Basic skills my students should have...

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This is an offbeat question, but a lot of my autobody students grow up living in apartments and often living with their mothers.  I am the only one teaching them basic hand skills.  I am looking for ideas for my intro classes on things that will help them understand tools and how to "fix things".  Here are SOME of the things I teach.One of the first things I do is buy a bunch of 2x4s and a 50# box of nails and have them nail 2x4s together.  It teaches hammer usage and accuracy.  You would be surprised how many kids have never used a hammer and nail.I also teach them how to correctly solder wires together and to use shrink tube.I teach everyone to run a bead with the mig welder in the flat position.We learn to light and adjust a cutting torch and cut some pieces off of a piece of metal.  (remember this is autobody and not welding class)I teach basic fractions with multiple folds with a piece of notebook paper.  Reading a tape measure is next.Tool identification and proper names for the tools.Reverse thread markings on fasteners.I am hoping to get more ideas on quick lessons that will help my students become better entry level employees.Do you have any ideas for basic knowledge and skills, or simple projects?  I would particularly like some ideas for simple projects on the box and pan brake.  I have a lot of good sheetmetal tools.  I like things that they can take home and show off.My goal is to have them get "the big picture" and start filling in areas where they have a real interest.  They often don't know enough to have a clue about what they are really interested in.Last edited by Crabo; 08-03-2013 at 01:16 PM.
Reply:How about teaching them a bit about fasteners (screws, nuts, bolts).  I helped our High School robotics team build stuff for 5 years.  One kid would twist the crap out of any fastener as if it were a 5/16" bolt.  I nicknamed him "Tom the Torquer". He would wail down on the 10-32 cap screws we were using to join Aluminum tubing until it crushed.  Get a couple torque screwdrivers/wrenches and make it a game.  See if they can learn to get things about the right snugness with a wrench vs. a torque wrench.  Then there's thread pitches, metric-English, etc. Another thing is how to drill.  Properly sharp bit, center punch, adequate pressure and feed, breakthrough on thin metals, can't slightly enlarge a hole, fasten the workpiece so it can't spin, coolant, etc.Care and feeding of tools - screwdrivers aren't pry bars, nor are pin punches or hex keys.  Tools with a cutting edge shouldn't be thrown into a box with other tools where they get dull. How to file (without ruining a file) and how to sand.  How use and not use a bench or portable grinder (scary stuff). And very importantly, how to avoid having hair and clothing get caught in rotating machinery."USMCPOP" First-born son: KIA  Iraq 1/26/05Syncrowave 250 w/ Coolmate 3Dialarc 250, Idealarc 250SP-175 +Firepower TIG 160S (gave the TA 161 STL to the son)Lincwelder AC180C (1952)Victor & Smith O/A torchesMiller spot welder
Reply:This is exactly what I am looking for.  I have another teacher helping me, and he will be in another classroom.  I want to develop some lessons that he can also follow so we give our new students the same groundwork.Anyone know of a good forum like this sheetmetal ideas?  I have some of them using the box and pan break, shrinker stretcher, foot shear, and beverly shear already.
Reply:Hmm let me think about it a little more CRABO. But the shame of it all is the world we live in today. My dad worked nights with week days off, and I started working, building and repairing my stuff from just older than a toddler. They were butcher jobs of course but learned through attrition. When in high school I took woodshop 1thru4, metalshop 1thru4, jewleryshop 1thru4, mechanical drafting 1thru4. I was horrible in school but great in shops, and my guidance counselors would let me take those classes over and over just to build up credits to graduate on time. I would cut out of classes and go to metalshop LOL. But due to liabilities and overcrowded schools these classes don't exist anymore, what a shame. I'll try and think a little more for you today, got a free quiet day to myself for a change.I hate being bi-polar it's awsomeMy Heroes Have Always Been Cowboys
Reply:I have a lot of students that the only reason they stay in school is so they can be in my program.  It becomes a family for some of them.  And yes, I have a lot of students who spend a lot of time with me.
Reply:I can help you with sheet metal projects, from simple to complicated.  Shoot me a message with your email and I can send you some AutoCAD drawings of projects I use with JH and HS students.
Reply:My younger one did great in HS wood shop and in community college welding and machining classes.  He was always an A-student in those classes.  He was on a first-name basis with those teachers.(Funny how all three had the same first name - "Mister". "USMCPOP" First-born son: KIA  Iraq 1/26/05Syncrowave 250 w/ Coolmate 3Dialarc 250, Idealarc 250SP-175 +Firepower TIG 160S (gave the TA 161 STL to the son)Lincwelder AC180C (1952)Victor & Smith O/A torchesMiller spot welder
Reply:When I was a freshman in h/s  in the metal fab program we made tool boxes in the sheet metal portion.It was just bending ,cutting,and riveting no welding involved. That was back in 1983..I still have that box.Miller Syncrowave 180Miller 211 w/ spool-gunLincoln Ac/Dc buzzboxCutmaster 38 plasmaVictor,Smith's,and Craftsman (Harris) O/A torches.DeWalt Multi cutterFiber Metal helmets(old school)Enough Snap-On to be a dealer
Reply:Teach them how to read a tape measure!  I can't stand to hear it is, "I think it is 18 inches and 3 or maybe 4 of those little marks."
