Chop Saws

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'aighty boys... either tonight or tomorrow, i'm going to be getting a chop saw. i figured one or two of you guys had one, so i'm asking for your opinion. i plan on spending about $200 ('ish), so a good band-saw or dry-cut saw are out of the question for now. so my question for you guys is which brand to get? i don;t want to hear anything about color or brand preference. i want to hear what is the most powerful chop saw i can get right now, within my budget. i understand that i will want a few extra abrasive disks (i plan on getting 5 extras). the vast majority of material that i plan on cutting is 1x1x16 ga square tube for now, but i would like to have a little larger capacity if i can get it. the #1 thing that i am looking for is repeatable, consistent 45 degree cuts. i know a chop saw isn't going to give me the best cuts, but i already plan on doing plenty of grinding anyway, so a little bit of abrasive marking isn't too big of a concern.Thanks!Later,Andy
Reply:PS, i'd rather be able to go pick it up too, rather than getting it shipped. around me, i've got a menard's, home-depot, lowes, HF (never been there... don;t know what they have in-store), and a TSC. i probably have a few other stores that carry chop saws around me, but i can't think of any more right now. if i can't find a good one around here, i'm probably going to go to Northern Tool Co.Later,Andy
Reply:I have 2 so I'll give you the good and bad points of both.First statement, I'll assume you know this but I just last week answered someones post on another forum who aparently learned this the hard way. DO NOT USE A WOOD MITER SAW FOR STEEL. yes they adjust real easy but you will kill your saw. Ok thats out of the way.I have a milwaulkee 14" abrasive cut off machine and a Dewalt DW871 abrasive chopsaw. Both are rated at 15amps. I don't see the rpm listed on the motor but I'll assume they are close. The milwaulkee has a straight handle the Dewalt has a D type handle. I prefer the Dewalts handle myself. The angle adjustment for the fence is different on both. The dewalt has a lever you can lift that unlocks the fence to quickly angle the fence. I find it nice when I have to make a lot of diferent angled cuts but it seems too easy for long term exact repeatable cuts. The Milwaulkee's fence uses 2 bolts to lock it. It's a bigger pain to adjust and to get it acurately locked but once its there, it stays put nomatter what. This saw I leave locked at 45* almost all the time. I use the dewalt for most fast cuts and I dont care if its out of square by a tiny bit most of the time. The locking clamp handles are different on both also. I prefer the one on the Milwaulkee vs the one on the Dewalt but its a minor difference. I get a better grip on the Milwaulkee's as its a crank vs a straight bar on the dewalt.I have had no major problems on either saw. The bolts holding the milwalkee to the base loostened a bit and the guard would jam, but once I figured out why it has been fine since. I don't see this as a problem more of just a fact of using it alot.I would love to get a cold saw but with all the other cutting gear around the shop I can't justify the cost unless I find a steel on a used one.Hope this helps.
Reply:thanks DSW. DeWalt and Milwaukee were the main two that i was looking at too. i was kind of leaning towards the DeWalt because of the generally good support that i have always had with them, but i have never had a Milwaukee product in my life. over all, they are very competitively priced too. i really like the d-handle configuration, since i'm used to it on the miter-saw that i am used to running (no, i don;t plan on using it for metal). the only thing that i don;t really like about that is that the handle is on the left, rather than the right side of the blade.Thanks again!Later,Andy
Reply:Just make sure you don't get the one that is made in va-China.  Personally, I would get the Milli-WA-keeeeeeeee.John -  fabricator extraordinaire, car nut!-  bleeding Miller blue! http://www.weldfabzone.com
Reply:I'm sorta newbie to steel work and don't have a lot of experience with the large number of brands out there, but I am no foreigner to power tools.When I started outfitting my garage as a metal shop this past winter, I looked at a lot of chop saws.  I compared features, power ratings (AMPS), ease of use, weight, price.  I settled on the DeWalt Model# D28715 and bought it from Lowe's.  This was perhaps one of the more expensive saws, but it had the features I liked best.  Milwaukee has a great reputation for durablility, but was out of my price range.  The Ryobie and a couple of other labels just didn't seem to be rugged enough.   The RIGID has a longer fence and a nice miter adjustment and a cast iron table which would probably stay flat, (all the others the table is made from formed sheet steel) but I felt the screw crank handle was weak and the table too narrow.    I settled on the DeWalt because it has the widest table, the ergonomic D-handle, and was the only offering with the tool-less quick-change blade arbor.  Another seemingly insignificant feature I liked was sliding the lock to hold the saw in the "down" position.  (All the other's I looked at use a short length of chain which seems clumsy.) This helps aligning the blade to a square or bevel gauge.  I use a short mini-bungie to hold the front guard in the raised position while aligning.The first project was to make a stand (see "Newbie Projects" I posted a few weeks ago.)  I keep a speed square slid under the front of the saw on the stand for setting square and 45 miters.  I am happy with the DeWalt and expect it will serve me well for years to come.Power tool companies, and especially the outlets that sell their products, seem to be a fickle lot.   The models offered and the prices asked change frequently. The Lowe's web site doesn't list any DeWalt chop saws this morning though they may have them in the stores.   HD this morning shows a "completely tool-less" (blade change, miter setting) offering from Milwaukee for $211, which wasn't available only two months ago, but HD also say's it is "out of stock".  Two weeks ago Lowe's had 15% off all power tools.  This week HD is offering a sliding discount, depending on how much you spend in one shot.My recommendation is to look at the displayed models in as many stores as you can afford the time and travel cost to visit.  Then choose the one that suits your needs best and buy that from whoever offers the best price.-MondoMember, AWSLincoln ProMIG 140Lincoln AC TombstoneCraftsman Lathe 12 x 24 c1935Atlas MFC Horizontal MillCraftsman Commercial Lathe 12 x 36 c1970- - - I'll just keep on keepin' on.
