Tig Cooler Build

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Im trying to build a tig cooler for my TA300.  I was thinking of using one of these in the cooling circuit:http://www.ebay.com/itm/221116571911...t_14579wt_1832I was planning on using a 5 gallon SS Cornelius keg from homebewing (I have plenty) as a tank, along with a Procon pump.  Now the questions:For cooling, do I need a heat exchanger, or for a hobbyist, will I get by with the keg filled with 5 gallons of coolant alone?  If it really ever gets really hot, I can dump it and fill up with fresh water.  My town water is chlorinated but close to distilled with less than 15 ppm of any salts. Would you consider welding some SS stock to the keg to act as cooling fins?My reservation on the exchanger is the possible intoduction of aluminum into the cooling circuit.  I understand that their may be some long term electrical destruction of the Aluminun with the copper in the torch.  Do the Procon pumps have an integral pressure regulator that is adjustable, or is it only on certain models?Where do I find the female fittings for the torch water lines? I will be using a CK 230 torch.  Thanks in advance and sorry for the long post.TA Arcmaster 300CM3XMT 304S22P12 suitcase feederX-Treme 12VSOptima pulserTA161SMaxstar 150STLHypertherm PM45OP setupStihl 020AVP, 039, 066 Magnum
Reply:The amount of cooling you will need will depend on how may amps you run and for how long. Nothing to do with being pro or hobbyist. That said, I think 5 gallons of water would be sufficient to weld for quite a while before it overheats. If you decide to leave out a radiator and it turns out to be insufficient, you will have some warning as the torch begins to heat up. So I doubt you will ever burn up the torch or leads, but you may need to stop to let it cool off.As far as just changing out the water goes, you ought to run antifreeze in the cooling system. On the power lead for a water cooled tig torch the coolant in the line acts as a conductor, so it must be a good electrolyte, like antifreeze, pure water is not ideal. Using straight tap water may also lead to corrosion or a biological problem like algae or yeast.Ian TannerKawasaki KX450 and many other fine tools
Reply:I built my own about 3 years ago.  It is all from aluminum, except for the radiator portion. ( I used a Pickup heater core.)  I spoke (on the phone) to an engineer from Miller who told me that the antifreeze sold by Miller came in two varieties--NO HF--or NO ALUMINUM.  He said to go ahead and use the NO ALUMINUM variety since the aluminum already would have the oxide on it and pose little to no problem.  I used a Procon pump that I located from a vendor in California.  I ordered one that was set in the 50-60 PSI range.  I also ordered a 230V motor and 230V muffin fan.  I desired to wire it right into the line with the welder plug so as to not ever be able to forget to plug in the cooler when welding.  It has worked very well for me so far.  I am only a hobby welder, and just mainly tinker with small projects.  I have little doubt that the cooler I built would function satisfactorily in a heavy duty operation.Here is a link to the CK Worldwide site which shows how to plumb the cooler/welder/torch together.http://www.ckworldwide.com/technical.htmLook for "TIG TORCH CONNECTION DIAGRAM"This was my first project with Aluminum.  It was welded with a 17 series air-cooled torch.  It was tough due to my lack of knowledge, and the end plates were 3/8 inch thick (I think??) and the tube was 1/4 inch thick.  Not pretty, but no leaks.Jerry in Anchorage Attached Images
Reply:HI DrfJust cut off the fittings and buy these they are rated at 120PSI and are quick disconnect type.I used the male and female setup so I could disconnect the cooler for storage and putting a pressure gauge in for setting it up. With out the torch set the pressure low (20PSI) then install the torch and set the pressure for 50PSI.  The procon pump has an internal pressure adjuster so you can change the pressure.  I connect the cooler input and output together and the same at the torch for storage no leaks.I modified the motor so I could put a fan on the other end for cooling (use a fan shroud for better cooling)http://www.usplastic.com/catalog/ite...3885&catid=926have funTom Attached ImagesLast edited by acourtjester; 08-28-2012 at 11:08 AM.
