ironworkers?

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I'm starting to lean towards a 50t -75T ironworker to simplify  my life. If i can find room in my shop for it!Having never used one id like to ask:is there any good/ bad makes out there?I think id like to wait a get a used scotchman or piranha. (im sure there are other good old names out there)Although i do see a 55T edwards new could fit into the budget.any opinions or pitfalls?Thanks in advanceG
Reply:i like the edwards 40t and you can run a bender of the ironworker Attached Images
Reply:Older (usually at least 40 to 50 years old, often as much as 80) mechanical ones are cheap, and work fine for punching and shearing.Buffalo's last forever. Made in the USA, heavy, huge, and bulletproof.Best ones, though, are the German ones- Mubea and Peddinghaus.Newer ones are all hydraulic. Mubea and Peddinghaus are still two of the very best ones out there, for the last 40 years. Me, I have a Geka, from the Basque Country in Spain- I think Geka's are probably better for most small shops that do fab work, while for production, I would maybe go with a German Machine.Of the US machines, none of em are as good as the top 3 from Europe, but Piranna's are probably one of the best.Scotchman's are cheap, relatively speaking, and easy to fix, but they wear out. I have seen my local steel yard wear out a Scotchman every 8 or 10 years now, and that is NOT production, mostly just shearing to length.Edwards are designed to be cheap. They work. But there are lots of better machines out there. Kind of a home shop machine. You dont see big plants with 20 year old Edwards machines in em. You do, however, often see 50 year old Mubeas and Peddis still being used 8 hours a day in steel service centers, having lifetime punch numbers in the millions...
Reply:We have a Pirhana P-3 that we've had for nearly 20 years and I only have good things to say about it, although it's really the only ironworker that I've ever used.
Reply:We have a geka at work and its a champ.Ya gotta spend money to make money!
Reply:I have a geka and love it.  Recently I was at a trade show, the scotchsman guy was like I got some a great ironworkers to show you.  I was like, "I doubt you can impress me, I have a geka". The guy was like "oh, never mind then"  Lincoln 300 Vantage 2008300 Commander 1999SA250 1999SA200 1968Miller Syncrowave 200XMT350MPA/S-52E/xr-15Xtreme 12vs Millermatic 251 w/30A  Millermatic 251 Dialarc 250 Hypertherm 1250 GEKA & Bantom Ironwokers
Reply:Edwards are just cheap,  too many small pieces in the design.  I have a Unihydro, love it, may be upsizing soon,  like Edwards, made in MN.  IMO the best bang for the buck.  You can get a 45 ton at a good price.  If you look at the design of the Unihydro it is very simple and very little can go wrong with it. If you look at the tonnage and the capacities the Unihydro does the most for it's size.  I have seen a lot of Unihydro 42 tons that are very old and still work like a charm.  The 45 is the upgrade but more or less the same. Nothing wrong with a scotchman, made in SD.  Mubeas are awesome, but can get pricey on parts.TB 302 EFIESAB Migmaster 275MM 211 w/Spoolmate 100Hypertherm PlasmaMetal Master, Victor, and Smith TorchesUnihydro 45Wells BandsawArcair K2000Weldcraft Tig rigMiller 12VSLincoln PT 225No one can say I'm brand biased.
Reply:Once you use a GEKA, with its built in no wrench adjustable stops on every station, with built in stainless steel rulers, you wouldnt want to go back to a Unihydro, much less an Edwards.I dont need to center punch my hole locations, I dont need to use a tape measure and a scribe or sharpie on every part, and so I get better, more accurate work done faster.I can have a low wage employee cut 100 parts, or punch 100 holes, and they come out right, the first time.It is just amazing to me that the major american manufacturers havent put real gages and stops on their machines, when the Basques have been doing it for something like 20 years.My Geka came stock with an electric length stop that automatically shears the piece when it is pushed in to touch the stop. I paid a bit extra for the extensions so it goes out to 12 feet- so any size part I want from a 20 foot bar can be cut quickly and accurately with no measuring in any number I want. The Geka comes stock with the BEST punch gaging table out there, by far. Most US manufacturers dont even offer one at all, the few that do are expensive and crummy. If you really LIKE to use tape measures and vise grips and scraps of angle iron to build one-off erratic stops, well, go for it.