Reply:Too bad school is geared to sending EVERY student to a 4 year college. Budgets have been slashed for all shop classes. Kids that excel in shop classes but don't do that well with the 3 Rs are looked at as being lazy.Millermatic 200Hobart Handler 120Victor O/A & Ramco BandsawLincoln 225 ACSnapOn AD HoodMiller XMT304/22AHypertherm Powermax 1650 G3Lincoln Idealarc DC600 w/Extreme 12 VSMiller Digital Elite "Joker"
Reply:When I was younger and in shop, we had to make a model stick frame house.  1 inch equalled 1 foot.  We had to rip and cut all out "lumber" out of 2x4s.  It made us do math, measure, cut, and glue.  We use hot glue to stick all the stick frame together.When it came to metal we had to make plant holders and coasters learning to bend with a torch and weld with a stick.  We also learned to braze and solder.  We also had a large wood project.  Most kids built bread boxes, clocks or some kind of dresser top box.  I built a gun rack.  I won the wood working section.We had small engine class so we rebuilt a BS 3 hp and welded a gocart frame and stuck it on the frame.  talk about fun.  I lived for shop class.
Reply:Originally Posted by Scott YoungWhen I was younger and in shop, we had to make a model stick frame house.  1 inch equalled 1 foot.  We had to rip and cut all out "lumber" out of 2x4s.  It made us do math, measure, cut, and glue.  We use hot glue to stick all the stick frame together.When it came to metal we had to make plant holders and coasters learning to bend with a torch and weld with a stick.  We also learned to braze and solder.  We also had a large wood project.  Most kids built bread boxes, clocks or some kind of dresser top box.  I built a gun rack.  I won the wood working section.We had small engine class so we rebuilt a BS 3 hp and welded a gocart frame and stuck it on the frame.  talk about fun.  I lived for shop class.
Reply:Proper use of a square & tri-square, level & string line. Chalk box, tie wire & knots in rope and/or string. Also, linear feet. I had a math class in college & we were required to give a speech on what we used math for on any given day. My speech was painting a room & the TEACHER!! didn't know the term "linear foot." I had to explain that paint is sold to cover "square feet" & to buy the correct amount of paint to cover the trim & foot boards "linear feet" came into play. 3" W trim meant 4' of trim equaled a square foot. 4" W trim meant 3' of trim equaled a sq. ft., etc. The teacher retired from teaching math in the Air Force to teach at college & had never heard the term??Only when the last tree has died and the last river has been poisoned and the last fish has been caught will we realize we cannot eat money.                                         -Cree Indian ProverbSA 200 LincolnVictor Torches
Reply:Originally Posted by Scott Young... and 3 or maybe 4 of those little marks....
Reply:Originally Posted by OldendumIn precision machining, 3 or 4 of those "little marks" make a big difference.  Blonde, brunette, redhead, big difference.
Reply:Originally Posted by ChrisA7164When I was a freshman in h/s  in the metal fab program we made tool boxes in the sheet metal portion.It was just bending ,cutting,and riveting no welding involved. That was back in 1983..I still have that box.
Reply:Down here there is a program called "my brothers workshop" they take troubled young men and try to teach them basic skills.I volunteered to help put a roof on their space a few weekends ago...one thing I noticed,   showing up late,ear buds and texting.I told the main guy that the skills will come but they will never last long enough to get those with all the other bad habits
Reply:Thank you, Crabo, for being the stand-in Dad to these kids.