Reply:You do not need a heat exchanger for large water volume coolers.  For example the Bernard cooler that hold about 10 gallons and are a very common/popular unit has no heat exchanger.  that is what I have with my 330abp.  I use RV anti freeze as it has no sealers in it..  about $3-5 a gallon at wally mart. heater cores or evaperator cores from a junkyard are a good option for coolers as well as a flat trans cooler and just drop a fan behind itTiger Sales:  AHP Distributor    www.tigersalesco.comAHP200x; AHP 160ST; MM350P,  Spoolmatic 30A; Everlast PowerTig 185; Thermal Dynamics 60i plasma.  For Sale:  Cobra Mig 250 w/ Push-pull gun.  Lincoln Wirematic 250
Reply:Well if you did add a heat exchanger, this flow through looks pretty good to me. Mounted vertically against your SS tank, I could be a good convection precooler.http://www.ebay.com/itm/Aluminum-Sin...item51a0e01a08Last edited by shovelon; 08-28-2012 at 03:42 PM.Weld like a "WELDOR", not a wel-"DERR" MillerDynasty700DX,Dynasty350DX4ea,Dynasty200DX,Li  ncolnSW200-2ea.,MillerMatic350P,MillerMatic200w/spoolgun,MKCobraMig260,Lincoln SP-170T,PlasmaCam/Hypertherm1250,HFProTig2ea,MigMax1ea.
Reply:I just built a new one myself, with 5.5-6 gal capacity it takes a long time to even warm up running a #20 size torch...I rarely ever go above 200amps unless I'm welding aluminum... and even then it still takes a long time to warm up... I am not using a heat exchanger either... you could add one later if you felt you needed to...Lincoln pro mig 180Lincoln Square Wave Tig 300/wp 20/home built water cooler Victor, Purox, Harris, O/A welding/cutting setupsVintage Craftsman drill pressVintage Craftsman/Atlas 12"x 36'' lathe7''x 12'' w/c band saw Everlast 140 st
Reply:..... Attached ImagesLincoln pro mig 180Lincoln Square Wave Tig 300/wp 20/home built water cooler Victor, Purox, Harris, O/A welding/cutting setupsVintage Craftsman drill pressVintage Craftsman/Atlas 12"x 36'' lathe7''x 12'' w/c band saw Everlast 140 st
Reply:Hi Drf, I built a cooler several years ago.  I installed an indoor/outdoor thermometer in my coolant tank with the outdoor probe in the coolant.  My tank is small by most standards, about .75 gallons.  I use a radiator I purchased on internet ( PC POWER ZONE ) for computers along with a muffin fan.  Grainger Procon pump plus seperate filter from Miller.  The only time the thermometer goes above 90 degrees f is when I am welding aluminium and then for runs over approx 2 min. constant.  I think with you using five gallons of coolant you do not need anything else, just leave your pump running.  Best  Bob
Reply:Originally Posted by Drf255Im trying to build a tig cooler for my TA300.  Now the questions:If it really ever gets really hot, I can dump it and fill up with fresh water.  My town water is chlorinated but close to distilled with less than 15 ppm of any salts. .
Reply:Originally Posted by fortyonethirtyThe amount of cooling you will need will depend on how may amps you run and for how long. Nothing to do with being pro or hobbyist. That said, I think 5 gallons of water would be sufficient to weld for quite a while before it overheats. If you decide to leave out a radiator and it turns out to be insufficient, you will have some warning as the torch begins to heat up. So I doubt you will ever burn up the torch or leads, but you may need to stop to let it cool off.As far as just changing out the water goes, you ought to run antifreeze in the cooling system. On the power lead for a water cooled tig torch the coolant in the line acts as a conductor, so it must be a good electrolyte, like antifreeze, pure water is not ideal. Using straight tap water may also lead to corrosion or a biological problem like algae or yeast.
Reply:Sorry for ths dumb question, but does one need a vent on the system?If I have a fully sealed system, will there be an issue when the coolant expands from the heat?TA Arcmaster 300CM3XMT 304S22P12 suitcase feederX-Treme 12VSOptima pulserTA161SMaxstar 150STLHypertherm PM45OP setupStihl 020AVP, 039, 066 Magnum
Reply:Originally Posted by Drf255Sorry for ths dumb question, but does one need a vent on the system?If I have a fully sealed system, will there be an issue when the coolant expands from the heat?
