Shortness of breath

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Since I have been welding so much aluminum I have had some breathing issues that I think are related to the aluminum vapors........I just went and bought a respirator from my LWS  and it is supposed to help....Anyone  have this kind of issue  before with aluminum?  Miller Dynasty 350Twenty Six HammersThree Crow BarsBig Rock
Reply:Have you seen a Dr. yet! If not maybe get a chest xray. Hopefully nothing major. Ive had some weird side effects breathing in some crap over the years, that slowly work there way out. Knock on wood with the breathing tho. Play it safe and get checked bud!I hate being bi-polar it's awsomeMy Heroes Have Always Been Cowboys
Reply:Table 1 Health Effects of Fumes, Gases and Organic Vapours Produced During WeldingSourceEffects and SymptomsFUMESAluminumAluminum component of some alloys, e.g., Inconels, copper, zinc, steel, magnesium, brass and filler materials.Respiratory irritant.BerylliumHardening agent found in copper, magnesium, aluminum alloys and electrical contacts.“Metal Fume Fever.” A carcinogen. Other chronic effects include damage to the respiratory tract.Cadmium OxidesStainless steel containing cadmium or plated materials, zinc alloy.Irritation of respiratory system, sore and dry throat, chest pain and breathing difficulty. Chronic effects include kidney damage and emphysema. Suspected carcinogen.ChromiumMost stainless-steel and high-alloy materials, welding rods. Also used as plating material.Increased risk of lung cancer. Some individuals may develop skin irritation. Some forms are carcinogens (hexavalent chromium).CopperAlloys such as Monel, brass, bronze. Also some welding rods.Acute effects include irritation of the eyes, nose and throat, nausea and “Metal Fume Fever.”FluoridesCommon electrode coating and flux material for both low- and high-alloy steels.Acute effect is irritation of the eyes, nose and throat. Long-term exposures may result in bone and joint problems. Chronic effects also include excess fluid in the lungs.Iron OxideThe major contaminant in all iron or steel welding processes.Siderosis – a benign form of lung disease caused by particles deposited in the lungs. Acute symptoms include irritation of the nose and lungs. Tends to clear up when exposure stops.LeadSolder, brass and bronze alloys, primer/coating on steels.Chronic effects to nervous system, kidneys, digestive system and mental capacity. Can cause lead poisoning.CH032 — Chemical Hazards 3Revised August 2009CH032 — Chemical Hazards 4Revised August 2009SourceEffects and SymptomsManganeseMost welding processes, especially high-tensile steels.“Metal Fume Fever.” Chronic effects may include central nervous system problems.MolybdenumSteel alloys, iron, stainless steel, nickel alloys.Acute effects are eye, nose and throat irritation, and shortness of breath.NickelStainless steel, Inconel, Monel, Hastelloy and other high-alloy materials, welding rods and plated steel.Acute effect is irritation of the eyes, nose and throat. Increased cancer risk has been noted in occupations other than welding. Also associated with dermatitis and lung problems.VanadiumSome steel alloys, iron, stainless steel, nickel alloys.Acute effect is irritation of the eyes, skin and respiratory tract. Chronic effects include bronchitis, retinitis, fluid in the lungs and pneumonia.Zinc OxidesGalvanized and painted metal.“Metal Fume Fever.”.GASESCarbon MonoxideFormed in the arc.Absorbed readily into the bloodstream, causing headaches, dizziness or muscular weakness. High concentrations may result in unconsciousness and death.Hydrogen FluorideDecomposition of rod coatings.Irritating to the eyes and respiratory tract. Overexposure can cause lung, kidney, bone and liver damage. Chronic exposure can result in chronic irritation of the nose, throat and bronchi.Nitrogen OxideFormed in the arc.Eye, nose and throat irritation in low concentrations. Abnormal fluid in the lung and other serious effects at higher concentrations. Chronic effects include lung problems such as emphysema.Oxygen DeficiencyWelding in confined spaces, and air displacement by shielding gas.Dizziness, mental confusion, asphyxiation and death.OzoneFormed in the welding arc, especially during plasma-arc, MIG and TIG processes.Acute effects include fluid in the lungs and hemorrhaging. Very low concentrations (e.g., one part per million) cause headaches and dryness of the eyes. Chronic effects include significant changes in lung functionOf all the things I lost I miss my mind the most...I know just enough about everything to be dangerous......You cant cure stupid..only kill it...
