new to TIG.....dull weld bead?

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Hello all!I am new to the Tig process and welding overall.....w/ no training other than what I have picked up off the net.I would like to weld stainless to build a manifold.So I am putting in practice passes w/ 309L filler (on 304 stainless), as there will be a mix of stainless and mild steel in the manifold.I realize I have a ways to go in improving my skill, but I can't seem to get a nice shiny bead.I am using a tank of pure argon.  I have tried several cup sizes and have recently invested in a gas lense and cups to go with it.... in the hopes of resolving this problem.  I am currently using a #12 cup with a gas lense as a couple of people have indicated that this setup works well for them.The pictures show schedule 10, 304 stainless.I have tried amperages from 50 to 70amps.....with little difference.I have adjusted flow rates from 12cfh to 20cfh with little difference in weld color.I am using a stainless brush to clean my base metal. The brush was purchased brand new and never used on anything other than stainless.I'm pretty sure my torch position ok, based on what I have read.My Thoriated Tungsten was ground on a dedicated grinding wheel.  I have it sticking out about 1/8" from the cup end.The pictures below show my attempts with different gas flow rates.Since the weather is cold here in Canada and the garage is pretty cold I have even tried bring my filler and base metal inside to see if this was a condensation issue....but this doesn't seem to be the caseI'm stumped....any ideas why I might be getting the dull weld bead?thanks....
Reply:Your bead probably wont be nice and shiney on something that small. But you're right, it does look overly discolored. Do you have the right amount of stick out on your tungsten? Did you check all the gas fittings from the tank to the torch for leaks? You have your torch close enough to the metal?Also, several of your welds look lumpy, cold. If your machine has a pedal, are you pressing down enough?
Reply:I am new to the Tig process and welding overall.....w/ no training other than what I have picked up off the net.   The problem I see is that you need to start with the basics first.  Go get your self some MS first to practice on, maybe 1/8" thick.  Mild steel is more forgive to learn on then SS once you produce consistent results and understand what actions have what affect on your welds then move onto your SS.  Everybody has their own learning curve so give yourself time to learn.  Also taking a class or finding someone to learn from can save alot of wasted time.  Can you list where you are located? At work I stick weld and have been welding out in the field now for over three years.  How does this relate to you, you ask?  I'm always looking to improve my weld quality and I have reached a point where I don't need to use a grind on my welds (normally) other than cleaning them.  My welds get tested with either DP or diesel and/or xray and I haven't had a repair in the last 2 years.  I'm always looking to learn and improve and when you weld you should never stop learning.
Reply:ya....need a little more heat into the weld....I think most of these were down at 50amps.....and likely my travel speed is a little to fast.About 1/8" stick out, and the tungsten is as close as I can get it to the base metal.I'm in Hamilton, Ontario Canada.There is a local guy that has been giving me some pointers and tips and has shown me how he welds at his shop.  He put down a few nice shiny welds on another piece of stainless I have, and I haven't been able to replicate a shiny bead at home on that piece of metal either.  He gave me a box of stainless scraps to practice on.  But I don't think he has further time for me now so he was suggesting further practice and posting some photos.....and I can appreciate that.  Technique, consistency and Heat aside, do you think this is insufficient shielding?  I'm not 100% sure there isn't any leaks, but I will go back over my setup.
Reply:First I would say go with a smaller cup, 6 or 8 should be plenty sufficient. Second, the beads definitely look to be cold, you need to let the puddle "wet-out" before adding more filler. Also I would set my macine on ~80 amps DCEN, and control the heat with my pedal, starting out hot and backing off slightly as needed. I would say your stick-out is about right, even without a gas lens. Keep your arc as short as possible without dipping your tungsten. ~1/8" arc lenth is what you want. Keep playing with it, you'll get it."SOUTHPAW" A wise person learns from another persons mistakes;A smart person learns from their own mistakes;But, a stupid person.............never learns.
Reply:What kind of welder are you using..i,m in Hamilton and new to tig also..but i have better luck then that..
Reply:Just another thought, do you have another bottle available to try? It is possible that you have a "bad" bottle; it may be something other than pure argon, sometimes they do get mis-labeled.
