Box and Pan Brake questions

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Once I get a little more cash saved up, I'm going to be purchasing a box and pan brake, for various bending of aluminum boat parts I fabricate.  I need a minimum of 4 ft, however 5ft would be better, and anything bigger wouldn't hurt, provided I found the right price.  The big thing is to be able to bend a full 4 ft.  The main materials being bent would be .125 aluminum sheet, and .125 aluminum diamond plate, mostly 5052 alloy.  It would also see a reasonable amount of .080 and .090, in both 5052 and 6061 (which I will probably start to phase out, in favor of the 5052 fairly soon).  Being a lot of what I would be bending would be hatch lids, needing a lip on all four sides, a box and pan brake is necessary.  Here is my question.  In looking at used brakes, most all give the capacity in the gauge of steel.  How would that translate to aluminum as far as max capacity?  I found this link, from a search of the site, and it shows the 12 gauge brake as being capable of bending 8 gauge aluminum (something around .1285 if I am not mistaken).  http://www.toolsplus1.com/bpsmb.htmCould that be considered a fair rating for all 12 gauge brakes, or will some other factor come into play?  Also, how will the diamonds on the tread plate affect the bend thickness ratings?  Thanks,bassboy1Last edited by bassboy1; 02-18-2010 at 07:37 PM.Reason: Forgot linkWho is John Galt?
Reply:Well, I guess it is good to know that I am not asking stupid questions, but instead questions that nobody knows the answer too.Who is John Galt?
Reply:no answer here..  just another question.   on a  4' x 18 ga. brake  could you bend 1'x 10ga metal.Daye
Reply:Here's some generic info on press brakes and the tons/ft needed to bend differeing thicknesses. The table is for steel, but if you click on the link near the top it will tell you how to calculate the modifier for use with stainless steel and alum. It may give you some idea if this may or may not work. The big thing will still be how well the brake is made, and if it can withstand the concentrated load pressure in one small area.http://www.americanmachinetools.com/pressure_table.htmI know I saw and posted a table somewhere that listed alum, but I can't find my link any more..No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:You need a minimum of a 12 gage brake to bend 4 foot wide .125 aluminum.I have one, and it works.what you should buy is a Chicago D&K 12 gage box and pan. They were made in both 4' and 5' widths.They will do what you want, all day, every day, without complaint.I have a 4' model, it weighs about 2000lbs, is made in america, and is a very high quality tool. They are available new, but very expensive.http://www.americanmachinetools.com/hand_brake.htmBut lots of used ones are out there. Still not cheap, but worth it.http://www.machinetools.com/us/machines/type/1314http://www.usedequip.com/ss/4610/0B6968.htmlGrizzly and others sell chinese knockoffs. Not as good as a D&K, but still a usable tool, and amazingly cheap for what they are.http://grizzly.com/products/48-Pan-B...e-12-Ga-/G0542
Reply:Originally Posted by RiesYou need a minimum of a 12 gage brake to bend 4 foot wide .125 aluminum.I have one, and it works.what you should buy is a Chicago D&K 12 gage box and pan. They were made in both 4' and 5' widths.They will do what you want, all day, every day, without complaint.I have a 4' model, it weighs about 2000lbs, is made in america, and is a very high quality tool. They are available new, but very expensive.http://www.americanmachinetools.com/hand_brake.htmBut lots of used ones are out there. Still not cheap, but worth it.http://www.machinetools.com/us/machines/type/1314http://www.usedequip.com/ss/4610/0B6968.htmlGrizzly and others sell chinese knockoffs. Not as good as a D&K, but still a usable tool, and amazingly cheap for what they are.http://grizzly.com/products/48-Pan-B...e-12-Ga-/G0542
Reply:I have done tread plate.It works pretty well.With a good brake, like the Chicago, you can adjust the bending leaf in and out. (you can also adjust the clamping upper leaf to various thicknesses) With thicker material, you can space it out a bit, giving you a very slight radiused bend- you cant crank it out enough to do serious radius, but you can get it a bit larger. This helps with tread plate- if you try to bend most tread plate too sharply, it will crack on the inside of the bend.6061 t-6 is hardened, and more likely to crack. Not sure what alloy the tread plate I bent was. But all aluminum likes a more radiused bend than steel does.Usually, in industry, they will use a hydraulic press brake to bend tread plate, and air bend it, giving it a radius more like 1/2" to 1". Much less likely to crack this way.I have built radius nose bars for my brake sometimes- this is like replacing the sharp end of the finger with a round bar, which makes for a curved, rather than sharp angled bend. If you were doing production bending of tread plate, this might be a good thing to do.For small run stuff, its usually fine if you just dont try for too sharp of a corner.
Reply:Originally Posted by tigmuskyno answer here..  just another question.   on a  4' x 18 ga. brake  could you bend 1'x 10ga metal.Daye
Reply:trying to bend 1/8" steel on an 18gage brake will ruin the brake pretty quick.You will "spring" the brake- leaving the top and bottom leaves no longer parallel, but open more in the middle like a big grin.Then it wont bend even 18 gage straight, because it wont be able to clamp it tight enough in the middle.the rule of thumb for bending is that the degree of force needed goes up with the SQUARE of the increase in thickness.So if the thickness goes up 2 times, from 16 gage to 1/8", the force needed goes up FOUR times. So the brake needs to be 4 times as strong to resist the bending.And 18 gage brakes are pretty wimpy-  a four foot 18 gage import brake might weigh 500 lbs.  And, as I mentioned, a 12 gage brake will weigh 2000lbs. They dont add all that metal just to make it harder to drag around your shop- it is all thicker parts, made to resist bending and breaking when you bend heavy stuff.You might be able to get away bending a few pieces of thicker stuff on a small brake. But it will damage the brake, sooner or later. And it wont do a very good job, most of the time, as it will usually leave the metal bent less in the middle of the bend.