I Got Lathed Last Night

admin

Found this on our local on-line ad service Tuesday night and called the owner yesterday at lunch time.  He called back and said someone else was coming to look at it and committed to letting me know the outcome.  Called me back just as I pulled in the driveway getting home from work and long story short, at 6:30 Judy turned the pasta water off on the stove and I were headed out on a 1-1/2 hour each way trip to pick it up.Enco model 93040, 12" x 36" complete with heavy (3/8" plate) bench.Live center with integral center drill.Phase II quick change tool holder. . .. . .with an assortment of holders, boring bars, knurler and carbide tri-tips, tail stock chuck and original tool holder.Only 'problem' is the low speed jackshaft and gears are missing.  Thinking of looking into a VFD - unless I come across replacement parts.  Still have 6 speeds just the same.Oh yeah - $250!  He was just getting rid of it to make room for a bigger machine.MM200 w/Spoolmatic 1Syncrowave 180SDBobcat 225G Plus - LP/NGMUTT Suitcase WirefeederWC-1S/Spoolmatic 1HF-251D-1PakMaster 100XL '68 Red Face Code #6633 projectStar Jet 21-110Save Second Base!
Reply:I hope you got a good deal on it, considering the two trees (shown in the first picture) growing up through it!
Reply:Originally Posted by Oldiron2I hope you got a good deal on it, considering the two trees (shown in the first picture) growing up through it!
Reply:Hello 911? Yes operator, I'd like to report a theft. This guy just stole a lathe. Just drove right over and stole it... Sweet! I'd have driven almost twice as far for that..No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:As I noted after the last photo, $250 for the lot. He was only get rid of it to make room for a bigger machine.
Reply:Nice find! (again) Nice trailer too, isn't it about time you built one of your own MikeConstans Fides et IntegritasLincoln Weldanpower 150 ACAirco Aircomatic MIGet CAV II w/ spoolgunMillermatic 30a wirefeeder
Reply:Dammit, some guys just have all the luck.  The ways in good shape?My name's not Jim....
Reply:And would ya take the key out of the chuck already!My name's not Jim....
Reply:Originally Posted by BrinkNice find! (again) Nice trailer too, isn't it about time you built one of your own
Reply:Sandy,I was just congratulating him for the second time (he called me right after he picked it up) I haven't seen it in person yet, but I will this weekend. Hopefully I don't break his new toy   And I was messing with him about the trailer since we don't have one of our own yet.MikeConstans Fides et IntegritasLincoln Weldanpower 150 ACAirco Aircomatic MIGet CAV II w/ spoolgunMillermatic 30a wirefeeder
Reply:I just realized that the table seems to be up off the trailer deck a bit, is it on casters?  Must've been fun carrying it from the driveway to the shop . . . or is this a moving surprise waiting for me when I get home?MikeConstans Fides et IntegritasLincoln Weldanpower 150 ACAirco Aircomatic MIGet CAV II w/ spoolgunMillermatic 30a wirefeeder
Reply:Oh, and your play-on-words is disturbing.MikeConstans Fides et IntegritasLincoln Weldanpower 150 ACAirco Aircomatic MIGet CAV II w/ spoolgunMillermatic 30a wirefeeder
Reply:Originally Posted by Brink... And I was messing with him about the trailer since we don't have one of our own yet.
Reply:Originally Posted by DSWsome mouthy college kid
Reply:.No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:Originally Posted by BrinkSandy,I was just congratulating him for the second time (he called me right after he picked it up) I haven't seen it in person yet, but I will this weekend. Hopefully I don't break his new toy   And I was messing with him about the trailer since we don't have one of our own yet.
Reply:Originally Posted by BoostinjdmThe ways in good shape?