Reply:you can get punch tables/jigs and bar shear stops to match the Unihydro ironworker you buy.  You can see them on their website.When I bought mine I picked it up at the factory, they told me a lot of people make their own jigs for the punch and shear to what they need.Unihydro also has an impeccable safety record, not sure on the Gekas.  Unihydro also has maintenance figured out, I can grease my little machine in a couple of minutes without removing anything.TB 302 EFIESAB Migmaster 275MM 211 w/Spoolmate 100Hypertherm PlasmaMetal Master, Victor, and Smith TorchesUnihydro 45Wells BandsawArcair K2000Weldcraft Tig rigMiller 12VSLincoln PT 225No one can say I'm brand biased.
Reply:I've kinda been looking at the Iroquois ironworkers and brakes.  Nice and simple looking.  Prices aren't terrible, and they're made in SD.  I don't know what to make of them really though as I only have experience with a few Scotchmans and a small Uni.  It's nice that they have presses built in. Two birds, one stone....My name's not Jim....
Reply:Hi have a 100 ton Edwards and a 65 ton mechanical Peddinghouse at my part time job both ok @ Harris we have a 65 ton hyd Peddinghouse  ok too, and a Hills and Jones single end punch from the 1920's around 120 tons still works .
Reply:I am sure the Unihydro machines are well made, and that they punch and shear just fine.But their "punch table" is a joke- It is one step up from using vise grips. And it is optional at extra cost.I cant find a good picture of the Geka table, but it makes that yeller thing down below look like something your kid made in grade school.Same thing with their cut off gage- its primitive, hard to use, and costs extra.Punch a hole with the Uni-hydro- you would need to use a wrench to loosen 2 screws on the punch table, measure in 4 places with a tape measure, get two bars parallel, then tighten down the 2 screws again, and hope you are right.Versus Geka- loosen two big handles, move the back gage along the built in double rulers to your desired size. Then loosen one more big handle, adjust the side gage along ITS built in ruler. Takes 30 seconds, no tools, no tape measure, and it comes our accurate every time. And it will go out about 3 times the length the Uni does.Same thing with the back gage. Uni-hydro- 2 bolts, tape measure, and you need three hands to get it right. Geka- quick adjust no tool locking devices, built in rulers, AND electrical stop- not even an option on Uni.I am not a Geka Salesman- I paid cash money for mine, and it wasnt cheap. But if you have actually used one, the differences are so big- and so much about getting stuff done faster and more accurately. I often have guys working for me. They screw up enough as it is- anything I can do to make stuff come out right more often is worth cash to me, and accurate no tool gaging has saved me thousands over the ten or twelve years I have owned my ironworker. Attached ImagesLast edited by Ries; 09-07-2011 at 01:07 PM.
Reply:I've got a buddy with a GEKA. I've helped him out when he was jammed up,  punching fence rails and shearing spindles. Way nicer than running the Scotchman the tech school has..No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:I've used Piranha, Uni-Hydro, and Scotchman.Love the Piranha (P-90).Scotchman was not bad.The Uni-Hydro was basically a high dollar pipe notcher, and even though we had a good set of punches and dies, that's all it got used for regularly since it was such a pain to set up.Never had a Geka to work with but have heard nothing but good things from anyone who has.Brian LeonardAppalachian Ironworks L.L.C.434 Long Branch Rd, Marshall, NC 28753828 649 9966828 702 [email protected]
Reply:Originally Posted by welderShaneWe have a geka at work and its a champ.
Reply:I wanna scrap the brand new scotchman i use....I forgot how to change this.
Reply:I know the Geka is a great machine, so is the Mubea.  Used them both. I know Mubea's can be a pain to get parts for, not sure about the Geka.  For what the OP seems to be looking for I think the best bang for his buck is going to be the Unihydro. Plus it's American made.TB 302 EFIESAB Migmaster 275MM 211 w/Spoolmate 100Hypertherm PlasmaMetal Master, Victor, and Smith TorchesUnihydro 45Wells BandsawArcair K2000Weldcraft Tig rigMiller 12VSLincoln PT 225No one can say I'm brand biased.
Reply:thanks for all the replies. Very helpful.just shows what marketing can do.(it worked for micro$oft for a long time)i knew nothing about ironworkers, never used one.every time i would go on line to look id get a lot of results for "edwards"thought they were ok because of that. edwards would probably do me fine. not into big production.now i found out about a few other names that i never heard of in my searches that are "probably" better than edwards and some are for a similar price.Thanks again guys.(this was not meant to be a " edwards are ****" thing at all. i dont think that they are. they'd probably do me fine.)G