Balled tungsten OR sharpened tungsten for aluminum

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I know this has probably been posted and asked a million times but i cant't seem to come to any conclusion. I am obviously pretty new to tig welding aluminum and I can't seem to find the perfect technique. It seems all I'm able to do at this point is stick two pieces together with a less than beautiful bead lol. So just to hone it in a little more what do most prefer balled or pointed? (i have really only tried pointed because i don't know how to ball it) Thanks in advance!Hobart Handler 190W SpoolgunAirco Dipcor 300 (I WANT A SPOOLGUN FOR THIS!)Lincoln Ranger 8Thermal Arc Arcmaster 185 tig.Hypertherm PM45Evoloution Chop Saw and SkilsawIs it weird that i get exited when anything steel breaks?
Reply:I never intentionally ball back the tungsten. I sharpen it like I would for steel welding, and let it ball back on it's own. Of course I am using an inverter tig and 2%Lanthanated or TriMix tungstens. I even use 2% thoriated with my little tig. They always ball back on their own.And I never let the ball get bigger than the tungsten diameter itself. On a good day I can go all day without dressing my tungsten.Weld like a "WELDOR", not a wel-"DERR" MillerDynasty700DX,Dynasty350DX4ea,Dynasty200DX,Li  ncolnSW200-2ea.,MillerMatic350P,MillerMatic200w/spoolgun,MKCobraMig260,Lincoln SP-170T,PlasmaCam/Hypertherm1250,HFProTig2ea,MigMax1ea.
Reply:What tungsten are you using for alum?Weld like a "WELDOR", not a wel-"DERR" MillerDynasty700DX,Dynasty350DX4ea,Dynasty200DX,Li  ncolnSW200-2ea.,MillerMatic350P,MillerMatic200w/spoolgun,MKCobraMig260,Lincoln SP-170T,PlasmaCam/Hypertherm1250,HFProTig2ea,MigMax1ea.
Reply:shovelon nailed it.My name's not Jim....
Reply:Whatever the purple band is, 2% thoriated? Not entirely sure but thats what my LWS keeps selling meSent from my iPhone using TapatalkHobart Handler 190W SpoolgunAirco Dipcor 300 (I WANT A SPOOLGUN FOR THIS!)Lincoln Ranger 8Thermal Arc Arcmaster 185 tig.Hypertherm PM45Evoloution Chop Saw and SkilsawIs it weird that i get exited when anything steel breaks?
Reply:transformer machine: Green tungsten and cut it square. If you are in a pinch and need to pin point the heat for a tight weld bead, run some red tungsten ground to a point and keep resharpening it after each stop and start.Inverter machine, sharpin it and get after it.
Reply:I am running a thermal arc 185 inverter, it seems my LWS doesn't sell red tungsten because it is radioactive apparently so they say purple is the alternative, does this pose an issue?   Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkHobart Handler 190W SpoolgunAirco Dipcor 300 (I WANT A SPOOLGUN FOR THIS!)Lincoln Ranger 8Thermal Arc Arcmaster 185 tig.Hypertherm PM45Evoloution Chop Saw and SkilsawIs it weird that i get exited when anything steel breaks?
Reply:When I was welding aluminum bicycle frames we always sharpened to a point.
Reply:Purple is E3, it's pretty good stuff. I like to use 2% lanthanated for everything though.I sharpen my tungsten to a point and it just balls back a tiny bit due to the current and AC.Welding/Fab Pics: www.UtahWeld.com
Reply:So starting with pointed with E3 is the way to go?Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkHobart Handler 190W SpoolgunAirco Dipcor 300 (I WANT A SPOOLGUN FOR THIS!)Lincoln Ranger 8Thermal Arc Arcmaster 185 tig.Hypertherm PM45Evoloution Chop Saw and SkilsawIs it weird that i get exited when anything steel breaks?
Reply:When I started TIG welding, i was told that the pure tungstens werent that great anymore. It was easiest to use Thoriated, or 1.5/2% Lanthanated (if the radioactive Thoriated scared you)A lot of people Ive talked to, amd watched on YT (like Jody, WTAT.COM) said to avid pure tungsten. Is this hooey or all in preference?
Reply:What color is 2% lanthinated?Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkHobart Handler 190W SpoolgunAirco Dipcor 300 (I WANT A SPOOLGUN FOR THIS!)Lincoln Ranger 8Thermal Arc Arcmaster 185 tig.Hypertherm PM45Evoloution Chop Saw and SkilsawIs it weird that i get exited when anything steel breaks?
Reply:Originally Posted by bstrout1120What color is 2% lanthinated?Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Reply:Originally Posted by bstrout1120So starting with pointed with E3 is the way to go?Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Reply:I just sharpen like normal and it will ball up.  I use an inverter machine with purple E3 tungsten.
Reply:i was told that the pure tungstens werent that great anymore
Reply:So what tungesten should I use with a Dialarc 250hf? Red?1973 Lincoln SA 200, Already replaced shunt coils, Idle board (SOLD)1984 Miller Dialarc 250HF, Miller water cooler, 250 AMP water cooled torch, you know the worx.
Reply:Originally Posted by TuscanySo what tungesten should I use with a Dialarc 250hf? Red?