Reply:reals NASTY $HIT...go get checked out.....NOWOf all the things I lost I miss my mind the most...I know just enough about everything to be dangerous......You cant cure stupid..only kill it...
Reply:Are you using a wire feeder (spool gun) or TIG? I've been TIG welding aluminum for almost 30 yrs. and have never experienced any breathing problems. (other than smoking too damn many cigarettes)If I knew that I was going to live this long, I would have taken better care of myself
Reply:Hello B_C, I have found that shielding gases, more so argon, can cause replacement of oxygen if you are doing a lot of welding with your head closely located near the source. Or, if you are in a confined area such as inside of boxes, cylinders, or other shapes that might cause the shielding gas to pool. Even though you may feel as if you have adequate ventilation or air movement you can still be subjected to reduction in oxygen levels of the air that you are breathing. When I feel that I might put myself in a position where I could be subjected to "bad stuff" I use a respirator that has the filters located on tubes that go over the back and are behind you in the waist area. This design generally provides for the intake of your breathing air to be out of the effected welding fume/shielding gas concentrations. Just a bit of food for thought, but I would also agree with the others that you should probably make an appointment with your doctor to rule out any other issues that could be more serious. Good luck and best regards, Allanaevald
Reply:I'm trying to get Employers in the UK to Vacinate welders in the workplacehttp://welderfab.co.uk/index.php/topic,331.0.htmlWELDERS and other workers exposed to metal fumes should receive a simple vaccination that can prevent serious lung disease and even save their lives, according to a new review published today in the scientific journal Occupational Medicine.The review found that welders die more often from certain types of pneumonia and that they should be offered the PPV23 vaccination so that potentially fatal lung disease can be prevented.‘Many employers are unaware that exposure to welding fumes can cause pneumonia, and that although fatal cases are rare, they can occur,’ explained Keith Palmer, Professor of Occupational Medicine at the MRC Lifecourse Epidemiology Unit, University of Southampton, and lead author of the review.‘Companies need to ensure that anyone who undertakes welding work or is exposed to metal fumes is offered the vaccination. They also need to advise workers how to reduce their exposure to the fumes as much as possible and encourage them to not smoke.’According to the review, welders are up to six times more likely to suffer from pneumococcal pneumonia – a disease that usually affects those who are very young, the elderly and those with impaired immunity.
Reply:Got to ask why should the responsibility fall to the employer?
Reply:If this is employment related (and you have a decent employer) I'd let them know.  Either way you need to get checked out by a (good) pulmonologist / cardiologist.  Shortness of breath is a real no-no.I've had unexplained shortness of breath twice.  Most recently it was pneumonia and cleared up with a solid round of antibiotics.  First time was cancer (age 23) and it was easily cleared up with a year of chemotherapy followed by a month of daily radition.Dude, it is SOOOOO easy to go get checked for peace of mind. I love my lungs, eyes, and frankfurter.  In that order.ps, my father's shortness of breath was clogged arteries and a heart attack.  go figure.
Reply:Why shouldnt the responsability fall on the employer?
Reply:Originally Posted by Ron PadillaWhy shouldnt the responsability fall on the employer?
Reply:Originally Posted by Fat BastardGot to ask why should the responsibility fall to the employer?
Reply:Originally Posted by Fat BastardGot to ask why should the responsibility fall to the employer?
Reply:B_C, i hope you get this straightened out ASAP!!!! I for one look forward to your posts, and wish you well. Breathing difficulties are nothing to put off getting checked.
Reply:Originally Posted by Gerry1964Because the employer has a duty of care over your health and safety whislt in his employ,,Doctors and Nurses get vacinated against major dieseases and illnesses, imagine what would happen if they didn't.Breathing in fumes in the workplace is an employer issue and needs to be addressed, preventing employees becoming ill as a result has got to be good business practice
Reply:Originally Posted by B_CSince I have been welding so much aluminum I have had some breathing issues that I think are related to the aluminum vapors........I just went and bought a respirator from my LWS  and it is supposed to help....Anyone  have this kind of issue  before with aluminum?