Reply:Originally Posted by MondoMy recommendation is to look at the displayed models in as many stores as you can afford the time and travel cost to visit.  Then choose the one that suits your needs best and buy that from whoever offers the best price.-Mondo
Reply:Andy,I bought the Dewalt about a month ago from Lowes and really like it because of all the reasons mentioned - Handle, adjustable fence and speed clamp. Money was no object when I picked it out, it was just the one I liked the most that they had at Lowes. I  don't know if my wife suggested a cheaper model but if she did, I am sure I told her it was the wrong kind  I had to promise her I would put down a hard wood floor in the bedroom, but I didn't mind agreeing to it.  I would have had to do it anyway .
Reply:well guys... i think if i go with a chop saw, the dewalt is the way to go. now, what about the jet horizontal bandsaw? HD has it for only about $100 more than a chop saw, so what should i do? i figure that by the time i spend the money to build a nice, stable stand for the chop saw, the extra abrasive disks, and the other little "necessities" for it, i will spend right around $300 anyway. remember, the #1 concern i have is to make accurate, consistant 45 degree cuts with the saw of choice, along with the obvious budget. time is not really an issue. i would plan on getting an extra carbide-tipped bandsaw blade also, for if and when i break the one that came with the saw.Thanks again for all of the help!Later,Andy
Reply:I use my band saw more than my chop saw. The JET is nice and no adjustments or fiddling with it like the HF cheapy and knock-offs.John -  fabricator extraordinaire, car nut!-  bleeding Miller blue! http://www.weldfabzone.com
Reply:I have a cheapy HF red band saw. As long as you do the tweaks as others have it really is a decent lil saw. I have not touched my chop saw since I picked it up. But the Jet offers a good saw with no tweaking.
Reply:thanks bob... i thought about getting an HF bandsaw, but i don;t really wanna have to worry about the little tweaks... by the time i get a good blade and stand for one, i'd be looking at the cost of a jet anyway... i'm going to check out the dewalt chopsaw and the jet bandsaw tonight on my way home... i may even get it before i leave the store... i know they have a demo version of each set-up at my local HD... i just gotta play with them a little and see which one feels better. thanks again guys for all your input.Later,Andy
Reply:Get the 14" daimeter saw rather than the 12 inch diameter chop saw for metal because you can cut larger pieces of metal.ALWAYS clamp down the metal !! Don't find out the hard way.I was in a shop where we used a abrasive chop saw for stainless tubing and it was a Makita 12 inch and we used it to cut every day ,day in and day out for 6 years and it need new brushes. It cut thousands of feet of tubing.Do not breathe the dust. The dust contains fiberglass and epoxy.The abrasive chop saw is the CHEAPEST way to cut metal - although it is noisy.