Reply:Do what I did. http://weldingweb.com/vbb/showthread.php?t=58517With 5 gallons you wont need a heat exchanger. That extruded finned tube thing wont do much anyway.Welding/Fab Pics: www.UtahWeld.com
Reply:I have been reading all these threads about home made tig coolers. There have been some that have the opinion that an aluminum tank will eventually rot out do to the copper ions from the copper hose fittings. Would there be a grade of stainless steel that would work good as a heat sink to make the tank out of, or is aluminum still the best.kidtigger24  They think I’m crazy, but I know better. It is not I who am crazy. It is I who am MAD!
Reply:Drf, regarding how I installed the temperature probe into my tank, my tank is made from a 4" pvc "t" fitting with a small section of 4" pvc pipe and 2 - 4" pvc end caps.  One of the openings of the "t" has a threaded cap and this is where the fill is.  I drilled a clearance hole for the temperature probe in the threaded cap and inserted the probe into the coolant.  "Piece of cake".  Hope this answers your question.  Best  Bob
Reply:Most of the commercial coolers r stainless.Tiger Sales:  AHP Distributor    www.tigersalesco.comAHP200x; AHP 160ST; MM350P,  Spoolmatic 30A; Everlast PowerTig 185; Thermal Dynamics 60i plasma.  For Sale:  Cobra Mig 250 w/ Push-pull gun.  Lincoln Wirematic 250
Reply:Originally Posted by soutthpawMost of the commercial coolers r stainless.
Reply:My Bernard is a stainless tank with no heat exchanger..guess its pretty tough to heat 10 gallons of water with a lil torchTiger Sales:  AHP Distributor    www.tigersalesco.comAHP200x; AHP 160ST; MM350P,  Spoolmatic 30A; Everlast PowerTig 185; Thermal Dynamics 60i plasma.  For Sale:  Cobra Mig 250 w/ Push-pull gun.  Lincoln Wirematic 250
Reply:Water has a huge thermal capacity. Think of how long it takes to boil a quart of water over a red hot stove. That same weight of aluminum would be brought up to 212degrees in seconds, and also cool down much much quicker.Aluminum conducts heat way better than stainless steel, but in the real world an aluminum tank and a stainless tank will both "dissipate heat" about the same I bet, since there isn't much temp difference and theres just a little piss stream of water running into a large reservoir; neither is going to cause a problem.Stainless is probably the best thing to make the tank out of. Plastic would work excellently as well but might benefit from a heat exchanger more.Last edited by MikeGyver; 08-30-2012 at 01:13 AM.Welding/Fab Pics: www.UtahWeld.com
Reply:Automotive antifreeze is ethylene glycol and is toxic.RV antifreeze is propylene glycol and is used in the water system of an rv to winterize. It is non toxic. Dont drink it though.Lincoln Power Mig 210MP MIGLincoln Power Mig 350MP - MIG and Push-PullLincoln TIG 300-300Lincoln Hobby-Weld 110v  Thanks JLAMESCK TIG TORCH, gas diffuser, pyrex cupThermal Dynamics Cutmaster 101My brain
Reply:Ok. So I won a Procon pump with a water cooled 110v AC motor for $82 including shipping.  My CK230 torch came in.  I made a Dinse Adapter by soldering a copper lug onto some 2/0 cable, then soldering that lug to a standard water cooled torch block made to bolt onto a machine with a threaded post output.  I cut off the piece with the hole that bolts to the machine I connected the Dinse 50 connector to the cable and plan on insulating the whole thing with some pipe insulation.  Total cost, $0-the block came with the torch and the cable was a leftover piece.  So now I need to buy 2 barbed corney keg adapters, some barbed to NPT fittings and plumb my lines.  What type of pressure gauge have you used in your systems?TA Arcmaster 300CM3XMT 304S22P12 suitcase feederX-Treme 12VSOptima pulserTA161SMaxstar 150STLHypertherm PM45OP setupStihl 020AVP, 039, 066 Magnum
Reply:Pics of the lugThe Keg and my new (to me) machineIf this works out, I think I will have an entire tig cooler with a stainless tank for under $125.I was on ebay looking for stainless steel tanks and then basically tripped over the corney keg in my garage.TA Arcmaster 300CM3XMT 304S22P12 suitcase feederX-Treme 12VSOptima pulserTA161SMaxstar 150STLHypertherm PM45OP setupStihl 020AVP, 039, 066 Magnum
Reply:That Thermal Arc is a nice machine!  Think that tank will do the job, its big enough!  Best Bob