Reply:yep, the discoloration is severe, on the verge of sugaring.  Simply put, you did not have an inert atmophere.  The metal was exposed to the atmosphere (Nitrogen and Oxygen) while at elevated temperature, so oxides and nitrides were formed.It sounds like your technique, cup size, electrode stickout, arc gap, etc, would not be the problem.  The bead is cold, which if anything should help prevent discoloration.  The base metal is small, which could tend to increase discoloration, since the whole piece will tend to overheat, if travel speed is too slow, or current is too high, but this is not your case.This problem has to be something like a leak in the system, or something really gross like using a MIG mix with CO2 or O2, or blowing a fan on the workpiece while welding.First I would try making a spot spot weld, without adding filler, holdihng the postflow shielding over the spot untill cool, and see if it comes out clean.  If it's not clean,  I would check for leaks.  Pressurize the system up to the solenoid valve inside the welder and check every connection from the bottle to the valve, even the tank to regulator connection and the entire flow meter.  Then plug the torch gas cup, initiate the gas solenoid, and check every connection up to the torch.  If the spot weld did come out clean, this would indicate that your gas is not contaminated, and you need to turn off the fan, or close the door to stop the breeze.Let us know what you find.
Reply:Thanks for the advice everyone.  much appreciated.I have previously completed some passes with no filler and with the same result.  I will try a spot weld(with and without filler) w/ post flow over top to see if that makes a difference.I figured if there was a leak in the system increasing the flow rate at the regulator would improve the weld color by ultimately increasing the flow rate at the torch.  I feel the gas flow at the torch with my hand, so its not like gas isn't coming through the torch.  Though I will go through and verify all connections in the system, to ensure there are no leaks.At one point I did try increasing the flow above 20cfh and had a hard time maintaining anytype of puddle, which indicated to me that flow was excessive at that point...and cooling the metal.  I may give this a shot again just for the heck of it.I may need to have someone experienced try the bottle on their known working setup to determine if its a bad bottle.....and then just take the bottle back.I don't have any other bottle to try.....I was told previously not to have any fans or heaters running while welding that would disrupt the shield gas, and not to weld with the garage door open.......so thats not the issue either.I will let you know what I find....thanks again.Last edited by hammert1; 02-10-2010 at 12:04 PM.
Reply:Looking at the width of the temper colors around the weld, I'm not sure it was a matter of the piece getting too hot. Bad/ wrong gas or draft blowing the shielding away are your most likely culprits. But as mentioned befor, check your system for leaks.Did you get to run the other guys machine when he was teaching you? Did you have any problems with it if you did get to run it?
Reply:You've been asked but decided not to reply.What machine are you using?Hard for anyone to help you with the information you provided.I'd suggest you go to the Miller website and download a copy of their Tig Handbook.  Better yet, you can order their Student Pack and get the Tig Handbook, GMAW Handbook and a bunch of other useful guides (in hard copy).  $25 including shipping.  Best $25 you'll ever spend in welding.Syncro 250 DX Dynasty 200 DXMM 251 w/30A SG XMT 304 w/714 Feeder & Optima PulserHH187Dialarc 250 AC/DCHypertherm PM 1250Smith, Harris, Victor O/ASmith and Thermco Gas MixersAccess to a full fab shop with CNC Plasma, Water Jet, etc.
Reply:Originally Posted by hammert1I figured if there was a leak in the system increasing the flow rate at the regulator would improve the weld color by ultimately increasing the flow rate at the torch.  I feel the gas flow at the torch with my hand, so its not like gas isn't coming through the torch.  Though I will go through and verify all connections in the system, to ensure there are no leaks.
Reply:Couldn't justify buying a miller though it would have been nice, so I opt'ed for the china CT-520 3in1 200A tig.  Quality is decent, price was right.  The arc is exceptionally stable, no jumping, HF start works well....it doesn't perform any different then the miller I saw....other than this weird bead discolorationYes I have looked at the pdf manuals from Miller already......are they any different then the hard copies? or is miller offering something different.  I might have missed that?  Are there any other books on TIG you would recommend?I did not get a chance to use the guys miller...when he showed me a few passes. Originally Posted by SundownIIIYou've been asked but decided not to reply.What machine are you using?Hard for anyone to help you with the information you provided.I'd suggest you go to the Miller website and download a copy of their Tig Handbook.  Better yet, you can order their Student Pack and get the Tig Handbook, GMAW Handbook and a bunch of other useful guides (in hard copy).  $25 including shipping.  Best $25 you'll ever spend in welding.
