DC vs. AC stick welding

admin

Howdy all, can I get the readers digest version of what are the main differences / benefits / disadvantages between ac and dc stick?Thanks, Flhfxd.
Reply:Welding on AC is kind of  , it has a different sound to it. I'll take DC anytime tho. 7018 on DC just flows better. Attached ImagesDon’t pay any attention to meI’m just a hobbyist!CarlDynasty 300V350-Pro w/pulseSG Spool gun1937 IdealArc-300PowerArc 200ST3 SA-200sVantage 400
Reply:You can run more rods on DC (6010, 7018 without the AC, such as excalibur rods), the arc is smoother, and you can change the penetration qualities by reversing the polarity. When using AC, you may need a few more amps than the same rod on DC. AC is fine for what it is, and lots of people weld lots of stuff successfully with AC only using AC rods (6011, 6013, 7014, 7018AC). But you will have a better overall experience, more control options and more rod options if you have DC. All of the AC only rods can be run on DC quite well.Miller Multimatic 255
Reply:AC is good for large electrodes at high current.  Less susceptible to arc blow.DC is smoother.  Works better than AC in out-of-position and for low current/light work."USMCPOP" First-born son: KIA  Iraq 1/26/05Syncrowave 250 w/ Coolmate 3Dialarc 250, Idealarc 250SP-175 +Firepower TIG 160S (gave the TA 161 STL to the son)Lincwelder AC180C (1952)Victor & Smith O/A torchesMiller spot welder
Reply:Dave J.Beware of false knowledge; it is more dangerous than ignorance. ~George Bernard Shaw~ Syncro 350Invertec v250-sThermal Arc 161 and 300MM210DialarcTried being normal once, didn't take....I think it was a Tuesday.
Reply:Most machines that are AC only are very frustrating to weld with let alone learn to weld with. DC actually makes you want to keep learning and practicing, AC not so much.
Reply:The welders open circuit voltage make a big difference on how it welds.On current machines with low ocv, rod type can make a big difference.Older units with high ocv are easier to use and will burn almost any rod.
Reply:The reason I ask this Q is because my local hardware store has the ac225 on sale at $299 and I figure, wtf?, might as well just buy this and have a go at it?
Reply:My AC machine got used 20 years ago to thaw water, I have a severely beat up DC counterpart I've used instead. It's probably just me, AC is really spattery out of position welding is tough with AC.An optimist is usually wrong, and when the unexpected happens is unprepared. A pessimist is usually right, when wrong, is delighted, and well prepared.
Reply:I weld with both A/C and D/C frequently.. I admit that A/C dose have more spatter than D/C but, if run properly the differance is not much. I don't really have a preference in general, but by application I do prefer one over the other for a few reasons....If I am welding dirty steel and don't have the ability to excessively clean it, That's simple ... A/C 60 series all day!If I am welding clean steel with a good fit up and am being paid for it,  another no brainer.... D/C 80 series for pretty welds!The differance matters most by application in my eyes. Just like choosing rods by application, for instance if I am welding vertical on dirty steel I want a 60 series but if I am welding horizontal on shiney stuff an 80 series rod better suits the job!I think the better question would be... What are your intentions?  If you want a welder that will allow you to learn SMAW or just to mess around with on weekend projects then almost any stick welder with 150 amps or more will work fine.If you plan to use the welder on a regular basis for a wide range of work.. You may want to look into something with D/C for the simple fact it is easier to run in most cases. Having a machine with both A/C and D/C will be the most versitile welder you own, second to an O/A set up....but that's a different thread!That being said....either process can be coaxed into producing quality top notch welds with practice. If you need to see what A/C is capable of doing in the hands of an expert just ask a pipeliner to strike an arc. Or look at an old timers 6011 weave (it's like art to me!). Hope this helps.Real welders know how to penetrate!(Equipment)Whatever can be used to beat my opponent into submission!
Reply:As for the AC225, Lincoln says  "...records indicate that several million units have been sold through welding distributors and retail hardware stores over the past 50 years."  Works for some.  "USMCPOP" First-born son: KIA  Iraq 1/26/05Syncrowave 250 w/ Coolmate 3Dialarc 250, Idealarc 250SP-175 +Firepower TIG 160S (gave the TA 161 STL to the son)Lincwelder AC180C (1952)Victor & Smith O/A torchesMiller spot welder
Reply:Originally Posted by OldendumAs for the AC225, Lincoln says  "...records indicate that several million units have been sold through welding distributors and retail hardware stores over the past 50 years."  Works for some.
Reply:In 1970, they sold new for under $100."USMCPOP" First-born son: KIA  Iraq 1/26/05Syncrowave 250 w/ Coolmate 3Dialarc 250, Idealarc 250SP-175 +Firepower TIG 160S (gave the TA 161 STL to the son)Lincwelder AC180C (1952)Victor & Smith O/A torchesMiller spot welder
Reply:Originally Posted by OldendumIn 1970, they sold new for under $100.
Reply:I never really thought about welding with AC, except for Tig aluminum. Maybe because we never had AC only engine drives on the job site. Here's an open root vertical up hill with 6011 on AC. Attached ImagesDon’t pay any attention to meI’m just a hobbyist!CarlDynasty 300V350-Pro w/pulseSG Spool gun1937 IdealArc-300PowerArc 200ST3 SA-200sVantage 400
Reply:Originally Posted by CEPI never really thought about welding with AC, except for Tig aluminum. Maybe because we never had AC only engine drives on the job site. Here's an open root vertical up hill with 6011 on AC.