Reply:You're using the wrong psychology. Try reminding dad how much simpler it will be for you to move all your stuff out of the house with a trailer, so he can turn your old room into a nice workshop or TV room for dad and his buds! The trailer would also be useful for hauling all those remodeling supplies home as well as picking up that nice new recliner and big screen TV he'll be able to buy using all the money he's saving from your college tuition! .No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:Naw, dad's got too many projects to mess with a trailer MikeConstans Fides et IntegritasLincoln Weldanpower 150 ACAirco Aircomatic MIGet CAV II w/ spoolgunMillermatic 30a wirefeeder
Reply:Originally Posted by BrinkI just realized that the table seems to be up off the trailer deck a bit, is it on casters?
Reply:Yes I'm still coming home so If you're asking me to help you move that heavy looking thing then the answer is yes.  Either way I have to go scrub my mind out to get that image out of my head.MikeConstans Fides et IntegritasLincoln Weldanpower 150 ACAirco Aircomatic MIGet CAV II w/ spoolgunMillermatic 30a wirefeeder
Reply:Thats a bargain Duane.Are you going to paint it?
Reply:Originally Posted by BillyThats a bargain Duane.Are you going to paint it?
Reply:Keep an eye on Fleabay.  There's quite a few lathes parted out and sold in pieces."Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/
Reply:Duane,Do you reckon that the missing jackshaft is still around the guys place?Esab Migmaster 250Lincoln SA 200Lincoln Ranger 8Smith Oxy Fuel setupEverlast PowerPlasma 80Everlast Power iMIG 160Everlast Power iMIG 205 Everlast Power iMIG 140EEverlast PowerARC 300Everlast PowerARC 140STEverlast PowerTIG 255EXTcrazy texans, gettin' rid of a good lathe like that for $250.  sweet deal for you though, duane
Reply:Nice snag Duane,  Heck the steel in the table, and the labor making it, is half the price you paid for the whole setup.   Waytogo!!6"XX P5P8 6G
Reply:Originally Posted by lugweldDuane,Do you reckon that the missing jackshaft is still around the guys place?
Reply:Originally Posted by CofeNice snag Duane,  Heck the steel in the table, and the labor making it, is half the price you paid for the whole setup.   Waytogo!!
Reply:Originally Posted by TractapacDitto the bargain.My bet for paint will be Miller Blue.Duanes been humming "Lathe last night" all day.The chorus goes:"Lathe last night, ooh yeah, lathe last night"from Split Enz for a good bit of 70s Kiwi rock if you're up for it!
Reply:Nice steal, I mean deal Duane!    And just to think, you came to Louisiana and didnt stop in for a visit!  I'm disappointed!      Hey, great find, and I hope it works out great for you!A few of my toys !LinuxMintManjaroMiller Roughneck 2E Lincoln WeldPak 100HTP MTS 160 Chicago Electric 80amp Inverter   Victor O/A
Reply:Originally Posted by smawgmawNice steal, I mean deal Duane!    And just to think, you came to Louisiana and didnt stop in for a visit!  I'm disappointed!      Hey, great find, and I hope it works out great for you!