Reply:Looks like you are definitely not letting the weld puddle enough, and travel speed is too fast. Miller welding has a calculator you can use to set your machine according to the metal you are welding. It tells you which tungsten to use, cfh setting, travel speed etc.You need to not travel until you get a dime sized puddle.  The drop some filler wire in and repeat.
Reply:Originally Posted by JohnnyWelderYou need to not travel until you get a dime sized puddle.
Reply:dime sized puddle....on what
Reply:A small illustration for Johnny. Attached Images"SOUTHPAW" A wise person learns from another persons mistakes;A smart person learns from their own mistakes;But, a stupid person.............never learns.
Reply:oh now i get it??  wtf
Reply:I love it when I see a blind guy trying to help another blind guy across the street.Didn't you realize that ol Johnny is the self declared "World's Greatest Welder".  (In his own mind, surely not in mine)Oh and Hammert1, we can all see how great the arc is.Syncro 250 DX Dynasty 200 DXMM 251 w/30A SG XMT 304 w/714 Feeder & Optima PulserHH187Dialarc 250 AC/DCHypertherm PM 1250Smith, Harris, Victor O/ASmith and Thermco Gas MixersAccess to a full fab shop with CNC Plasma, Water Jet, etc.
Reply:Originally Posted by SundownIIIDidn't you realize that ol Johnny is the self declared "World's Greatest Welder".  (In his own mind, surely not in mine)
Reply:Are you welding FOREHAND?  Torch pointed towards the finish line at about 20* ?I don't think your beads look that bad.  The problem as pointed out is contamination or lack of sheilding gas.  A #12 cup and gas lenz at 15 cfh should cover those small beads easily.DavidReal world weldin.  When I grow up I want to be a tig weldor.
Reply:Yes torch pointed to finish, ~20degrees off from the 90 and filler at 90 from the torch Originally Posted by David RAre you welding FOREHAND?  Torch pointed towards the finish line at about 20* ?I don't think your beads look that bad.  The problem as pointed out is contamination or lack of sheilding gas.  A #12 cup and gas lenz at 15 cfh should cover those small beads easily.David
Reply:20 cfh is excessive.. and there is variation between regs and gauges so you could might even have a hair more.. so too much cold gas hitting the puddle, sucking in air, could possibly be the cause of both the problems i see in them beads....
Reply:Maybe he is pulling the filler wire out of the shielding gas protected zone????Miller 330 A/BP Bernard SS coolerMiller cst 250Miller Big Blue 251DCentury 210 Mig (first welder I bought)Hypertherm PowerMax 800Victor torch setRu Fong 31 MilAtlas lathe
Reply:maybe a silly question.... if the pedal/trigger starts the HF start how can I soap up the fittings to look for leaks on the torch side...I'm sure high voltage and water don't get along?I am also trying keep the filler in the shielding gasThanks again everyone for all the suggestions/ help, very much appreciated.Cheers,Trevorspot without filler60amps at 17cfh (the top seems to remain shiny....maybe due to the post flow?)spot with fillerWhat size filler are you using? I find on this thin stuff especially small pieces that you need small filler such as .035. It takes to much heat to melt in the large filler and you over heat the weld area. You will also probably have to pulse the pedal. Mash the pedal and add filler then let off some, this will keep your arc going but allow you to keep the work piece cooler.Millermatic 252Lincoln 175 plusTA 185tswTA 161stlhypertherm pmax 45Victor torchHenrob torchAn S10 for each day of the week
Reply:OK, Here goes.Didn't read all the threads so if someone already covered it, I'm sorry.You're trying to weld way too cold.  Increase your amps in 10A steps til you find yourself getting a "quick puddle" in the base metal.What you're doing, because you're not using enough amps, is cooking the filler while waiting for the next puddle to form.When your amps are right, you should get a near instantaneous puddle in that thickness material.  Add filler to the front of the puddle and move the arc forward.Your beads are just "piled up" on the base material.  You're using the arc, rather than the puddle to melt the filler.Pulsing can help with tig welding thin gauge stainless, but you need to learn to walk before you can run.  Stainless doesn't like heat (warpage) but you have to use enough to get consistent/quick puddle formation and not stay in one place too long.Also be careful to keep the filler in the covering gas envelope.  Removing it and then inserting the contaminated filler into the puddle will cause the bead to be contaminated and grainy in appearance.Try hotter and faster.Syncro 250 DX Dynasty 200 DXMM 251 w/30A SG XMT 304 w/714 Feeder & Optima PulserHH187Dialarc 250 AC/DCHypertherm PM 1250Smith, Harris, Victor O/ASmith and Thermco Gas MixersAccess to a full fab shop with CNC Plasma, Water Jet, etc.
