Please help me pick a tig welder

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Im thinking about buying a tig welder and i was hoping to get some help on picking one out. I mainly will be doing fabrication of vehicle parts (Jeep parts, exhaust stuff, sheet metal, roll cages, ect ect) and basically whatever else i need to weld up.. Im going to say that the thickest metal id be welding would be about 1/4 inch. Once and a great  maybe a little thicker but i think i could just do my best on that stuff. Even if the welder wasn't quite enough i think i could get by for as little as i would do that.I took a class a while back on tig welding. It was 6 weeks long 5 hours a day of just welding. I got pretty good at steel but i definitely need work on aluminum. (i can make a near perfect weld about 1 out of 3 times lol) I really cant think of any reason that i need to be able to weld alm but it might come in handy some day. So it isnt a MUST to have a machine that will do AC but it wouldnt be bad either. The machine i used in my class was a Lincoln, i want to say it was a squarwave 180? Does that sound right?  I never had a problem with it. Seemed to be a awesome machine. I also have unlimited access to a millermatic 180 mig and ive never had a problem with that (other than my lack of skill) so i really have no brand loyalty, i just want something that is going to work good and last me a long time. Only other things that are important to me are a footpedal control and a HF start. Basically thats how i learned, thats what im used to and like so thats what i want to stick with.Im going to say my price range is about 1000 so obviously ive been looking at used machines. Millers mainly. ive found a couple maxstar 150s in my price range. One with a bunch of extras for a really good price that looks like new) I really like the idea of a portable welder (I dont really have a shop and there would be two main places i would weld at but its not a big deal) but no AC and is 150 enough? In my class i dont think i ever had it above 130 but that was all pretty thin stuff too. Ive also seen a few 180 sycrowave (think thats what there called) millers go for 1300ish. then there is the diversion 180, but from what ive read it doesn't have HF start. Id definitely be willing to give up AC for HF start and a pedal.Soooo what should i be looking at? any off brands better than the big names? anything else i need to know? I plan on doing this stuff for a long while so i dont expect this welder to be everything i ever need. I just want something to get me started building stuff and ill upgrade to something bigger later down the road when i can spend more.thanks in advance guys!
Reply:$1000 is a tight budget for a good quality machine to do what you want. $1500-2000 is probably a better range.In Millers, I've seen Scyncrowave 180's used for as little as $1100, the Sync 200's for $1300. both are very nice AC/DC tigs with HF, remote, balance control and more options with the newer models. I've even seen some Sync 250's for less than $2K. I've got a Sync 200. For steel and stainless 1/4" you are fine, for 1/4" alum you are stretching the machine to the max. 3/16" is a more reliable max with alum. I wouldn't suggest alum over 1/4", The few times I've done 1/4", even with preheat, I really wished I'd gotten the 250 instead.Don't over look older machines. I've seen some older Miller 330 A/BP's go for $500-800 with cooler and water cooled torches. They are a great AC/DC machine, but big, heavy and need a good bit of power. Quite a few guys here have them. I seriously doubt you'd ever out grow one unles you needed a ton of fancy options that come on the big money inverters. This would be my suggestion for some one on a tight budget.Other options are XMT 304's. Used I've seen them in the $1300-1500 range. You'd possibly still need to get an aircooled torch with gas valve to go with it depending on what the unit came with used. They are DC only and no HF (you can add it as an option if you want), but most have liftarc to start the arc and I didn't find it hard to use, compared to HF on my Sync once I got used to it.. It's also an awsome powersource for Mig if the machine is one of the CC/CV ones. I've done a bit of SS tig with one and the weld very nice. I'm keeping my eyes open for one in the future.I'm sure there are a bunch of older industrial Lincolns that would fall into the group also, as well as some of the rebadged machines from the big companies ( Miller made some of the Airco branded ones and the one I saw was a rebadged  Miller 330 A/BP) but I'm not as familiar with them. Good luck..No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:I know general rule of thumb is 1 amp for ever .001 right? So i should be good welding .120 wall roll cages and brackets and stuff with a 140/150 welder. But what about like 3/16 and 1/4 with a 150? I mean i know it would be maxing it out and it wouldnt be the BEST weld but could it be done? Im really leaning more towards a maxstar 140 or 150 after doing some research. I think it would be nice and small and i could move it around with me easily while doing cages and stuff. I know this is not a heavy duty welder but im thinking i could get this now then a bigger one maybe a year or so down the road. That way ill have a nice big welder 250 range todo heavy stuff but still a small portable one for cages and stuff. plus i really like the idea that it could be run on a reg 110 plug (if needed) although every