Reply:If you have room, teach them to change the oil, tire, sparkplugs & how the internal combustion engine works.  Then once done with that, start teaching them basic hydraulics using a 1.5 ton jack.  Let them tear it apart to see how it works, then put it back together.If possible, have an old engine they can pull apart & put back together.  Small engine all the way to a big block chevy.  I'm betting the scrap yard will have one or two they will donate.MarkI haven't always been a nurse........Craftsman 12"x36" LatheEnco G-30B MillHobart Handler 175Lincoln WeldandPower 225 AC/DC G-7 CV/CCAdd a Foot Pedal to a Harbor Freight Chicago Electric 165A DC TIG PapaLion's Gate Build
Reply:wow, I would have stayed more in school than in the pub next to it if I had such  good teachersI can't think of any tips but I would start with use and importance of PPE and other safety stuff, scare them a little bitoh.. drill bit sharpening and proper bench grinder use/dress , I hate it when other ppl leave grooves in the stone--------------------------------------------------------------www.becmotors.nlyup, I quit welding.. joined welder anonymous
Reply:My first thought was knowing how to get stuff square. both with corner cross measuring and the 3,4,5 method. Maybe have them do a tool tray but they have to do it off of a template they drew out on paper without using a square edge. The cut metal must match the template exactly and then they get to fold it in the press and rivet or weld it closed. making sure all the sides are square both on the face, and on the vertical plain when compaired to the bottom of the tray.This combines some of your teachings. using a tape measure, using the sheet metal brake, using the shear, welding/riveting, and will also teach plan layout and accuracy.other than that, to keep in line with the class as a whole, torch bending/weld bending, sanding techniques (proper way to do it by hand, and the proper way to uses the three main types of sanders; belt, orbital, vibrating).Last edited by ThorsHammer; 08-05-2013 at 04:33 PM.There are no problems. There are only solutions. It's your duty to determine the right one.Hobart Handler 210Airco 225 Amp MSM Stinger
Reply:Since you are already teaching electrical soldering, why not teach them how to troubleshoot a simple electrical cicuit with a VOM? Then they could repair the "broken" wire.Harbor Freight VOMs are almost free.
Reply:I think that safety is a must.  I taught at a vocational school for a year back in 1972.   In 1970 in one of my college shop class my assigned workmate was drilling a hole in a piece of metal with a drill presss.   I was beside him sawing off the barrell of a Spanish Mauser 7mm.  Making  the rifle barrell 10 inches shorter and he and I were going to crown the barrell and add new sights for our project.   The piece of metal he was drilling was going to be used on the rifle.  He leaned over to look at the small hole he was drilling and his 16 in long hair got sucked into the drill bit by one tiny stran( I think we were want to be hippies back then. He screamed and by the time I leaped over him and hit the kill switch  He had a 5 inch bald spot on top of his head, He had been scalped and his head was wedged againt the drill bit. His remaining hair being twisted into a rope had started to  forced his head into the bit and the bit was drilling a hole in his skull. There was big wad of hair , skin , blood and bone that was on me and all over him. We had to cut him out of the drill press( variable speed rockwell by the way.)   He missed a full quarter of college and was in terrible pain for months with monsterious head aches.   We all had very long hair back then. I  immediate got a hair cut back to my crew cut syle .    If I hadnt been a wittness I would not have believed it.    Our shop teacher was looking at him when it happened but he was 30 feet away. It happened so quick that I think I was the only one close enough to help him.  Long hair , loose clothing, watches, rings , loose belts  etc.   can cost a student his life.   By the way .  We built a tool box out of sheet metal.  A metal funnel (that was a pain) a chipping hammer with the handle threaded into the head and our student number stamped into a special flat spot we had to grind into the inside of the formed handle., coat hanger/cap holder  out of a piece of flat bar and 4 old railroad spikes.   I still have my chipping hammer after 43 years. Hope my story helps keep someone from getting hurt. richey
Reply:Originally Posted by Hemi-TNot having shop classes in school is gonna cost a lot of people a lot of extra money over their lifetime.  If I couldn't do all this stuff myself, I probably couldn't afford to own a house.
Reply:Steve, I will probably get banned from here, but years ago i was really into bow hunting and i used some two bladed made by Zwickey.  I use a bastard single cut file to sharpen them.  I have some videos I can post a link to if anyone is interested.  One day, I was in the field and my knife was dull as could be and I had left my stone at the shop.  I took out my file and prayed I wouldn't butcher the blade and wouldn't you know it, I had forever changed my sharpening.  My kitchen knives all stay scary sharp and I can sharpen a whole drawer in no time.  My grandmother had a drawer of the worst knives in the state and after I left she said I would be the only one to sharpen her knives.  My axes and machete are sharper than most people's kitchen knifes.  My machete will scare the life out of you it is so sharp, and it stays that way.I use an 8 inch single cut for most knives, but when I want to really put a shaving edge on it, I will finish it off with a 6 or 4 inch.  I typically don't want to shave hair with my knife.  I want it to cut so I want a courser edge to it so it will cut.  I have had standing disagreements with men at the lunch table over what is a useful sharpness for a pocket knife.  