Reply:Originally Posted by SundownIIIOK, Here goes.Didn't read all the threads so if someone already covered it, I'm sorry.You're trying to weld way too cold.  Increase your amps in 10A steps til you find yourself getting a "quick puddle" in the base metal.What you're doing, because you're not using enough amps, is cooking the filler while waiting for the next puddle to form.When your amps are right, you should get a near instantaneous puddle in that thickness material.  Add filler to the front of the puddle and move the arc forward.Your beads are just "piled up" on the base material.  You're using the arc, rather than the puddle to melt the filler.Pulsing can help with tig welding thin gauge stainless, but you need to learn to walk before you can run.  Stainless doesn't like heat (warpage) but you have to use enough to get consistent/quick puddle formation and not stay in one place too long.Also be careful to keep the filler in the covering gas envelope.  Removing it and then inserting the contaminated filler into the puddle will cause the bead to be contaminated and grainy in appearance.Try hotter and faster.
Reply:If that spot weld was properly shielded during and after the weld, it would be perfectly shiny stainless steel, with no discoloration.  The spot weld is a good test of shielding because the torch stays stationary, compared to a traveling weld where the still hot weld is exposed to air as the torch moves forward.  If you cannot get a perfectly shiny spot weld with no discoloration, you have a shielding gas issue.Your spot weld looks rather large, maybe your postflow time was not suffient to shield it while it cooled?  Smaller welds cool faster, and welds on heavier material cool faster, so in both these cases you are more likely to get less discoloration since the bead has a chance to cool while still be shielded.
Reply:I as well as most of the others seem to think it is a gas issue (other than the cold weld) causing the dull finish. my theory is contaminated gas or a gas mix instead of pure gas. You have tried from 12-20. Your only other option would be to raise it even higher, but I don't think that is the issue. Perhaps your supplier could work something out with you. If the tank is full or close to it, you may be able to trade, If not maybe you can pay a pro rated fee for the difference. I would definately show them what is going on and tell them you think it is a gas issue. You are using the right filler correct?
Reply:tx_swordguy,Do you know what porosity looks like? (ie lack of gas coverage)Contaminated/inadequate gas flow will trash a tungsten faster than you can say Jimmy Cricket.Course, I'm sure you know more about welding stainless steel than I do.  Only been tig welding (heliarc) the stuff for about 45 years.Syncro 250 DX Dynasty 200 DXMM 251 w/30A SG XMT 304 w/714 Feeder & Optima PulserHH187Dialarc 250 AC/DCHypertherm PM 1250Smith, Harris, Victor O/ASmith and Thermco Gas MixersAccess to a full fab shop with CNC Plasma, Water Jet, etc.
Reply:Like mentioned earlier,be sure your welding with DC not AC. TIG torch hooked up to the neg. Just sayin.2008 Dodge 1Ton 2007 Lincoln 200D Pipelinerkubota with throttle controlMiller Dynasty 200dxLincoln 200 Powermigspoolgun
Reply:I'm surprised that this post has gone on so long.  When you read his first post he states that what he has learned about tig has only been from the internet and the first thing he is learning on is SS.  If you were to go to a gym and start a work out program, you would not walk up to a guy who was bench presssing 250 lbs and ask him how to do it and expect yourself to be able to do same weight.  Everything comes in time especially when you start with the basics/fundamentals, you got learn to walk before you can run.  Hammert1 go get some MS and pratice doing the basic joints such as t's, fillet, outside corners and butt weld on 1/8" or 3/16" thick material and get your bead down pact.  Then move on to your SS and start with 1/8" thick material and practice the same joints. On a side note it took me three years to reach the point where I was able to bench press 350 lbs 8 times any day of the week so image how many hour I spent at the gym to reach that point.