Reply:Chop saw - fast, loud, sprays dust and grit and sparks all over (I lit the lawn on fire with the chop saw), chops through just about anything (metal, plastic, rebar, hardened steel, etc), new disk costs $5-$15 or so, may or may not be accurate enough for your needsBand saw - costs more, blades cost more (especially good blades), blades can get buggered in a heartbeat if you put a piece of hardened or stainless in there, should match the TPI of the blade to the thickness of the workpiece, is bigger than a chop saw (but if you are cutting long lengths they will be the biggest dimension no matter what), is usually quieter than a chop saw, is usually slower than a chop saw, usually keeps the mess more contained than the dust/grit from a chop saw although a pile of oily swarf isn't all that fun to deal with either, can be more accurate than a chop saw (or not)I have 14 inch 15amp Hitachi chop saw.  Lowes had it.  The Dewalt they had at the time was tempting, but IIRC after fiddling with the adjustments for a little bit in the store I liked the Hitachi better than the Dewalt.  And it was $50-$80? bucks cheaper as well.  So far, it has cut through anything I put in it.  Did I mention that I lit the lawn on fire from the sparks when I was using it one time?Hmmm, accurate 45 degree miter cuts?  I'd probably say a bandsaw with a good blade instead of a chop saw.  But "an extra carbide tipped blade"?  That's going to run you $100+ per blade.  A decent bandsaw plus one of those blades is going to easily be about 2x your target budget of $200.Stand?  Take scrap/reclaimed bed frame ($0), cut with new chop saw, weld together with welder, post pics in the project section.  Or find the on-sale H-F $20 tool stand (might be a little low for chop saw use or not).
Reply:I have a good medium sized horizonal band saw that I use for cutting larger stock like channel. I forget the exact size but it will cut 11" pipe if needed. 12" pipe, you need to reset the stock as it hits the upper arm. It's a pain for me to dig out of where I store it so I don't use it as much as I otherwise would. Skip the carbide blades unless you really need to cut some nasty stuff. I generally use Sarret M-42 blades to cut 2" SS round bar with the band saw, so thats the blade that I keep in it. I get them from MSC. I think the last one cost me $75 or so, but its been quite a while since I needed to buy one. Thats about 1/2 of a carbide blade. They seem to last quite a while if you take reasonable care of them.Do yourself a favor if you get a band saw. While you still know the size of the blade write it on the saw with a sharpie marker. Then 1-2 years from now when you need a new blade you are'nt trying to guess which size to buy. There are a lot of sizes that are close but don't work.
Reply:Band saw very quiet. Does not wake babies.Chop saw VERY LOUD!!!!!   May or may not wake babies.
Reply:Had a 12" Ryobi for over 25 years, now have a 14'" Metabo, also a 14 " Power Hacksaw(Homemade) for heavier sections.
Reply:I have a Milwaukee on the truck and a Makita in the garage.  They both work equally well and cost about the same new.  Pick your favorite color, red, yellow or blue, and happy cutting .MM350P/Python/Q300MM175/Q300DialarcHFHTP MIG200PowCon300SMHypertherm380ThermalArc185Purox oaF350CrewCab4x4LoadNGo utilitybedBobcat250XMT304/Optima/SpoolmaticSuitcase12RC/Q300Suitcase8RC/Q400Passport/Q300Smith op
Reply:Update:well boys and girls, as i sit here typing to y'all, i am at my parent's house, eating wonderful sausages, and waiting to get done with my other required work, so i can go home and set up my new toy. after the long, tiresome aggrivation that was brought to me by countless online and local retailers either not having a saw in stock and requiring a hefty "special order" payment, or ungodly high shipping rates, not to mention the time off of work that i would be required to take in order to be at home when the thing arrived, i decided to take one last look around my locale. i happened to find a miraculous red, white and black sign that stated: "Tractor Supply Company". to be 100% honest with all of you, i have never set foot inside one of these stores until now, and i am sure i will return. they are the only supplier in town, except for the "usual" LWS and HF that have any decent metal tools at all. well, long story short, i walked out of there with a 2 year extended warranty, a new Clarke 4.5" horizontal bandsaw, and only $250 less than i started with. not too bad if i do say so myself.now... back to eating and vinyls, so i can get home and set it up. Later,Andy
Reply:Good for you. I do a decent amount of business at TSC. Sort of the modern equivilant of the old farm store/ local hardware store. Prices are not too bad and the quality is better than average on most things.
Reply:If that saw doesnt  work out you can always go this route.http://www.vintageprojects.com/machi...saw-plans.htmlMiller Syncrowave 200Hobart Handler 140Thermal Dynamics Cutmaster 38E-Z Tube BenderPlasma Cam DHC2
Reply:thanks for that link Q... it looks like a nifty little project. if i ever get a chance, i think i may make something like that.well guys, i'm off to get-r-setup.Later,Andy
Reply:Great!  Happy cutting!MM350P/Python/Q300MM175/Q300DialarcHFHTP MIG200PowCon300SMHypertherm380ThermalArc185Purox oaF350CrewCab4x4LoadNGo utilitybedBobcat250XMT304/Optima/SpoolmaticSuitcase12RC/Q300Suitcase8RC/Q400Passport/Q300Smith op
Reply:i would sell you my milwalkee real cheap if you wanted to pick it up in in arizona.i bought a steelmax cold cut 2 years ago and haven't used the milwalkee since