Wire v. stick

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Just a few questions about wire and stick welding. Just talked employer into buying a Lincoln 255xt. They no nothing about mig welding,but some of the "oldtimers" say that mig welding will never stand up to the abuse of a stick. I am proficient with all types of welding and get tired of listening to their stories. Is there any comparison to say 1/8  7018 @100 amps to .035 @ 195 volts as far as strength goes. I do shop repairs on our dozers,excavators,dump trucks and graders. Sorry about being so general with the question, any advice will be greatly appreciated. Not pointing fingers at oldtimers, just step into the 20th century a little.  greg
Reply:195 volts  that lincoln must be a real powerhouse!but seriously,  mig is fast,  thats the real advantage.  properly welded joints should be the same strength with either process,  assuming dry 7018 and ER70 wire.XMT 350 MPa, w/D52-DTA 185 TSWHarris of
Reply:If the argument is about tensile strength, it's easy - the "70" in 7018 and E70s-6 means the same thing, 70,000 psi tensile strength.  I suppose the more relevant argument would be about penetration...  I imagine if not done correctly, this could be an issue given your stated circumstances with heavy equipment and my assumption of at least occasional very thick basemetals.Last edited by turner; 05-06-2011 at 01:05 PM.Dynasty 200DXBobcat 250, TD Cutmaster 38 Hobart Stickmate AC/DC LXHobart 210 Mig / SpoolgunCentury Mig, O/A rigPress/Ring Roller/Tubing Roller/Hyd. Pipe BenderJD2 Notcher/IR 80gal 5hp compressorportaband/chopsaw/grinders/etc.
Reply:It really comes to penetration, from my experienyce an equally powerful machine in each type it is much easier to get a deeper penetrating weld with stick as well as many more choices of electrodes/wire readily availableThere are really no moving parts in a stick welder less the switch contacts so less to fail as far as durability..Tiger Sales:  AHP Distributor    www.tigersalesco.comAHP200x; AHP 160ST; MM350P,  Spoolmatic 30A; Everlast PowerTig 185; Thermal Dynamics 60i plasma.  For Sale:  Cobra Mig 250 w/ Push-pull gun.  Lincoln Wirematic 250
Reply:Thanks to all for your replies. Your help is much appreciated  greg
Reply:Strength wise 70,000 is 70,000. 7018 is more forgiving than bare wire when rust / paint  etc.is involved. For the ultimate penetration flux core CO2 shield is the way to go but you will get a better appearing weld with more puddle control using C25 when welding vertical or overhead.
Reply:Originally Posted by glarkin64Just a few questions about wire and stick welding. Just talked employer into buying a Lincoln 255xt. They no nothing about mig welding,but some of the "oldtimers" say that mig welding will never stand up to the abuse of a stick. I am proficient with all types of welding and get tired of listening to their stories. Is there any comparison to say 1/8  7018 @100 amps to .035 @ 195 volts as far as strength goes. I do shop repairs on our dozers,excavators,dump trucks and graders. Sorry about being so general with the question, any advice will be greatly appreciated. Not pointing fingers at oldtimers, just step into the 20th century a little.  greg
Reply:Originally Posted by Fat BastardThat one line is what stands out to me. Are they talking about the machine, or the welds made with the machine?
Reply:It's really easy run a solid wire MIG bead and not get the proper fusion. Personally I would probably go with the gas shielded flux core.
Reply:Originally Posted by welds4d.........gas shielded flux core.
Reply:Originally Posted by RancherBill??????
Reply:Personally, I don't think you should be allowed to touch a wire feeder until you know how to weld.It is real easy to make wire welds that look good, but are not strong.My biggest bitch about the wire feeders, is the cold starts... Nothing but trouble. I have had good luck with them, but I run hot, and fast. Arc at the leading edge of the puddle, digging hard, and I plan my starts to be in the least stressed part of the weldment. Always finish where you need the strength.It is obvious, you can dump a pile of metal with a feeder, and fast, but if you want it to last...Better be sure of your setup.I will second the nomination for dual shield for equipment repair. Runs like stick, but crazy fast.
Reply:Just saw the 195 volts thing.   Wow.
Reply:Use this you can't go wrong Lincoln Ultracore .045 E 71T1  CO2  works fine in a 255!!!  We run 1/16 DCEP @29 volts 320 amps with DC-600 /LN-9 and Miller 350 XMT  / LN-25 or Miller 12 feeders and use over a ton a week welding up the Trade Certer tower 1 & 4 and the transportation  Hub . Running miles of full pen welds with straight CO2 gas.  John
Reply:The 255xt works fine, we used them and 255cs for training students.  Many of them learned MIG first, then moved to stick and TIG.If you have any doubts, bend test a coupon or several. Just saw the 195 volts thing. Wow.
Reply:dude if you are running 1/8" 7018 at 100 amps, no wonder you are having problems.Weldanpower 225 G7Ironworkers Local #24
Reply:Most people learn you will never completely park your stick machine for a mig. Like anything selecting the right tool/setup for the job is critical. I agree about less skilled people can make a bad good looking weld with a mig but a stick takes skill. Kind of like making semi trucks autos for people that cant shift dont make much sense.Millermatic 252millermatic 175miller 300 Thunderboltlincoln ranger 250smith torcheslots of bfh'sIf it dont fit get a bigger hammer
Reply:I could see the argument for stick being preferred for heavy equipment, penetration and simplicity of the machine itself...However, I do know a few mechanics, who are much more proficient at MIG than I ever will be. And they have the skill-set to properly utilize MIG for such thick metal. I prefer stick, but I can see the advantages to MIG as well...Lincoln Power MIG 210 MP ( boat anchor )Lincoln Weld-Pac 100 HDHobart IronMan 230Cutmaster 42Jackson NexGenSumner Ultra ClampsDWM120