Common welding test mistakes?

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Hello allI will be taking my first official welding test on Thursday (2 inch 6gr super coupon) and I am wondering what are some common mistakes that people make when testing?  I'm not exclusively talking about welding procedure.  In fact I'm more interested in etiquette or procedure pitfalls that might piss off an inspector or flat out disqualify you.  Thank you AMW
Reply:Visual quality of the weld, undercut, porosity, cold roll(overlap) on a horizontal weld. 2" 6gr test. would that be Schedule 120 pipe am I correct? XXH wall. I took one not too long ago. Common mistakes will be to not clean after every pass. You will have a grinder and are able to grind your root pass down a tad, put in your hot pass then take that grinder and knock down any high spots, then your fill pass make sure if your running stringers or just one weave filler to tie-in your walls. That will bust your test when bent if you have incomplete fusion on your walls. You MUST have proper etiquette when handling your starts and stops. ESPECIALLY!!! on your CAP. when you stop that rod from burning and look at your weld. However it may look....grind where you stopped into a contoured canyon. When you start again start ahead of where you stopped and go back into your canyon. fill it to the level of your last weld and keep on moving forward. DO NOT remove the restriction ring for anything. YOU WILL FAIL. Trust me on that one. I had to re take that sucker. But it was my first time and I did not know any better. It is a very easy test to take if you are prepared. I walked in and did mine within 30-45 mins and went straight to the 6" 6GR Sch.120 beveled on a sch.80 square cut. took quite a bit longer.  1 1/2 hours-2 hours. You have time to set up your coupons, so take your time and do not get rushed. they usually have a jig set up out of angle iron you put the test pieces in butt them up and slap a hacksaw blade in between it, then you tack it up on 4 sides, put it on the 45 degree angle and put the restriction ring on. And now your off to the races. Depending on the testing facility they might give you a couple pointers. Don't psyche yourself out because there is nothing to the test, im sure you have already been practicing for it. Oh and ask how many stringer cap they want!! ive seen a guy bust because he put a weave cap one pass and they called for a 2-3 cap stringer. I usually always run stringers on my caps with a 3/32 on a test. WHY? because you have better manipulation of your weld. and it looks much better. The only thing wrong with me using 3/32 stringer caps during a test might I add is that usually they ask you to use all 1/8 7018 rods for the cap and 1/8 6010 5p+ for root and hot pass . So when you run stringers with the 1/8 low hydrogen just move a little faster up the side walls. rule of thumb is to start from the bottom groove first. run your stringer up the side wall, then come with another pass in the middle of your groove. Then your third pass should be on top of that and the groove completely filled. Its harder to explain over typing. GOOD LUCK!!!Last edited by AndrewDavenport89; 04-06-2015 at 01:57 PM.
Reply:Ask your inspector up front what he wants to see.  Some may say fit, some may say tack, some may say root, some may say call me when you're done...
Reply:Originally Posted by SupeAsk your inspector up front what he wants to see.  Some may say fit, some may say tack, some may say root, some may say call me when you're done...
Reply:Wow, Stop Do Not Use a Grinder unless u have permission , I have Tested over 1,000 Welders for Nuclear Power Plant, they should give you a Hard copy of rules , 2" sch 160 pipe is .436 thick, The  person testing you will know right of the bat how good you are by how you handle yourself an how many questions you ask, Be Nice , respect that person, Always think first before you ask questions, ask if you can position your height of test so you don't need a step on anything, Ask him/her how many Tacks they like, some will go with 3 but most 4, 1st Clean Clean Clean, inside an out, most people let you use jig to make tacks, Ask if he wants to see before or after u clean tacks, after that take your time put in the best root u can, Stop an ask if they want to see and if u need to feather anything, most will want to see root and. Then inspect after hot pass too, looking for suck back , push through , not tied in to tacks, once u get ok Ask if they need to see anything after that or when your done, most will check here an there Always Ask if u can use grinder, Most will let u if its a cosmetic issue but not for discontinuities , Make the Best Cover past possible , Very Important, Let pipe cool prior to cover then take your time if u need to let cool that's ok, you prob have inner pass temp of 500 , I can give u more info if needed over phone , contact me here if needed Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Reply:Thanks for the info guys.  I really appreciate the detailed response Andrew.  One small clarification.  When you were referring to grinding starts and stops I didn't 100% understand you.  The way I was taught to deal with them was to grind the starts strike the arc ahead of them and then drag the arc back into the groove.  On stops however I was not told to grind into them so I have just been wire brushing the stops.  Should I start grinding into my stops?
