Stuck acetylene valve...

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I bought an oxygen and acetylene bottle at an auction a week ago.  The oxygen valve worked fine and the tank showed a little over 1000psi.  I can't turn the valve on the acetylene tank at all.  I don't want to break the valve so I haven't put too much muscle into it.  Are there any tricks for a stuck valve?  I know you can't use oil with oxygen but is there anything I can put on the acetylene valve to free it up?  I tried searching...  Also, how many CF is the tank?  It's about 36" high with the valve.Thanks,ChrisIMAG0449 by cj93z, on FlickrIMAG0450 by cj93z, on FlickrLast edited by cj93z; 02-04-2012 at 05:50 PM.
Reply:Have you tried turning it both ways or sucking on the output  to see if it's already open? If it is stuck, it's probably best to exchange it at your LWS and let those who know better have the problem.
Reply:Looks like it's a 75cf acetylene cylinder. I'd try to use a "torch" wrench that has a square notch designed for turning those old style valves. If a reasonable amount of force didn't open it, I'd simply swap it out at the LWS for a full cylinder, preferably one with a hand wheel type valve. You might also try to close the valve see if it's already open... Attached Images.No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:Thanks for the replies.  I did get one of those wrenches but it didn't help.  I tried to turn it both ways and it won't budge.  Any idea what the average cost in PA / NJ would be to swap it out?
Reply:It's been a while since I got either of my 2 75 cf acet cylinders refilled. Cylinder and fill runs about $110 in my Fall flyer from the LWS, so I doubt the fill is more than $30-40. Call around, prices sometimes can vary widely..No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:Hi, it appears that there is a large nut that goes over the valve stem. This is the valve packing nut. Try to loosen the packing nut. {turn counter clockwise} This may allow gas to escape if there is any . A 8 point socket of proper size and a breaker bar may work. You should be able to feel if it will move.Just go slow.. GOOD LUCK
Reply:It might be obvious but don't back it all the way out or it may become a lethal projectile. After loosening a light tap with a hammer might persuade it also. I like the idea of blowing into it to see if it was stuck open. Then you can concentrate your efforts on going in the right direction.Joe
Reply:I did loosen the large nut but it didn't help.  I'll try a light tap tomorrow and see if it will budge.  The large nut turns counter clockwise to loosen but I'm not sure which was the valve turns.  Like I said I tried both ways.  I'll try to blow into it or look in with a flash light to see if it's stuck open.
Reply:cj93z  -  What is the latest date stamp on the bottle,  If it's not expired, simply exchange it. I've had valve problems before and the LWS has always exchanged without question; their bottling plant is trained and equiped to deal with such problems.  If expired, you may have to bear the cost of recertification, or you're simply out the purchase price.   Opus
Reply:General info: I used to deal with a hydro shop quite a bit where I used to work. One day we were talking about something and the subject of acet cylinders and valves came up. Apparently at one of their other facilities one of the techs tried to work on a bad valve and the cylinder was still partially full and under pressure unbeknownst to him. The rapid, uncontrolled release of acet ignited and he was seriously injured. I would not mess around too much with the packing nuts on any cylinder, especially acetylene or O2 where the rapid release of gas might cause ignition issues..No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:I think especially if  you are calling a gang wrench "one of those wrenches", and even if you did properly call it a gang wrench, that thing should be taken to the LWS.  It's just me but I would not buy bottles at an auction as a general rule and if I did I'd want to make sure they were still certified and or be prepared to pay for it.
Reply:Originally Posted by RodJI think especially if  you are calling a gang wrench "one of those wrenches", and even if you did properly call it a gang wrench, that thing should be taken to the LWS.  It's just me but I would not buy bottles at an auction as a general rule and if I did I'd want to make sure they were still certified and or be prepared to pay for it.
Reply:Just take it to your LWS they will be happy to exchange it, even it its do for hydro!AEAD 200LE, Lincoln precision tig 185, Millermatic 251, Spectrum 625 extreme, Victor torch , Smithy 1220LTD. and  Do all C-4 band saw ,  Always adding.
Reply:I'm going to take it in this week and exchange it.  Don't want to risk having any problems.  Too bad I can't transport the tank in my Suburban.  I'll borrow my fathers truck to be safe.Thanks for all the replies and advise!
Reply:I'm a safety jerk.  It didn't sound like you knew what you were doing and you're dealing with an unknown bottle of unknown contents and age that is supposed to contain 400 psi flammable gas.  That if released uncontrolled is extremely unstable.  And you're twisting around on the packing nut.  I hope you weren't doing that near anyone or any building.  Sorry I hurt your feelings.    Sounds like you are going to the pros, good call.
Reply:I took the tank in and exchanged it.  Cost a little more than I expected, $96.  Only $75 of that was for the gas the rest was hazmat, energy, tax and some other fees!This valve on this bottle actually opens   but the thread on the cap are kind of screwed
Reply:Originally Posted by cj93zThis valve on this bottle actually opens   but the thread on the cap are kind of screwed
Reply:I agree that seems a high but I'm glad you got it exchanged.  Sometimes it's easy to get lulled into a pattern and forget the catastrophic consequences of mistakes or misjudgment.  I was thinking last night how I will weld OA, shut off the valves, come back and not always purge my lines for a few seconds before relighting.  Lots of folks probably don't but damn, one burn back or flash back and it's a lot of tears.  I think welding is very safe, but there's some non-obvious things that can bite.Oh, and the threads on my last bottle were a little bunged up and seemed tight but the cap will definitely go on with a bit of patience.
Reply:What size tank was it? Around 145cf? Is so that's not far off of my prices here...about $46/100cf
Reply:The shape that the bottle is in, I'm surprised you bought it!  Hopefully you got it cheap!  I would definately do exactly what you did, and exchange it!  It aint worth becoming pink fizz over a gas cylinder!I would almost mail it to the Mythbusters with a note attached, "Make this gone!"
Reply:I'd knowingly buy one like that if it was cheap. Cylinders are "exchange bait", that is all. I learned much of my cylinder kung fu from this forum and from asking nicely at various LWS.I bagged five ex-government ("owner", no name on the neck ring) 200 nitrogen cylinders for twenty bucks apiece yesterday because no one else wanted them since they didn't know you can get 'em hyrdo'ed and converted to other argon or mixed gas. After I use up the nitrogen driving air tools etc around the shop (no sense turning 'em in with unused product) I'll get them filled one by one so I stagger the turnaround times.It's easy to hang an air chuck off a hose fitting and crank up a MIG regulator to run pneumatic tools. Do not do this with oxygen or acetylene or you will die and if there are pics we will find them and use you as an example.I also look for helium cylinders on Craigslist and so should everyone else! There is a national helium shortage (the last couple of Administrations have been selling off the Strategic Helium Reserve, idiots!) and small buyers like party shops often go without.Can you say "Valentines Day"?  If you can find full or even partially full helium cylinders to sell, that beats getting boned buying the expensive small throwaways at chain stores. I just sold  the contents of two full 200 helium cylinders for 150 bucks each (plus 100 deposit) and already have one of them back and at LWS getting hydro'ed. I paid fifty each full because they were ugly (multiple layers of paint) and no one else wanted them.IF you study first, pretty much anyone can get all the cylinders they want if they are patient. I don't do massive amounts of welding, so I don't like cylinder lease fees. Being lazy, I usually buy cylinders and go straight to my LWS to save unloading.Also:Kudos to OP for posting clear pics in the first post.Last edited by farmall; 02-10-2012 at 02:20 PM.