Reply:too cold, too slow, too much filler wire, not fluent enough with the rig.. many reasons why it looks like it does.. gas not one of them..  i agree with the statement of "just practice".. tungsten at constant angle and elevation plus steady, constant speed (and of course heat.. that's a given) is the only way to get a smooth bead.. "walkin the cup" or some steady free hand is the only way.. keep the wire in the puddle and don't feed.. walk over it.. your heat trails on the side of your bead should hug your weld.. not be way out to the side.. these are the black and blue bands of heat running along your weld.. too wide and you're goin too slow because you're too cold.. crank up and go faster.. the less time you're on that metal, the cooler it's gonna stay.. and that's the key to shiny stainless welds.. all that..lol..if you're not livin on the edge, you're takin up too much room..
Reply:ha..bs..anyone can tig weld..its so easy its the most popular machines sold today..hell anyone can buy a tig and go nuclear right off the bat....just like chewing gum...nuthin like wieght lifting...tig torches arent heavyaaaaaaaaaaaahahahahahahahhahahahah....im such a funny guy aaaaaaaaahahahahahahaahahagary
Reply:Just wondering if the discoloration problem has been solved yet, it would be helpful to know what the problem is.We know that 100% inert shielding will yield an absolutely clean shiny weld with zero discoloration.  This is nearly impossible to achieve, other than inside an inert chamber, but the point is that these welds have been exposed to a contaminant while the metal was still hot, so what is going wrong?  Is it a leak that is contaminating the gas, is it bad gas or a mig mix, is it the wind blowing shield away, is it contaminated base metal like resisdual cutting fluid or embedded grit blast particles, or is it some screwy technique problem?I know the welds look cold and overly built up, so technique is not there yet, but it seems that hammert1 is not doing anything wacky to cause bad shielding such as excessive arc length or radical torch angle.  hammert1 also said that someone showed him a clean weld on another piece of metal with a different welding system, and hammert1 could not repeat the clean weld on the same piece of metal with his system.  So, I have to stick with the hunch that there is a basic gas contamination problem.Again, anybody should be able to make a small TIG spot weld on clean stainless steel, and have it come out absolutely shiny and free of discoloration.  If not, there is a lack of shielding during and/or after the weld.
Reply:I have not been able to find any leaks in my system from the tank to the tip of the torch.  I took the welder apart to check the fittings at the solenoid and the fitting at the front.  I can find no gross leaks.  If it was a pin hole leak......which I don't think there is.....cranking up the flow rate would compensate..... but there is no change.I have tried more heat and more travel speed with the same resulting grey color.  Yes I do not get the buildup on the metal, and this results in better penetration.....but I still do not get the nice clean shiny bead.Spot welds do not yield the gray color, but are not shiny either.....I have tried adjusting the tungsten to less than 1/8 stickout.....but it yields the same.I double checked my collet to make sure it was in correctly...but I see no problem with the way the torch is assembled.  I can not find any leaks at the torch.Without a flow meter at the end of the torch....its hard to know exactly what the flow is, but it feels pretty much the same as right out of the regulator.  But the hand isn't a very good way to measure flow.I have tried again with and without the gas lense and different cup sizes, all with the same result.Out of the hours and hours and hours of trial and error, I think I would have produced at least one shiny bead?Honestly I am stumped.
Reply:Sounds like you've been very thorough in your search, do you have any hair left or has it all been pulled out?Can you try some different base metal?  Something thick, 1/2" or more, degreased with acetone and ground clean.  This will cool quickly and small welds should have little discoloration.  Try without any filler first.By the way, I would not say that " If it was a pin hole leak......which I don't think there is.....cranking up the flow rate would compensate", I don't think this is true.  A leak in a line is can act as a venturi, and draw in outside air.  Did you leak check everything, even the bottle to regulator connection, and all around the flowmeter?Good luck, you'll get it sooner or later.
Reply:Originally Posted by pulser A leak in a line is can act as a venturi, and draw in outside air.
Reply:Originally Posted by pulserSounds like you've been very thorough in your search, do you have any hair left or has it all been pulled out?Can you try some different base metal?  Something thick, 1/2" or more, degreased with acetone and ground clean.  This will cool quickly and small welds should have little discoloration.  Try without any filler first.By the way, I would not say that " If it was a pin hole leak......which I don't think there is.....cranking up the flow rate would compensate", I don't think this is true.  A leak in a line is can act as a venturi, and draw in outside air.  Did you leak check everything, even the bottle to regulator connection, and all around the flowmeter?Good luck, you'll get it sooner or later.