where i think i would be welding has a welder plug anyways. Plus like i said i have a 180 mig i could use for heavier stuff (i know that still isnt technically enough for 1/4 inch but ive done it before with it and it held fine). Then i also have access to at least 2-3 stick welders (which i know little about) but maybe i could break those out and start learning if i had to weld something super thick. I was thinking about it and here is what id mainly be welding3/16 bumpers  .120 wall roll cages with 3/16 bracing and bracketsexhuast stuffMAYBE some 1/4 inch wall tubing (like welding threaded slugs in for control arms and stuff)and then just other random stuff i guess...what do you guys think.Oh and im opposed to getting a older machine its just it seems like no one takes care of them and they all are beat up. I really havent found and nice older welders for sale. Plus it seems that no matter how old, anything over 180amp is still far over 1000 bucks. and on the other hand ive seen a few 150amp maxstars used in like new shape with upgrades for 750-950
Reply:For motorsports fabrication a maxstar 150 is not enough.check this out:http://cgi.ebay.com/Miller-Gold-Star...item4aa2ab2033Last edited by fortyonethirty; 07-28-2010 at 01:03 PM.Ian TannerKawasaki KX450 and many other fine tools
Reply:I really dont think i want one that big and heavy. I mean you would need like a crane to lift that thing. I dont NEED something like the maxstar size but i dont want a giant 800 pound one either. I want to be able to be able to load it in the back of a truck bed by myself if need be.Ok what about everlast? Ive been researching them and they seem to be good machines for a very good price. 225 for like 1300 bucks. (maybe i can find a used one, or maybe even a 250?) Im not a big fan of there foot pedal design or the huge torch but that all could be changed down the road. Like i said i have no brand loyalty i just want something that is going to get the job done. What do you guys think? Also, can anyone say how long they last. Ive read alot of people saying they have had them for a few months but i havent seen anyone thats used them for longer. i guess they come with a 5 year warranty so i guess i shouldnt be that worried. there is a good chance that ill want to upgrade to something bigger and better buy then anyways.
Reply:Originally Posted by ArcticCat843I really dont think i want one that big and heavy. I mean you would need like a crane to lift that thing. I dont NEED something like the maxstar size but i dont want a giant 800 pound one either. I want to be able to be able to load it in the back of a truck bed by myself if need be.Ok what about everlast? Ive been researching them and they seem to be good machines for a very good price. 225 for like 1300 bucks. (maybe i can find a used one, or maybe even a 250?) Im not a big fan of there foot pedal design or the huge torch but that all could be changed down the road. Like i said i have no brand loyalty i just want something that is going to get the job done. What do you guys think? Also, can anyone say how long they last. Ive read alot of people saying they have had them for a few months but i havent seen anyone thats used them for longer. i guess they come with a 5 year warranty so i guess i shouldnt be that worried. there is a good chance that ill want to upgrade to something bigger and better buy then anyways.
Reply:You'll need 200 amps at least if you're doing AL on motorsport apps.  I use 180 amp mig and a 165 amp tig for sports cars and stock cars but virtually all mild steel and on the next project 4130 and it gets a workout on thicker material.  If you're doing off road they typically do thicker material than we do.  It's rare for us to get over an 1/8".  The pro fab shops get larger machines not only for thicker material but to weld thicker, longer.  That hasn't been an issue for me as most of the time is fab and fitting and not welding.  If you are on a line it's a different story.The reason you don't read more about the imports is that they aren't selling as many machines as the big boys and they don't have the product history.  While most of the models are the same with different branding, they often change at least once or more over the year.  They do offer a five year warranty but that's only been for the last year and a half or so and that was only after rampant product defects almost wiped a couple of them out.  They seem to be working well for some people but there are some features I don't like.  The big problems seem to have passed for now but there are always little issues like poor fitting fit or leaks.  They don't seem to have the attention to detail the name brands do as far as  QC but a lot of people, particularly hobbyists and part timers love 'em.Unless you get an inverter machine it's going to weigh a couple hundred pounds. That's just the price of poker.  If I were looking new at this point it would be either a Precision Tig 225 or a Syncro 200.  Keep your eye on CL locally and you may find something. They go quick.  There are some deals on eBay for used machines at times but a lot of the time it's overpriced compared buying new.  If you've only got a grand you'll either need to stumble on a good deal used or go with an import.  And a few hundred for gas and rod.
Reply:Originally Posted by ArcticCat843Ok what about everlast? ... Ive read alot of people saying they have had them for a few months but i havent seen anyone thats used them for longer.