Reply:As best I could tell, pure tungsten was liked because it would ball up in a predictable way - a relatively nice looking ball.Red (Thoriated) tended to get ugly and crooked when overheated - so green was the way to go.I only have inverters right now and I use either ceriated (still have some from when I bought the machine) or Arc Zone's Arc Time (Tri Mix).  And in about 10 years, when I run out of the current supply, I might try something else.So, sharpened point on aluminum with balance set at 75-80%, Frequency above 80 (usually about 100) and current levels 66% favoring electrode negative (this is a setting option on the Dynasty 350).  After welded 30" of bead it feels like the point is dulled a bit.Con Fuse!Miller Dynasty 350Millermatic 350P-Spoolmatic 30AMiller Multimatic 200Hypertherm PowerMax 1000G3Miller Maxstar 200DX
Reply:The torch that came with my machine has a 1/16" 2% thoriated tungsten in it now and it is balled and the machine was set on AC for aluminum. I was always taught green for aluminum and red for anything else, but that was also with transformer machines not inverters and I have a transformer machine. If there is a new method or preferred way I would be interested to find out as well. Thanks for all the help.1973 Lincoln SA 200, Already replaced shunt coils, Idle board (SOLD)1984 Miller Dialarc 250HF, Miller water cooler, 250 AMP water cooled torch, you know the worx.
Reply:From my own experience a transformer will make a much larger ball than an inverter. Esp on higher current.  I found more need for multiple size tungsten on the transformer than I have on inverters which 3/32 works for about everything.  But my transformer machine would put out more than twice the current of my inverter as well. Sent from my SCH-I545 using TapatalkTiger Sales:  AHP Distributor    www.tigersalesco.comAHP200x; AHP 160ST; MM350P,  Spoolmatic 30A; Everlast PowerTig 185; Thermal Dynamics 60i plasma.  For Sale:  Cobra Mig 250 w/ Push-pull gun.  Lincoln Wirematic 250
Reply:May someone will run pure side by side in an inverter and tranny at there shop and take some pics.  Put the inverter at 50% DCEN and see if there's a difference.  Isn't the large ball that forms on pure a result of more DCEP on the electrode rather than the wave form of a tranny machine?When I tried pure on my inverter it balled the same way it did in my Syncrowave.
Reply:Here is a 3/32" 2% lanthanated electrode after about 200" of weld on 1/8" aluminum. The was on a transformer that doesn't have balance control (Lincoln 175), so I have no idea what the balance is. I started with a sharpened tungsten. 2% lanthanated electrode by Zanconato Custom Cycles, on FlickrThis was what it looked like before I started (this was a different tungsten, but I sharpened the same).2% lanthanated electrode by Zanconato Custom Cycles, on Flickr
Reply:Originally Posted by zankHere is a 3/32" 2% lanthanated electrode after about 200" of weld on 1/8" aluminum. The was on a transformer that doesn't have balance control (Lincoln 175), so I have no idea what the balance is. I started with a sharpened tungsten. 2% lanthanated electrode by Zanconato Custom Cycles, on FlickrThis was what it looked like before I started (this was a different tungsten, but I sharpened the same).2% lanthanated electrode by Zanconato Custom Cycles, on Flickr
Reply:2% lanthanated is the only tungsten I have yet to try.I have tried 2% ceriated, 1.5% lanthanated, 0.8% zirconiated and 2% thoriated.The zirconiated is by far the worst on AC. I honestly don't know why they came up with the stuff. The 2% ceriated and 1.5% lanthanated feel and last the same both on DC and AC.The 2% thoriated feels the best in both DC and AC.It resists contamination better than the others does not spit even at high amperage and balls up nicely on AC.I really tried to like the other non radio active alternatives and find them decent but I always come back to thoriated.All this is on an inverter machine on all possible settings (square wave, sinusoidal wave, mixed AC/DC tig, high and low frequencies etc)Last edited by taz00; 03-27-2014 at 03:53 PM.And to answer the original question I always start with a sharpened tungsten even for AC, usually at 22.5 degrees (I have an ESG tungsten sharpener).
Reply:So is there a tungesten to avoid with a Dialarc 250hf?1973 Lincoln SA 200, Already replaced shunt coils, Idle board (SOLD)1984 Miller Dialarc 250HF, Miller water cooler, 250 AMP water cooled torch, you know the worx.
Reply:I was actually having issues on my TA185 where my tungsten would create a huge blue ball at the end, and every time i adjust my balance it either stays nice and sharp or just immediately balls into the nozzle as a giant blue ball. Whats a happy medium for balance to get the right ball at the end on an inverter like mine? Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkHobart Handler 190W SpoolgunAirco Dipcor 300 (I WANT A SPOOLGUN FOR THIS!)Lincoln Ranger 8Thermal Arc Arcmaster 185 tig.Hypertherm PM45Evoloution Chop Saw and SkilsawIs it weird that i get exited when anything steel breaks?
Reply:I would avoid buying green or brown tungsten. I'm using a Precision Tig 375 transformer at work, though rarely over 200A. There is basically no time for prep so I usually run about 45% positive balance to keep it clean. I would use blue Lanth if Linde carried it, but all they have is 1.5% gold Lanth, holds up to high balance well. Sometimes I'll use a grey Ceriated on an inside corner, it balls more and gives less of a pinpoint focus, but holds up better than green. I do have a few old greenies around for nostalgia's sake, but every time I think it might work better I'll go back to gold or grey within 10 seconds. The blue on your ball is from oxidation, so a bit more post flow can help, but it sounds like excess positive balance. Try 40% the TA 186 indicates the positive not negative balance, you might have it backwardsLast edited by Brazin; 03-28-2014 at 11:09 AM.
Reply:Originally Posted by shovelon. . . red for steels or DC in general, and point both ends for identification.
Reply:Originally Posted by duaneb55I like the single point, double point identification method.  Simple and effective.