Reply:Some shops require all starts and stops Feathered, SomeSent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Reply:I have a triangle Test stand in my garage lolol , had 2 but gave one away , Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Reply:Originally Posted by MecmecWow, Stop Do Not Use a Grinder unless u have permission , I have Tested over 1,000 Welders for Nuclear Power Plant, they should give you a Hard copy of rules , 2" sch 160 pipe is .436 thick, The  person testing you will know right of the bat how good you are by how you handle yourself an how many questions you ask, Be Nice , respect that person, Always think first before you ask questions, ask if you can position your height of test so you don't need a step on anything, Ask him/her how many Tacks they like, some will go with 3 but most 4, 1st Clean Clean Clean, inside an out, most people let you use jig to make tacks, Ask if he wants to see before or after u clean tacks, after that take your time put in the best root u can, Stop an ask if they want to see and if u need to feather anything, most will want to see root and. Then inspect after hot pass too, looking for suck back , push through , not tied in to tacks, once u get ok Ask if they need to see anything after that or when your done, most will check here an there Always Ask if u can use grinder, Most will let u if its a cosmetic issue but not for discontinuities , Make the Best Cover past possible , Very Important, Let pipe cool prior to cover then take your time if u need to let cool that's ok, you prob have inner pass temp of 500 , I can give u more info if needed over phone , contact me here if needed Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Reply:Either way I am prepared.  I have done all of my practice intentionally not grinding to force myself to focus on bead placement and size.  So if they let me grind it will be a happy surprise but them not shouldn't be an issue.
Reply:They use backing rings for E7018 stick all the way out, I would BUST a welder in a blink of an eye if he/she used a grinder without asking me first, Done it an will do it again, School time is overSent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Reply:Wow Holy Crap, , the more I read about using grinders to dig out under cut, and ect, maybe someone should not give advice,  In Nuclear world if you can't do it in Ideal Condition A Shop, you can't do it in Field, Cya out the gateSent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Reply:Originally Posted by AMWThanks for the info guys.  I really appreciate the detailed response Andrew.  One small clarification.  When you were referring to grinding starts and stops I didn't 100% understand you.  The way I was taught to deal with them was to grind the starts strike the arc ahead of them and then drag the arc back into the groove.  On stops however I was not told to grind into them so I have just been wire brushing the stops.  Should I start grinding into my stops?
Reply:Oh also I welded Pipe, Plate , Sheet Metal, Nuclear Certified for over 30 years, Welded in Boilers , Also am a Weld Instructor , Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Reply:I know EXACTLY what im talking about on this subject my friend. This isn't a nuclear test. There are no backing rings on this test. open root V groove pipe test. bottom line. nothing fancy. And grinders are ok to use. Give a look at the documentary pipe test in that link I shared. I am not going to sit here and argue with you over whether or not you can use a grinder. I am bringing in my personal life experiences. You have your opinionated view on how you want your welders to take a test. Well the rest of the world has different views on this test. Nice, you have pipe,plate and sheet metal experience. I think almost every welder on this site has touched a piece of that before. You might have 30 years backing you and your a welding instructor. Probably very intelligent and have the resume to back it up. That's nice, I respect you for putting your time and years in. Which im working towards that myself. Nowhere near 30 years but will be one day.Last edited by AndrewDavenport89; 04-06-2015 at 03:36 PM.