Reply:It wouldn't hurt to get a check up BC. I wouldn't expect sudden shortness of breath from welding unless ozone or metal fumes cause an allergic reaction. Truth is you can be fine with something forever and then one day become allergic to it.What RodJ mentioned above is very common with cardio problems, my father was the same with only shortness of breath at 59yrs.Usually if you displace oxygen you get mellow, giddy, light headed or feel dizzy. If you put the face mask on and labor to breathe and/or get a nasal drip with it on... see a doctor.Hope it's just a bug.Matt
Reply:I would DEFINATELY get some high volume fans near the exits and create an exchange air situation.   Obviously you dont want to disturb your shielding gasses but you need to move the bad air out for clean air.Vantage 500's LN-25's, VI-400's, cobramatics, Miller migs, synch 350 LX, Powcon inverters, XMT's, 250 Ton Acurrpress 12' brake, 1/4" 10' Atlantic shear,Koikie plasma table W/ esab plasmas. marvel & hyd-mech saws, pirrana & metal muncher punches.
Reply:Originally Posted by B_CSince I have been welding so much aluminum I have had some breathing issues that I think are related to the aluminum vapors........I just went and bought a respirator from my LWS  and it is supposed to help....Anyone  have this kind of issue  before with aluminum?
Reply:I am not surprised that Fat asked the question.  And like was mentioned go back and ask the miners or anyone else that has been exposed to that type of work environment, However being that B.C. is self employed then the resposability falls on his shoulders and no one else.  and seeing his Dr vs coming here would be the best advise, even when an employer is invloved at least here is Cali, there is a host of training, and other issues that need to be addressed to satisfy Cal-osha. But enough with that B.C see the Dr and ensure that nothing else is going on so that you dont find out to late.Best.
Reply:Originally Posted by Mick120Go back in time and ask all the pit workers that dug coal in the 19th century.....I'm sure they'll be able to answer that one.I'm surprised anyone would even ask that..........
Reply:there is somewhat of a little subject hijacking going on but, let me point out a few things about safety programs.  If it has been decided by an employer for safety sake that a piece of personal protective gear is to be used and it is company policy and it is issued, then it is the responsability o fthe employer to see to it thatit be used.  If is is observed that an employee is in violation of a company safety policy then the employee should be written up with progressive write ups that could and will lead to termination period. These policies are in place notonly forthe sake of the employer but the employee as well.  companies might not like it and employees might not like it but in the end both win. Now i am sure that there are a whole bunch that will disagree with me and that is fine,but people wonder why bad employees are kept around it is because there is bad management letting it happen.  MY RANT.
Reply:There are no healthy welding fumes. Besides a respiratior, have a GOOD fume extraction setup.
Reply:As Shovelon said, Ozone. I was exposed to extremely high levels of Ozone when i welded inside Delta II rockets. It would take your breath away and make you sick with bronchitis like symptoms for weeks. There is also a "take your breath away" effect from some aluminum alloys when you brush the post-weld smut from the weld affected zones. Really bad on 2195(which I doubt you have ever encountered).Good luck you old phart.Two turn tables and a microphone.
Reply:OK.... you guys go ahead and take your best shot at this.... But it works.When welding using a "shielding gas" that gas will build up in the welders lungs. The gas is heavier than air. A couple of times during the shift find yourself a place where you can elevate the lower part of your body above your chest / head. Breath in and out with deep breaths. Do it again when you go home.Flush the heavy gas out of your lungs.Thanks,HoboLincoln SA200's... at least 15 - 20. They come and go. Growing partial to the "Short Hoods" in my old age. Last count on Short Hoods was 13 in possession.Originally Posted by hobohiltonOK.... you guys go ahead and take your best shot at this.... But it works.When welding using a "shielding gas" that gas will build up in the welders lungs. The gas is heavier than air. A couple of times during the shift find yourself a place where you can elevate the lower part of your body above your chest / head. Breath in and out with deep breaths. Do it again when you go home.Flush the heavy gas out of your lungs.Thanks,Hobo
Reply:Originally Posted by hobohiltonWhen welding using a "shielding gas" that gas will build up in the welders lungs. The gas is heavier than air. A couple of times during the shift find yourself a place where you can elevate the lower part of your body above your chest / head. Breath in and out with deep breaths. Do it again when you go home.Flush the heavy gas out of your lungs.