Reply:Buying a used american transformer welder seems a safer bet than buying a new chinese inverter. Not to mention the general downside to buying any imports.The only times I've needed a mobile welding machine, have been when the objects being welded are immobile. 25' leads and a cart with wheels can handle most motorsports fabrication duties.Last edited by fortyonethirty; 07-29-2010 at 03:17 PM.Ian TannerKawasaki KX450 and many other fine tools
Reply:Although you mentioned you are not interested in used, You might look at the Syncrowave 350 thats listed here.http://weldingweb.com/vbb/showthread.php...d=1#post411017You don't have your location posted so I can't tell if it's a reasonable distance from you or not, but thats WAY more machine than that import in so many ways..No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:I meant to say "not opposed" Sorry about that. I just dont want a old dinosaur.  I live in Michigan and ive been known to make some stupid long drives for stuff like this but 14 hours is a little much for me lol. Plus there is NO way ill ever need that. i dont even have room to store that if i did get it. I think the thickest steel ill ever need to weld with a tig would be 1/4 inch. As far as alm i cant really think of a time i would even use that but maybe some day to make a fuel cell or something? or maybe intake piping or something. So im not worried about that. Ive done some more research and a everlast 225lx seems to fix my needs pretty well. I mean as i go i can upgrade stuff like get rig of the giant torch and foot pedal (and i know they dont use standard fittings but ive read about a few people that have adapted stuff so i know it can be done) 1300 for a brand new set up is pretty hard to beat i think. anyone have any more suggestions? maybe some more feed back on everlast stuff?
Reply:i found a used older miller syncrowave 180 that was iin nice shape on ebay for 800 bucks "buy it now".  I met the guy a couple of hours away, and on the way home stopped by a welding supply place and bought a 125cf 100% argon tank for $240 otd.  its been too hot to play with it much, but am looking forward to cooler weather.  just look around
Reply:I've got a little Everlast multifunction Power Ultra 205. I'm sort of wishing I had bought the 256 multifunction instead as the 205 is a dc machine and now I'm moving onto aluminium.My plan now is to buy the 250EX and keep the little 205, it's handy to have a super compact (suitcase sized) machine that can be plugged into 110 volt or 220 and do stick ,tig and plasma. The plasma cutter that will cleanly cut 3/4" steel. I have made some really smooth cuts with that plasma cutter.I can't say enough about the good service at Everlast, they really go the distance.Time will tell if the machine is a reliable one, but it is very nice to use. I was using a friend's Lincoln 185 prior to getting the Everlast. Initially I thought the two machines were about equal to use but as my TIG skill level improves I prefer the Everlast. I seem to be successfully able to weld thinner materials with it. Right now I'm doing a custom job in stainless that requires welding some .038 wall material, no problem with this little inverter.
Reply:go to longevity.com they got good deals and equipmentLincoln Power Arc 4000 Thermal Arc Fabricator 252 iThermal arc 186Thermal Arc 26 tigTweeko 200 amp spool gunHobart AirForce 400WP-17V-12R
Reply:I bought a Lincoln Squarewave Tig 175 that was lightly used for under $1000. It's a 200 lb machine, but it welds far better than I do (and does spectacular work in the hands of my friends who are actual professionals). I also use mine for motorsports fabrication (roll cage tubing, aluminum work, etc) and I really wish I had about 50 more amps (or more if I could afford it). I've had great luck and it's done every job I've ever thrown at it, but some extra power for aluminum would be a nice bonus. I guess I'm trying to say that I wouldn't go any smaller for your intended use. I have never overheated this machine and most times it hardly gets warm. It's big, it's heavy and it's no inverter machine but it's a solid piece of equipment and it will likely outlast me. It's also able to be serviced by almost anyone with an electronics background. The inverters will be expensive to repair once they are out of warranty...if you were to have a problem with one of them (and I'm not saying you will). And Lincoln just re-released this model and it's available new again as well.Good luck with your decision.KevinHobart Handler 210Tweco Fabricator 181iLincoln Squarewave Tig 175
Reply:You're better off buying a used "name brand" machine (Miller, Lincoln, Thermal, ESAB) than you are buying a new Chinese POS off the internet.Where are you going to get that Chinese machine serviced when you DO have problems?Syncro 250 DX Dynasty 200 DXMM 251 w/30A SG XMT 304 w/714 Feeder & Optima PulserHH187Dialarc 250 AC/DCHypertherm PM 1250Smith, Harris, Victor O/ASmith and Thermco Gas MixersAccess to a full fab shop with CNC Plasma, Water Jet, etc.
Reply:Don't forget to factor in some cost for your gas cylinder, torch consumables, and filler metal.  Those all together will add $300-$400 on to your purchase of the machine.Be especially careful if you are looking at a price for "machine only".  A good torch, cable, foot control and work lead will set you back another $400 easy.I'll add another +1 for buying used American equipment.  I have a 1996 Miller Aerowave that I found locally on Craigs List for $2000.  It is a heavy beast, but its is a workhorse and my skill will be the limiting factor in my welding basically forever.  The machine i bought included a watercooler, WP-20 torch, and 50' of welding and ground lead.  As I have figured it, I basically bought the leads and the watercooler and got a bad-*** welder as a bonus. If it doesn't fit, you aren't hitting it hard enough!Miller AerowaveMiller Radiator 1A4.5" DeWalt (with the paddle switch!)Jackson NexGen Helmet