welds (no or les grains with hot welds) compared to 4043.5356 filler is more sticky than 4043, won't leave the filler rod and jump into the puddle that easy.Strength, corrosion, weldability and suitability for anodising depends on the material or combination of materials to be welded according to the known tables. I bet they're available on the miller site or on the site mentioned below.http://www.nil.nl/fris5.htm
Reply:This is from the Lincoln Welding site regarding aluminum welding;  When should I use 4043 and when should I use 5356?4043 is designed for welding 6xxx series aluminum alloys. It may also be used to weld 3xxx series alloys or 2xxx alloys. 4043 has a lower melting point and more fluidity than the 5xxx series filler alloys, and is preferred by most welders because it "wets and flows better" and it's less sensitive to weld cracking with the 6xxx series base alloys. 4043 can also be used for welding castings. 4043 also makes brighter looking MIG welds with less smut because it doesn't contain magnesium. 4043 gives more weld penetration than 5356, but produces welds with less ductility than those made using 5356. However, 4043 is not well suited for welding Al-Mg alloys and should not be used with high Mg content alloys such as 5083, 5086 or 5456 because excessive magnesium-silicide (Mg2Si) can develop in the weld structure to decrease ductility and increase crack sensitivity. (One exception to this rule is 5052, which has a low magnesium content.) 5356 wire has become the most commonly used of all aluminum filler alloys because of its good strength and its good feed-ability when used as a MIG electrode wire. It is designed to weld 5xxx series structural alloys and 6xxx series extrusions, basically anything other than castings, because castings are high in silicon. Its one limitation is that 5356 is not suitable for service temperatures exceeding 150 degrees Fahrenheit (65 degrees Celsius). The formation of Al2Mg at elevated temperatures at the grain boundaries makes the alloys prone to stress corrosion. For components that will be anodized after welding, 5356 is recommended over 4043, which turns jet black when anodized.