Reply:Hey, hammert1,Just in case someone hasn't already suggested it... have you tried welding on material other than what is shown in your photos?  I'm wondering, if perhaps, you are pulling a contaminant into the bead.  Also, make sure your electrode tip is ground correctly with a clean tip.  Let's see what the bead looks like on some aluminum.Last edited by Weldordie; 02-16-2010 at 10:09 PM.
Reply:Originally Posted by WeldordieHey, hammert1,Just in case someone hasn't already suggested it... have you tried welding on material other than what is shown in your photos?  I'm wondering, if perhaps, you are pulling a contaminant into the bead.  Also, make sure your electrode tip is ground correctly with a clean tip.  Let's see what the bead looks like on some aluminum.
Reply:Originally Posted by papabearThat's what I said, (post #12). Also, have you tried a different bottle yet?
Reply:Fair enough, can you take your bottle to someone else that TIG welds successfully so they can test it?...process of elimination. Like I already said, they do mess up sometimes at the suppliers. It happened to me. This is starting to make me nuts, and it's not even happening to me. I am curious though, as to what the problem is.Last edited by papabear; 02-16-2010 at 10:53 PM.
Reply:I'm still betting it's technique vs bad gas/gas problem.Overheating (often caused by not using enough amps to get a quick puddle) of the base material can cause the results we see.  Melting the filler with the arc vs in the puddle will also cause the grey bead.Is it possible to find an experienced tigger in the area who could run a bead with the machine?Syncro 250 DX Dynasty 200 DXMM 251 w/30A SG XMT 304 w/714 Feeder & Optima PulserHH187Dialarc 250 AC/DCHypertherm PM 1250Smith, Harris, Victor O/ASmith and Thermco Gas MixersAccess to a full fab shop with CNC Plasma, Water Jet, etc.
Reply:If you have exhausted all possibilities replace your torch head, borrow or buy. Have seen plenty of dodgy torch heads that produce the same results that you are getting.
Reply:here is some mild steel 3/8" thick, ground and then cleaned with Acetone. no filler.
Reply:I'm guessing that your machine has an automatic post flow timer in it.Surprised the experts didn't pick up on this. For SS in particular--it needs a llllloooonnnnnng post flow time.A work around is to just tickle the torch control enough to get the high frequencystart or tiny arc....to start the post flow going again----after orat then end of fading out that arc at the end of the weld.   ?????Fading?????--if you don't fade the arc out, gradually thenthose nice craters, which are crack generators and big-time leak holes,seen in your pic's form.If you're not using a gas lens--you should be.There's other work arounds to bypass the automatic (and too short) post flowtiming, using one's imagination.Blackbird
Reply:The degree of discoloration on this 3/8" plate continues to indicate inadequate inert shielding during and after the weld.  What does your tungsten electrode look like after these welds, blue also?Is the O-ring on the torch back cap in place?  You've confirmed the torch is assembled correctly?  You removed the handle and checked the gas connection to the torch?  Some older setups used rubber gas hose, which could be suspect as being too porous, do you have this?  You leak checked the entire flowmeter, like the top of the tube where the ball floats, I personally had a defective flow meter that leaked here.  You may have to leak check those internal connections you mentioned were difficult to get to,Dave's point on needing adequate post flow time is of course valid, and lack of adequate post flow will result in discoloration of the spot weld and the end portion of the traveling weld, but it would not have any affect on the discolation of the beginning portion of the traveling weld.Also, unrelated to discoloration, Dave makes a good point that the end of the weld needs to be faded to eliminate a crater condition.  This is done by gradually decreasing the current (downsloping).Last edited by pulser; 02-18-2010 at 10:12 AM.
Reply:Its got fixed post flow of 5 seconds....so I have a plan already for how to modify the machine to give me full control over post flow.  So thats on my list of things  to do As for the crater, I agree, I have a lot of practice to do in order to improve my technique(what little there is)....I will take note to let off the current a littler slower at the end.Ya, I completely soaped the whole regulator/flow meter, and around the entire tank, the hose from the regulator and the fitting where it connects at the welder.  No leaksTorch assembly is correct......O-ring is in place, and no leaks around the end cap...I need to check the connection from the hose/cable to the torch/handle.tungsten always has a blue tint after welding