Reply:You don't need a large tank.....you're cooling the water BEFORE it gets to the tank and pumping the cooled water back to the torch, otherwise the water in the tank will just get hotter and hotter.You can have a small tank, about 1 litre or so ,to ensure you don't run dry from evaporation over a period of time, but the system is self maintaining temperature wise if the flow is sufficient.This is the same as your car's cooling system....closed loop system,minimum water in the engine jacket and a flow constantly monitored by the thermostat that opens and closes to allow the water to be cooled by the radiator to maintain efficient block operating temperature......if the thermostat in your car sticks open you get too much cooling and the engine then runs cold and uses more petrol due to being in a start up condition.All you need is a pump, a small tank,a radiator and a fan....the rest is just a bit of piping to flow the coolant round the closed circuit, which means you will have a very compact cooler unit...no big tank.If the system is closed loop with a relief/expansion valve you won't get any evaporation, so no coolant loss.We built one to cool the gun of a submerged arc welder (working 6 hours continuous welding) using the core from a car's heater unit with attached fan and a small pump.....working on 12 volts and powered by a 12 volt battery charger and a container with about 1 litre of water.....it's the flow rate that cools not the volume.Ian.Pure water will not carry electricity. Only the salts in un pure water are conductors. Magnesium is an excellent sacrificial metal for a cooling tank. I've installed many new magnesium bars in water tanks for fire fighting trucks. Mac
Reply:Originally Posted by Drf255What type of pressure gauge have you used in your systems?
Reply:John T, my pressure gauge is just a cheap 0 - 100 psi 1/4" npt inserted into a 3/8" "T" coming out of the output side of the pump.  Works fine for me.   Bob
Reply:I have an Oil pressure gauge with a long capillary from the auto parts store. It was about $20Regards,RobGreat Basin WeldingInstagramBlue weldersRed weldersMy luscious Table DIY TIG Torch cooler
Reply:Here's the cooler unit I built for my Syn250.   I picked up an ebay procon pump and motor for about $125 shipped and had a friend cut the stainless and bend it for me. I then jerry rigged the pump up and ran everything out of a 5 gallon pail while I welded the stainless tank up.   After welding the tank the water in the bucket didn't change temperature at all so I did not add a cooler. I figured that's just one more thing to get damaged and leak.  I don't run a pressure gauge, regulator, or anything fancy like that. There's plenty of flow through the torch. The pump is plugged into the welder so it's on when the welder is on. I run a bit of anti-freeze in the water just to lube the pump and keep it from freezing if the shop heater ever quit.  Not a bad setup for a $60 syncrowave
Reply:Thanks guysPicked up a gauge at the local plumbing house. $5.02 out the door...I may mount it on exterior just to keep an eye on pressure...After rebuilding my oberdorfer i still didnt like the sound and also had a bitch of a time bleeding the system ... To get it to pump through 25' I think its just old Anyway i bought a procon series 1 and matching motorGonna stuff it into the radiator1Actually the procon stuff consolidates nicely...I need to get a 110v muffin fanAnd i should be good.   Leaves a lot of room for a fan...Miller 211Hypertherm PM 451961 Lincoln Idealarc 250HTP 221  True Wisdom only comes from Pain.
Reply:Found a few brass fittings in brasstown...The remote pressure gauge is a bitchin idea...You cant adjust pressure without getting to the pump...But a good warning device. Miller 211Hypertherm PM 451961 Lincoln Idealarc 250HTP 221  True Wisdom only comes from Pain.
Reply:Any suggestions for a 110 fan?Miller 211Hypertherm PM 451961 Lincoln Idealarc 250HTP 221  True Wisdom only comes from Pain.
Reply:You won't need a fan with that radiator. Nice setup!   If you wanted to get creative you could run that system (motor - fan - pump) in a line with a couple quick shafts and couplings. That would give airflow over the radiator and power the pump on the same motor. Just a thought.
Reply:Originally Posted by northern50You won't need a fan with that radiator. Nice setup!   If you wanted to get creative you could run that system (motor - fan - pump) in a line with a couple quick shafts and couplings. That would give airflow over the radiator and power the pump on the same motor. Just a thought.