Benefits of aftermarket MIG guns (Tweco or Bernard?) for MM252

admin

My M-25 gun on my Miller 252 welder is giving me some problems. I believe it will be a fairly simple fix, but before I put any effort/money in to it, I was wondering what the benefits of an aftermarket gun such as a Tweco or a Bernard would be? I've tried searching but I haven't found a ton of info. What little I have found seems to be contradictory in nature. Some people say the Tweco will make a world of difference, and some say the Bernard is way better. Both sides seem to think the other side is way worse. Everyone says it's better than the M-25, but no-one says why.I don't have a bunch of extra consumables laying around right now so if I'm going to do something, now would be the time to do it. However, if the difference isn't pretty significant, I'm thinking the stock gun is fine for me. Any thoughts or links to information about why it's worth doing? Thanks.
Reply:I've got both the Bernard and the M-25. The Bernard is available on E-bay for about $100 shipped. It is a higher amp gun than the M-25, bigger cable. The liners are essentially the same. The bernard is available in a 15' gun, M-25 (mine anyway) is a 12'.Miller triggers are problematic in whatever version they come in (old style, or micro switch). Miller consumables are cheaper, bernards are heavier duty. Since you have the M-25, and are not overheating it using it for spray arc, just put a new liner in it (or switch, or whatever the problem is) and continue on. You are not going to notice any world of difference until you are welding at over 250 amps (spray arc) and really pushing the machine.
Reply:It is, however, always good to have TWO MIG guns, in case one fails in a manner where you can't economically or quickly repair it.
Reply:Thanks. I believe the problem is the switch but I haven't looked in to it yet.I don't use this welder for production work, just projects around the farm when they come up. This means my duty cycle is frequently quite low because I'm not being efficient (engineer as you go kind of a thing). This means I doubt I'll have an instance of overheating the gun no matter what thickness I'm welding. That being said, most of what I weld is 1/8" thick or thicker. Have welded some 1/2" and intend to do more in the future.I don't really like my .035" wire for going up that high. I would rather have one gun set up for .045" wire which I think should work fine for everything 1/8" and up. Then I could convert my current gun over to .023 wire for really small stuff which I use less frequently.Look at that, I can justify just about anything. Does this line of thinking make any sense? Thanks.
Reply:I have used a variety of guns,  I am now sold on the bernard Q series with centerfire consumables.   Really nice gun, 360 head rotation, and really long life to the tips on the centerfire setup. The back ends are interchangeable too.   I have a miller backend available as that is what mine had when I bought it and changed to a euro backend..  check ebay for the gunsTiger Sales:  AHP Distributor    www.tigersalesco.comAHP200x; AHP 160ST; MM350P,  Spoolmatic 30A; Everlast PowerTig 185; Thermal Dynamics 60i plasma.  For Sale:  Cobra Mig 250 w/ Push-pull gun.  Lincoln Wirematic 250
Reply:http://profaxlenco.com/^^^ The makers of most Miller guns ^^^
Reply:Originally Posted by Fat Bastardhttp://profaxlenco.com/^^^ The makers of most Miller guns ^^^
Reply:After buying a miller xtreme 12 suitcase feeder that came with a bernard Q400 gun. I fell in love with the bernard guns. The first thing I do with a new miller machine is take the stock miller gun off the machine and throw the gun out.  Then install a brand new bernard Q300 gun on it.  Both my miller 251s and my miller 52 feeder have the bernard Q300 guns.  The guys can beat the crap out of those guns and they still work.  Plus the center fire consumables last forever.Lincoln 300 Vantage 2008300 Commander 1999SA250 1999SA200 1968Miller Syncrowave 200XMT350MPA/S-52E/xr-15Xtreme 12vs Millermatic 251 w/30A  Millermatic 251 Dialarc 250 Hypertherm 1250 GEKA & Bantom Ironwokers
Reply:Yeah I first learned about the Q series bernards in another WW thread a while back.  Decided to try one and was sold on them since...Tiger Sales:  AHP Distributor    www.tigersalesco.comAHP200x; AHP 160ST; MM350P,  Spoolmatic 30A; Everlast PowerTig 185; Thermal Dynamics 60i plasma.  For Sale:  Cobra Mig 250 w/ Push-pull gun.  Lincoln Wirematic 250
Reply:Me I like the Tregaskiss Tough Guns. I have their 450A gun on my MM250 which has the same capabilities as its newer relative the MM252. That being said, you can swap the handle and lug ends to "rejuvenate" your M-25 gun. Many wire feeding problems go away with a new liner. Trigger problems aren't hard to fix either. M-25 guns do come in 15' lengths (I have one, so I know). I keep my M-25 for use as a backup gun although it means I have to stock duplicate consumables which is problematic.metalmagpie
Reply:Also, just an FYI, the front end parts are available to change your Miller M-25 to make it hold Bernard consumables. As I recall there is a kit. I just unscrewed the Miller parts and screwed on some spare bernard parts, noow my M-25 gun uses Bernard centerfire consumables.
Reply:Originally Posted by walkerAlso, just an FYI, the front end parts are available to change your Miller M-25 to make it hold Bernard consumables. As I recall there is a kit. I just unscrewed the Miller parts and screwed on some spare bernard parts, noow my M-25 gun uses Bernard centerfire consumables.
Reply:Originally Posted by soutthpawI believe Bernard is now making many of the Miller guns.   The real point here is that very few of the major brands make their own guns...