Opinions? gas saver or gas lenses ?

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I have ordered a ck-20r-25sf water cooled torch.   I learned on a weldcraft which neverhad a gas lens on it.  I am considering what accessories might be the mostusefull for the CK.    I have seen the BIG gas saver nozzle which they claim youcan operate the electrode out to 1 inch out.  ( WOW )   But the cup looks prettybig.   If I go with regular gas lenses I guess I would want 2 or 3 sizes maybe......Does the gas saver use less gas than a gas lens or non-gas lens cup ??????????The gas saver looks like it would be good for sheet metal seams being welded layingdown on the welding table or in a position where the largeness of the big cup doesn't getin the way.  Would regular gas lenses be more usefull on the bigger cup sizes (aluminum) orin the smaller sizes of cup  ( thin wall crome-molly tube ) -------OR would you want both large - medium and small ...... ( if $ was no object you know )seen lenses used but never got to use one myself.  The smoke demonstrationsmake it look pretty good !Any thoughts ?TimPS-  Don't tell daddy I pregnant....  There is a small blue bun in the oven !Bringing baby home some time next week !   Furnishing the nursery room now !Building cooler, table and cart. ( crap - I love welding  ! -must be my "crack" ! )
Reply:When I was 1st learning tig we used the 20 series torches with the small size gas lenses. The instructor had me keep extending the tungsten out farther and farther until you could see the lack of shielding to show how far you could extend it with the gas lense vs doing the same thing with a conventional design. I was amazed you could get it out stupid far ( well over an inch) if needed to get into tight corners and so on.As far as using less gas, yes you can turn down the flow a bit with the gas lens and get similar coverage to that with a standard torch. I found the ability to extend the tungsten out farther to be able to see it better and get into tight areas without having to change cups to be the biggest advantage. Almost everything we did used the #8 cup and getting into tight cornes and so on wasn't a big deal. The guys with the older machines with the aircooled torches without the gas lenses had to go down to the smaller cups to do what we could..No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:i only use gas lenses.  the gas saver kits are nice cause they are lighter than a regular gas lense & they use a nicer collet that doesn't distort over time.  try them both & see if you perfer the gas saver over a standard lense.  i have both & use the standard lense on dirtier metals cause they are cheaper to replace if they get clogged up.
Reply:Gas saver collet bodies have rubber o-rings and you push the cup onto them.  They have a clear pyrex glass cup available.  The more conventional (and industry standard) gas lens collet bodies have screw on cups.  No glass cup available.The benefit to the industry standard gas lens setup is, it is readily available, made by various manufacturers (so low in price, and lots of options IE in range of cup sizes, etc).  The benefit to the gas saver setup is, it has a glass cup option.  And I'm sure its pretty high quality.  Probably expensive.The glass cup is only available in a 1/2" ID (#8 cup size equivalent).  There are #4-#8 alumina push on cups available that fit the gas saver collet body.The large diameter gas saver cup is a special deal with its own collet body and 1-1/8" ID glass cup.  (No alternate cups available for it.)  It would be good for titanium and maybe for some stainless and other projects, but would take a high flowrate of argon to make that large cup work.  (I imagine about the only scenario where that cup would "save" on shielding gas, is if it avoids you needing to fill up a purge chamber.)The "wedge" collets that come with the gas saver system are available individually, and work with the conventional (regular or gas lens) collet bodies as well.  I've been trying one out (on a conventional collet body not a gas saver), and I'm not sure I'm actually sold on it.  What I don't like is it can sometime loosen up all the sudden as it goes through one or more heat cycles.  It might have something to do with it being made of brass instead of the "usual" copper.  The wedge collet does tighten up positively and firmly when you initially screw down on it though.  Its sometimes hard to extend the tungsten out a little bit more with a wedge collet.  Even with the backcap loosened, there is something about the wedge design that makes it not want to let the tungsten get pulled out from it (to increase stickout), however it's very easy to push the tungsten back in a little bit more (to reduce the stickout).I just got this backcap called the "tungsten ejector" I am trying out, which makes it really easy and quick to make tungsten stickout adjustments.  Its only got about a 1" range of travel in the adjusting mechanism, but if your tungsten is in that happy range of its adjustment, it works really, really well.Last edited by jakeru; 02-18-2011 at 01:20 AM.
Reply:I would go with the regular gas lens.The extra large one could make it hard to get into a tight spot, or you mightnot be able to see around it.AWS certified welding inspectorAWS certified welder
Reply:Thanks to you all. Sounds like the regular gas lenses are the way to go for a first time user and all round general utility. (and price too)Tim
Reply:Hi I just discoverd this Gas Saver and this old thread.Will this device really save me argon gas? I am already using about 15cfm right now.it seems hard to believe it would save me much, but at $25 a tank full of argon and the gas saver lens only costing around $30 the savings can add up since we go through around a 300 tank every week. http://www.arc-zone.com/azc-scip/for...8-26-CS410.jpg
Reply:accidental duplicate post
Reply:Since you do short welds , per your post , most of your gas lost is in the post weld gas flow. Some machines can have post flow times that are adjustable, so check your manual.
Reply:Yes I agree a regular gas lens is great for most Welding  applications. the large gas lens is great for reactive materials or outside corner joints on stainless steels. You should try CK  wedge collets.