Reply:B_C,Theres a few possibilities.  One is that you have some other cardio respiratory problem that is being unmasked from the partial pressure of oxygen being displaced by the Argon or Lab Grade 32 (or whatever magic gas u use) Helium.  So your already barely working system ain't doin too well without inhaling 21% O2.  This is unlikely if you are having absolutely no problems in any other environments, especially under exertion.  The other (and more likely if it only occurs with welding Aluminum and never under any other circumstances) is that you are getting Asthma-like symptoms from an irritant in what you are inhaling.  It could be the ozone or the vapors off the Aluminum.  It would be prudent to see your physician and check it out.  You need an EKG, a chest X-ray, blood work and some pulmonary function tests(PFT).  If you know your Doc well, see if you can do a PFT when you are symptom free and right after a heavy day of Aluminum welding.  That may be your answer.  This, of course, would be after you've eliminated any other potentially dangerous causes ( ie Atherosclerotic heart disease). I fix people for a living, weld for a hobby.TA Arcmaster 300CM3XMT 304S22P12 suitcase feederX-Treme 12VSOptima pulserTA161SMaxstar 150STLHypertherm PM45OP setupStihl 020AVP, 039, 066 Magnum
Reply:Originally Posted by hobohiltonOK.... you guys go ahead and take your best shot at this.... But it works.When welding using a "shielding gas" that gas will build up in the welders lungs. The gas is heavier than air. A couple of times during the shift find yourself a place where you can elevate the lower part of your body above your chest / head. Breath in and out with deep breaths. Do it again when you go home.Flush the heavy gas out of your lungs.
Reply:I agree with everyone else, huffing welding fumes and grinding dust etc... We had a Industrial Hygienist do some testing for us not too long ago and we found that SMAW on Stainless Steel piping, for 10 minutes put me over the OSHA Exposure limit 10X for Hex Chromium. We are required to use masks now or an air filtration system now when we stick weld any SS. The sensors six feet away from the welding were over the limit as well. GTAW was not an issue.
Reply:Made by Miller, costs a bundle no doubt, works good I used this one for awhile in a class.   Employer would buy it, the employee would USE it, protects them both,  much cheaper than  OSHA or health issues. Wish you well on it,  my Respiratory doc at Scripps thinks welding is near to suicide... she is a 35 year old beautiful woman... what does she know?  My respiratory problems are unrelated, but she does feel it aggravates it... I just sit there, grab a breath, smile nod my head, and enjoy the view.... male dog that I am. Attached ImagesLincoln Power MIG 215Lincoln WeldPak 3200HDLincon ProCut 25Lincoln WeldanPower 225 AC/DCIf all else fails... buy more tools
Reply:Originally Posted by Happy BobAre you using a wire feeder (spool gun) or TIG? I've been TIG welding aluminum for almost 30 yrs. and have never experienced any breathing problems. (other than smoking too damn many cigarettes)
Reply:We use the Miller Filtration Unit whenever there is smoke or fumes. There is also a 3m mask P9 (I think) that works well for the bad stuff too.
Reply:Originally Posted by B_CI think its the Argon Im breathing causing deprivation.
Reply:I think your big contributing factor is the lack of airflow through the room.    even a box fan blowing air OUT of the room would help as it would force exchange air from somewhere.Vantage 500's LN-25's, VI-400's, cobramatics, Miller migs, synch 350 LX, Powcon inverters, XMT's, 250 Ton Acurrpress 12' brake, 1/4" 10' Atlantic shear,Koikie plasma table W/ esab plasmas. marvel & hyd-mech saws, pirrana & metal muncher punches.