Reply:Originally Posted by AndrewDavenport89In no way shape or form have I ever had to ask permission to use a grinder on a 6GR test! I have ALWAYS been able to pick that grinder up and go for it on a pipe test. No if and or butts about it. I can almost guarantee if that is the same test I have taken he shouldn't have to ask. HELL they even gave me their grinders and said don't use mine. Only time I wasn't able to use a grinder was on a 2" thick 16" long plate test. 7018 all the way out only use a chipping hammer and a wire brush. If your testing Nuclear welders they will be welding root and hot pass with GTAW. Which means less need for a grinder mecmec.....(But it is good to ask permission) But you saying WOW, stop like your so surprised somebody might use a grinder lol. When I was welding pipe everyday of my life for several years in the field or shop setting that grinder is a necessity when your having to battle elements, wet electrodes, poor electrode storage, rough winds, sea conditions trying to make a tie-in on a rise 5 foot off the water and it is splashing on your pipe and getting the groove wet....yea you will have discontinuitys that will have to come out. There is always room for error you have to prepare for. JUST LIKE IN A TESTING ENVIROMENT! NOTHING IS PERFECT. Grab that grinder with pride and dig out any undercut, incomplete fusion from your side walls, grind root passes, starts and stops, grind any high points in your hot and filler passes and don't think twice about it. grind until its smooth and shiny all the way around and you have gotten out any bit of imperfection from your last pass if it makes you more comfortable before you lay another bead down. I am telling you this from the welders point of view and not my inspection point of view.
Reply:Yea your a Rookie lolol get that grinder out, if you can't make it look good grind it flat, lololololSent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Reply:Each and every one of you use your grinders for a specific reason. YES I use a grinder, majority of the time I DO NOT have to. There come circumstances that it needs to be used. I try my best not to pick one up, but this isn't a perfect world. get your heads out of your asses. Lol ok I see how this is going to play out. Me giving a guy actual advice and facts I get played on? HAHA alright. Sounds like we got a bunch of hard *** computer cowboys here trying to one-up the fellow forum members. I am far from a rookie mecmec. But opinions are like assholes, and everybody has got one of them  Have fun with this thread I think the person who started it got the information he needed. NEXTLast edited by AndrewDavenport89; 04-06-2015 at 03:50 PM.
Reply:Last thing am I'm done, Good luck on Test and Andrew good luck to you, understand with age come experience , Once you understand what causes Under Cut, Lack of Fusion, Cold Lap, Underfill, and all the other discontinuities , It's easy to fix. I do mean it, real easy,  there are several people here that can weld out a coupon without picking up a grinder, But Grinders do serve a purpose, anyway good luck, contact me Andrew if I can help u with some weld equipment Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Reply:Yes, I know I have more to learn due to my age, but that doesn't mean I don't know what im talking about on this subject. And i do know the casues of these discontinuities you discuss. Oh I know there are some sure enough welders on here that only have the grinder for polishing with a wire wheel or poly bad. I can say I am one of those welders that can if need be and the situation arises weld a test coupon with no grinder involved, but for my own peace of mind. I will pick that grinder up and make sure I pass that test if I see anything I am questionable on in my weld.Last edited by AndrewDavenport89; 04-06-2015 at 04:24 PM.
Reply:Just don't do anything they tell you not to.
Reply:I'm with AD89 on this.  40 years and never ran into having to do tube/pipe without a grinder.  Imagine throwing that at a newby trying to put in a 6010 root.
Reply:It never hurts to ask about where grinders can used and NEVER EVER take a file to clean up the edges of the cap like you would in a shop. You can have a perfect weld and be failed because you took a file to the toes of the cap. They want to see if you have any undercut or not. Grinders have to be used on the tacks and tie in's on the root as well as cleaning up the completed root and hot pass if done with 6010. If fill and cap is with 7018 you shouldn't need a grinder too much. Cap shouldn't need any grinding and if they see grinding marks will fail you. The best advice I can give is to ask if you have any concerns or you run into a problem. The inspectors usually understand you're nervous doing a test and if you stop when you run into a problem and ask, they may let you try and fix it. If you keep going and make it worse or they see you made a repair, you're likely done. They should have a detailed procedure to follow. Tacks have to be within a certain size and feathered. Then they are inspected. Then you do the root and it's inspected. Once you adjust your positioner, they will mark it and it can't be moved. You are usually allowed to take the arm with your piece off the positioner for grinding in another area or showing the inspector but it has to go back in the exact same place. Try not to let your nerves get the best of you. The test has been described by many as 50% welding skill and 50% nerves. Try think of it as just another weld. Take a vice grip and ask if you can clamp it on your test piece to rest your free arm on. On 2" you usually have a choice if you want to run 3/32" or 1/8" rods. I was told when I went for my 2" test to run 3/32" because there's less likelihood of it cracking.
Reply:Originally Posted by TimmyTIGJust don't do anything they tell you not to.