Is this normal for Learnng TIG - I hate it, I love it, I hate it, I love it

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I've been practicing all weekend, trying to get better at TIG fillet welds.  Its frustrating because its the easiest of welds for my stick or mig.  1/8 mild steel, 3/32 electrode, 1/16" filler rod.   I'm great at butt welds or running straight beads, but fillet welds are my nemesis.I can't seem to get a puddle at the root. The legs melt, and the puddle sometimes works its way to the root.  Most of the time I get melt thru at the legs before this happens. Should I just dab the filler rod in there before the puddle forms, making a puddle on my own?  I know it can be done, because sometimes it works and I get a beautiful weld, better than my mig - sometimes I make a mess.My welder is a older transformer type, so if I'm struggling with DC-, AC will be impossible.  I can't imagine trying to get my arc to stay focused on the root in AC mode with only a 60hz machine.Sorry for the venting, but I feel better now.
Reply:XTWalt the GTA process takes a great deal of skill level. It may appear to be the easiest but you have many factors involved to make a good sound weld. From what you've said it sounds as though you are; 1- Not letting the base metal puddle enough2- Not having the proper angle on the tig torch3- Adding the electrode to early and at the incorrect angleAll I can suggest is to keep practicing and first try the fillet weld in a horizontal position. Don't panic horizontal is the plate is configured in a basic "T" and rested flat onto the bench. The weld itself is now a horizontal fillet.PracticeWeldor/ Certified Inspector
Reply:been there, and got some real good help here from hotrodder   ...maybe you can find the post i made where he anaswered with info and fotos.. but pretty sure the problem is a too-long arc// get that tungsten in there at the root of the fillet and you'll get a single puddle right in the corner..the short arc  gives a very concentrated hotspot..as the arc gets longer the concentration diminishes and you start to overheat a large area..the short arc gives a very concentrated hotspot and instant puddle  with less overall heat into the metal..never ever melt filler , it will never make a weld for you..get a puddle to melt and  touch the filler to the surface of the puddle which willmelt the filler..true for o-a welding as well  as tig//
Reply:im not a pro at tig welding...but i found when i go to do inside corners/fillets that i like my tungsten to stick out just a little further than when im doing other welds....just my .02
Reply:I'm 99% sure it's just that your arc length is too long. There is a slight possibility that its your tungsten prep thats at fault. Hold the shortest arc possible without stuffing your tungsten into the puddle.
Reply:Thanks for the advice, again.I am working a horizontal weld, trying to keep the torch at 20deg down from vertical, and about halfway between the legs of the steel, but I tend to drift from the start.  Filler wire at 90deg to the torch.  I'll concentrate on keeping the arc short.But, if I put the Tungsten deeper into the root, how do I keep it from getting contaminated?  Do you lift it UP and back when you dab the filler rod to keep it out of the puddle?  Normally I just step the Tungsten back, dab, then advance.  I guess this is why TIG welding takes so much practice.Also, regarding the Tungsten prep, should I use a different angle for fillet welds?  More blunt?  Larger flat on the tip?Thanks.
Reply:When I do heavier fillets I back up a little do dab the wire, but only just enough to put the filler in w/o contaminating the tungsten. Putting a a flat on the tip of the tungsten will improve penitration in the middle of the puddle. Give lowering you torch angle a try. 20 deg down from vertical seems a little steep to me.
Reply:Why are you doing fillet welds with 1/16" filler? Try 3/32" filler, that may help significantly. Also as already mentioned, shorter arc length & more stick-out. If you have a gas-lense collet body, you will get sufficient shielding gas coverage."SOUTHPAW" A wise person learns from another persons mistakes;A smart person learns from their own mistakes;But, a stupid person.............never learns.
Reply:try:give it more heat at the beginning, and back off once you get a puddle.  you're gonna need more heat for fillet then a butt weld (same size meterial).try a little more tungsten stick out.
Reply:The thread Weldbead was talking about...http://weldingweb.com/vbb/showthread.php?t=23787&highlight=arc+length
Reply:Maybe try a 1/16 electrode?  You may find you have a little more control at the lower end, as far as heat is concerned. My .02: think about it like your foot pedal. If you set your peak amps at 100 when you only need 50, it will be much harder to get that fine control/finesse. Likewise, the larger electrode is going to carry more heat that you don't necessarily need. I have found that a 1/16 electrode is plenty for welding up to 1/4".
Reply:I just got done with my mig and tig classes and yes you are long arcing get the tungsten in the joint.. I do circle motion adding the filler when you get to the top and pause a second 1 every second. thats just my 2 cents.. I'm no pro at it but I can lay really nice beads.
Reply:I can't claim to be a pro, but what works for me is to get the puddle started with filler and then move into your weld pattern. What I mean is start your arc for a bit and then add a drop of filler prior to the two pieces joining on their own. For me it just seems to get things flowing faster, and easier. I have no clue if it is considered "correct", just giving you what works for me. After all you are only talking about a small dollup and you can let your arc heat that up prior to progressing forward with your weld.
Reply:If you add some filler/melt some filler off to get a puddle going you're more likely to end up with lack of fusion issues...Figure 4 in this >Miller article< and a really good (bad) example
Reply:Thanks to all, especially the link from Hotrodder.  My fillets are much improved now.I'm keeping my torch at less angle (say 15) and keeping the electrode closer to the root.  When I see the legs melting and not the root, I know to get closer.  This seems to work.  Also, when things are not going right, I'm trying to remember that heat is my friend.  Fast local heat gets the puddle at the root.Just a note, I'm really good at thicker material like 1/4 or 5/16 plate.  I can make beautiful fillet welds.  I guess its more forgiving and less likely to burn thru than the thin stuff.Walt
Reply:Originally Posted by XTWaltI've been practicing all weekend, trying to get better at TIG fillet welds.  Its frustrating because its the easiest of welds for my stick or mig.  1/8 mild steel, 3/32 electrode, 1/16" filler rod.   I'm great at butt welds or running straight beads, but fillet welds are my nemesis.I can't seem to get a puddle at the root. The legs melt, and the puddle sometimes works its way to the root.  Most of the time I get melt thru at the legs before this happens. Should I just dab the filler rod in there before the puddle forms, making a puddle on my own?  I know it can be done, because sometimes it works and I get a beautiful weld, better than my mig - sometimes I make a mess.My welder is a older transformer type, so if I'm struggling with DC-, AC will be impossible.  I can't imagine trying to get my arc to stay focused on the root in AC mode with only a 60hz machine.Sorry for the venting, but I feel better now.