Reply:This whole discussion of whether argon is causing BC's shortness of breath is ridiculous.BC, unless you're emptying an ENTIRE 300cf bottle of argon in a 7' x 7' SEALED ROOM, you're not going to have enough argon in the room to make a difference in the % of oxygen in the room.Get thee to a flocking DOCTOR!
Reply:Originally Posted by shovelonYes, I have had this issue with alum. It turned out to be ozone which irritated my throat and lungs. Day after day of welding alum and sticking my face up next to the weld did it. I was able to use a 3m brand respirator with ozone control and that did it. Now I also use a fan under my table to direct some fresh air at my chest. That helps alot. Anything because on a hot day I hate the mask. Hope you figure it out, and it may not be a bad idea to get a checkup.
Reply:Originally Posted by B_CSince I have been welding so much aluminum I have had some breathing issues that I think are related to the aluminum vapors........I just went and bought a respirator from my LWS  and it is supposed to help....Anyone  have this kind of issue  before with aluminum?
Reply:All that good advice is hard to come by cheap. I agree with papa lion that some fume extraction is a good idea, given all the nasty poo that vapourizes in any weld. I made a cheapo extractor with a blower and a flexible aluminum duct hose that cost me about $100 total and does the job real well. Our health is the most important thing, don't cheap out on that. The cost of being forced out of work is far too high. Get well soon!  When a welder tells you to "stick it", what do they really mean?"In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act." - George Orwell
Reply:I have always been bothered by welding smoke while welding indoors.6011 6012 .Sick stomach,indegestion. No problem outdoors.Congestive heart failure will cause breathing problems.Took a while to find out what was causing my breathing problems.Ozone has a sour smell.
Reply:Got an appointment Wednesday so that's a start.....Haven't been welding all week and still feel bad.....Hot flushed feeling on my face and neck....I might have to go work with Pangea at Walmart......lmao  Miller Dynasty 350Twenty Six HammersThree Crow BarsBig Rock
Reply:Originally Posted by B_CGot an appointment Wednesday so that's a start.....Haven't been welding all week and still feel bad.....Hot flushed feeling on my face and neck....I might have to go work with Pangea at Walmart......lmao
Reply:I had the same thing happen to me a few months ago. I do quite a bit of welding and wrenching and found myself becoming easily 'winded'.I would become short of breath just talking, let alone doing something strenuous,like pulling a transmission out of a D8 dozer.or something like that. After persistent nagging from my wife,I went to the doctor.Turns out after some tests,MRI, cat scan,etc.it turned out I had 2 large blood clots,one in each lung! I spent 2 days in the hospital. I thought it was just the heat,it had been VERY hot and humid here for several weeks so I assumed that was it.Little did I know.....My point is,get looked at,you just never know....
Reply:does welding for years affect your eyes and hearing? all the older guys in my family that have been welding a long time all have problems with their hearing and eye sight
Reply:to much of anything will eventualy affect your eye sight, hearing, etc, that is why you were told not tug on your wank to much when you were young.
Reply:Originally Posted by pasttimes8does welding for years affect your eyes and hearing? all the older guys in my family that have been welding a long time all have problems with their hearing and eye sight
Reply:B_C we're thinking of ya'.  Do see the Doc for sure.  I'm pretty screwed up on breathing and the Docs are always concerned with the amount of Iron in my blood. Low iron really tanks ya' quckly.   Let's hope it is a simple imbalance maybe like that,  and that you will weather it. The respiratory Docs give you a fun painless test, hold your breath then breath it ALL out and they calculate the amount of air you can move... so when you are at about 70% of normal things get real tough.  Jogging is out, sorry.Lincoln Power MIG 215Lincoln WeldPak 3200HDLincon ProCut 25Lincoln WeldanPower 225 AC/DCIf all else fails... buy more tools
Reply:Get it checked out.  I lost a welder friend to aluminum.Ranger 225Weld Pac 100Power Mig 180CMagnum 100 Spool GunHobart EZ Tig 165iSurf for cardiovascular exercise.  Saltwater is good for you.
Reply:Well BC, what did the DR say? I wish you wellSafety 3rdGump
Reply:Originally Posted by GumpWell BC, what did the DR say? I wish you well