I use my knife to cut rope, wood, plastic, gasket, scrape, wire, thread, clothe, skin, and everything in-between. I rarely find I need to shave.  I see guys sharpening a knife to razor quality and it is of no real use as it struggles to doing the above.  I prove it by asking them to cut one of the frayed ropes or trim one of the fire hose pads we have laying around.  My knife cuts typically in half the time and effort than theirs, but theirs will shave their arms nicely...my knife not so much.  I tend to like the hair on my arms and do need to shave it off to test how sharp my knife is.  I know by feeling it with my thumb and finger nail.  I also know that when guys come to me to sharpen their knives cause they saw my little demonstration which I let them do so they feel the difference in cutting ability, they all nearly faint when I pull out a bastard file and open their knife.It's not really autobody related, but...Teach your students how to use a length of clear plastic tube filled with water to check level over long distances.  Show them how important it is to get all the air bubbles out of the tube.  Show them how to check the curve on the surface of the water, and read the bottom of the curve.It's cheaper than a laser level, and used carefully, more accurate over long distances...While you're at it, teach them to take care of precision tools like levels and micrometers.Benson's Mobile Welding - Dayton, OH metro area - AWS Certified Welding Inspector
Reply:I commend you for your efforts. I also agree with Oldendum and 84jsd. Those would be great things to start with. Any basic electrical issues would be good also, even something like changing a bad fuse to a basic home circuit. The more they know then the less magic things appear to be. Basic tool usage is a must both hand and power tools. When I was a Boy Scout leader I was amazed at what kids did not know what to do. Something as simple as digging a hole they just stared at you with a confused look on their face when you handed them a shovel. It's not their fault I have come to realize. Too many times parents (if they are around) shirk their responsibilities because its just easier to do it themselves. The outcome is kids that don't know how to do basic things. My kids, are not afraid to tackle anything. They know that they have enough experience to figure it out. My daughter does her own brakes. Yeah I'm proud of them.A man needs to know his limitations!
Reply:When teaching them soldering, do tell them to assume a soldering is hot, even if it's unplugged.  I saw a kid grab one by the business end to move it.  It had just been used and unplugged a minute earlier.Sadly, our high school shop has been converted to a weight training and exercise machine room.Last edited by Oldendum; 08-06-2013 at 11:58 AM."USMCPOP" First-born son: KIA  Iraq 1/26/05Syncrowave 250 w/ Coolmate 3Dialarc 250, Idealarc 250SP-175 +Firepower TIG 160S (gave the TA 161 STL to the son)Lincwelder AC180C (1952)Victor & Smith O/A torchesMiller spot welder
Reply:Teach them how to use a drill and how to sharpen drills. Most of what got me started was my 8th grade metal shop teacher Mr. Ford. He still teaches using the same curriculum. During the semester we had to make a Tonka style truck. Welded frame, soldered sheet metal body riveted to the frame. Peen axles to hold on the cast and turned aluminum wheels. Basically the project was designed to put us on EVERY machine and tool in the shop! I learned a little of everything in his class and will be forever thankful for the skills taught.Did a quick google search and found his course material online. I was in his class in the mid 80's.Here's his course outline:http://connect.issaquah.wednet.edu/m...8/default.aspxHere's a link to all the skill pdf files:http://connect.issaquah.wednet.edu/m...s/default.aspx
Reply:Here are the additional things I would recommend:1) how to calculate cubic dimensions and convert them (so they can do basic things like figure out how many cubic feet are in the concrete form and convert that to how many yards or bags of concrete are required).2) how to measure to ensure something is square (like measuring corner to corner for a square frame).3) basic filing skills (yeah, every shop I've ever worked in had filing cabinets and usually only two people knew how to use them ).4) how to write up detailed statements of work (SOWs), purchase orders (POs), internal orders (IOs), etc...  The ability to do paperwork correctly is one of those things that differentiate the guy who will always be block sanding a vehicle from the guy who gets promoted.5) ratios (I'm always surprised by how many people don't know how to mix paint to hardener or other binary materials)6) basic first aid...nothing like watching someone walk up to you while they're bleeding like a stuck pig and just staring at the wound like it'll close itself up.7) how to have a conversation without swearing and other general etiquette (customer service is key in almost any business)8) teach them to always move quickly and with a purpose...it's annoying to be the boss and be working hard, ask an employee to get a tool and watch him saunter over to the tool box like he has all the time in the world.  If I wanted to work myself to death so that someone working for me could take a leisurely stroll, I'd vote for more taxes.9) teach them to close drawers, cabinets, toolboxes, put tools away, sweep up, etc...  Clutter is dangerous and slows down work.  Leaving cabinets or drawers open results in tons of stupid injuries.Those are just the things on the top of my mind today.--Wintermute"No man's knowledge here can go beyond his experience." - John Lockewww.improvised-engineering.comManufacturer Agnostic:Blood----------Sweat---------Tears----|------------------|----------------|----Lincoln Red, Miller Blue, Esab Yellow
Reply:I appreciate everyone's suggestions.  I am going to copy and paste them all into one document so it will be easier to pick and choose.
Reply:What I see lacking in the new generation is any sense of a work ethic. Absolutely shameful.