Reply:Originally Posted by soutthpawLooks good,  so what's your opinion of it compared to DC.
Reply:Originally Posted by CEPI think it has a neat sound. I never thought about welding with AC, until joining some tractor forums. A lot of those guys go out and buy the cheapest welder they can find to repair their equipment. If it wasn't for Tig welding aluminum, I have no need for AC.
Reply:Vertical down 6013 on AC."USMCPOP" First-born son: KIA  Iraq 1/26/05Syncrowave 250 w/ Coolmate 3Dialarc 250, Idealarc 250SP-175 +Firepower TIG 160S (gave the TA 161 STL to the son)Lincwelder AC180C (1952)Victor & Smith O/A torchesMiller spot welder
Reply:6013 is another one I never though much about running. And I use to work out of the sheet metal union. But we mostly ran Mig. I did a fillet weld break test with 6013, 3-blows with a 4-pound hammer to break!  Attached ImagesDon’t pay any attention to meI’m just a hobbyist!CarlDynasty 300V350-Pro w/pulseSG Spool gun1937 IdealArc-300PowerArc 200ST3 SA-200sVantage 400
Reply:But it sure looks pretty and an infant could chip the slag!
Reply:I have a Lincoln AC/DC buzz box and I don't weld for a living, and the stick gods and I don't get along. I have picked up a lot of help on this site, over the last 5 years. When I got this buzz box someone here told me to stick on DC+ and leave it.......It's still on DC+..... I did try AC one time with (One Rod a 7018 1/8 ) it's never been back on AC.
Reply:Had 100 Hollup 500 amp AC WW 2 building LCM s used up to 3/8 rods AC rules. So did lots of plants it held together tanks and ships!
Reply:AC welding works, DC works better.I offer three choices: Good, Fast, & Cheap. You may pick two.Hobart AC/DC StikMate LXHarbor Freight AD HoodHarbor Freight Industrial Chop SawDeVilbis 20 Gallon, 5 HP Compressor
Reply:I found overhead with AC to be an exercise in futility.  DC+ works well on overhead.  I imagine that AC keeps the puddle moving like a rough sea and slag drips all over the place.  Same rod, same amps on DC+ and the slag stays putGordie -- "I believe you understand what you think I said, but I'm not sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant."Here's an overhead weld I made with 6011 on AC. It was a long time ago, so I don't remember anything about it. Doesn't look like it was all that hard. Attached ImagesDon’t pay any attention to meI’m just a hobbyist!CarlDynasty 300V350-Pro w/pulseSG Spool gun1937 IdealArc-300PowerArc 200ST3 SA-200sVantage 400
Reply:Ya.  I should have been more specific.  Am practicing for the 4GF position CWB plate test at home since I live far out in the country and want to save gas.1/8" 7018-AC @ 135 amps.  AC splashes slag but with DC+ it stays put and the weld looks half-azzed.Started out with my Lincoln AC-225 and in desperation switched to my Canox Sparkler 230AC / 150DC.Really need to use 7018Gordie -- "I believe you understand what you think I said, but I'm not sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant."
Reply:Tranny A/C stick built this country and many ships still afloat today, and many pipelines still flowing that used A/C stick and scratch start tig, but does that mean you have to stick with it, or embrace what you will have to learn to use once you grad school?Why not inverter machines?....Maybe not today, but wouldn't is be sweet tomorrow if you could do stick in A/C and D/C, PLUS in tig be able to control A/C waveform and Hz and balance, and pulse in D/C?Any new light tranny 60 Hz A/C only welder you buy new today will prolly be on craigslist as soon as you decide you want more capability.
Reply:There's a lot of difference in the arc quality when it comes to AC, inverter vs transformer......I was running some 1/8" 7018 on this TA 250gtw (AC/DC inverter Tig/Stick) in AC at about 140 amps, and if it wasn't for the sound, (similar to AC tig) I'd couldn't of telled it apart from DC.The rod lit up nice, flowed out nice, and (This ones for you Dave) didn't get that arcblow at the top of a vertical filet that you sometimes get.Just a couple welders, big hammers, grinders, and torches.Work will free you.Men in dirty jeans built this country, while men in clean suits have destroyed it. Trump/Carson 2016-2024
Reply:1/8" isn't enough amps for arc blow.
Reply:Originally Posted by Welder Dave1/8" isn't enough amps for arc blow.
Reply:Originally Posted by FlhfxdThe reason I ask this Q is because my local hardware store has the ac225 on sale at $299 and I figure, wtf?, might as well just buy this and have a go at it?
Reply:You can find the Lincoln AC/DC 225/125 machines for sale in the US for around $550, so for a few extra bucks I think that would be the better way to go in low cost welders. As others have mentioned there's lots of good old AC machines out there for under $100 if you still want one. I think I picked up my Sears for around $45 at a farm auction and it works fine.  All I've ever used is AC so I can't give you a good comparison, but I can tell you that I totally suck at overhead welding. Those 225/125 machines are more like $700 on this side of the border, and the 125 DC probably isn't big enough for me, but some day I'll own a DC machine.Last edited by whtbaron; 03-28-2015 at 11:31 AM.250 amp Miller DialArc AC/DC StickF-225 amp Forney AC Stick230 amp Sears AC StickLincoln 180C MIGVictor Medalist 350 O/ACut 50 PlasmaLes
Reply:For the difference in cost I would always go with the AC/DC version of the Lincoln. Not really a large difference in cost but a major difference in welding ease.