Reply:Southeast of DeRidder.  Between Jennings and Crowley in a small farming community.A few of my toys !LinuxMintManjaroMiller Roughneck 2E Lincoln WeldPak 100HTP MTS 160 Chicago Electric 80amp Inverter   Victor O/A
Reply:Well that didn't take me too long. . .. . .to break my lathe that is.I was working on a couple projects yesterday that came to a screeching halt when my inexperience as a 'lathe operator' reared its ugly head.I had just completed turning a couple surplus golf cart front axle spindles into slip-in spindles for a straight tube axle for either the Roughneck 2E or Weldanpower 150 running gear I have planned.  They started out looking like this. . .. . .turning into this. . .. . .to wind up like this (sorry for the fussy photo).  Cutting the 1" schedule 40 pipe axle and welding the spindles in place still needs to be done.I then started on making the upright pieces for the second pipe vise mount for the model BC-410 Rigid chain vise when it happened.I switched from using the lead screw and half nuts to drive the apron to using the cross/longitudinal drive for a finer cut and it turns out the safety interlock that prevents both from being engaged at the same time is broken and as a result the half nuts weren't completely disengaged from the lead screw when I engaged the c/l drive.  Of course as a result the half nuts were holding the apron in a stationary position while the c/l drive was attempting to do otherwise.Something had to give and before I realized what was happening the apron rack drive gear suffered dearly and wound up looking like this.Obviously a PO had the same problem as the original gear has been turned off and a replacement Martin (some of their logo can still be seen) was welded in place.  Worse case I'll have to do the same but a little reaseach has indicated a couple other brands of similar lathes (HF and Jet) could very likely have the exact same shaft/gear.If there's a silver lining to this mishap it's that I'm going to go ahead and pull it all apart for a complete cleaning and maintenance and replace the already damaged 'low' gear for the lead screw that prevents me from being able to cut certain threads and from getting the finest cuts from the c/l drive.There's a total of three identical duplex gears in the unit and the bad low gear is the one on the right with a good one on the left.Obviously I'll be making a new interlock lever actuator that fastens to the top half nut so it doesn't happen again.  I'm just glad it was while using my machine and not someone elses.  Live and learn.MM200 w/Spoolmatic 1Syncrowave 180SDBobcat 225G Plus - LP/NGMUTT Suitcase WirefeederWC-1S/Spoolmatic 1HF-251D-1PakMaster 100XL '68 Red Face Code #6633 projectStar Jet 21-110Save Second Base!
Reply:A 45 minute fix that would have saved me a big headache.Remains of broken safety interlock lever actuator.  1" x 1/4" flat stock will be the basis for a replacement.Safety interlock lever with half nuts removed.New lever actuator with adjusting screw installed and half nuts closed.  Safety interlock lever engaged in groove of cross/longitudinal feed shifter shaft to prevent c/l engagement as it should have been.Half nuts open and c/l drive engaged one way. . .. . .and then the other.  Safety interlock lever against c/l shifter shaft prevents closing of the half nuts on the lead screw.If I had only known.MM200 w/Spoolmatic 1Syncrowave 180SDBobcat 225G Plus - LP/NGMUTT Suitcase WirefeederWC-1S/Spoolmatic 1HF-251D-1PakMaster 100XL '68 Red Face Code #6633 projectStar Jet 21-110Save Second Base!
Reply:Including the nasty detail pics of you getting lathed is shameful disgusting!MikeConstans Fides et IntegritasLincoln Weldanpower 150 ACAirco Aircomatic MIGet CAV II w/ spoolgunMillermatic 30a wirefeeder
Reply:OK, so I didn't get to the tear-down and complete cleaning part as promised a few posts ago but I needed to get it back together.  Determined that I had to go back with the same Martin #S1612 (16DP 12T) that a PO used as a 'weld-on' replacement for the original shaft gear as the rack was changed too.  As such, a new original 13T metric dimension shaft gear would not have meshed properly.Finally got around to ordering a new gear from Motion Industries - which arrived last week - and with a little help from Brink's GF's father and her grandfather's machine shop followed by a little TIG welding with the Syncrowave 180SD and voila!New spur gear compared to the damaged unit.Damaged gear turned off.New gear installed and ready for welding onto shaft.Repaired shaft reinstalled in apron gearbox.  Gear/shaft was plug welded on end as well.Apron and gearbox reassembled and reinstalled on lathe bed.I didn't take any photos but I had to modify the new interlock actuator I made earlier for proper interlock operation to prevent another failure for the same reason.  Modification was required to allow the fabricated actuator mounted to the upper halfnut to clear one of the front slide blocks with the halfnuts open.Stand by for more. . .MM200 w/Spoolmatic 1Syncrowave 180SDBobcat 225G Plus - LP/NGMUTT Suitcase WirefeederWC-1S/Spoolmatic 1HF-251D-1PakMaster 100XL '68 Red Face Code #6633 projectStar Jet 21-110Save Second Base!
Reply:. . .about the apron/lead screw drive geartrain repair.I contacted Enco Customer Service and in talking to one of their techs found out that my model 92030 was discontinued in '85 and replaced with the model 110-2030.  In a review of thier website revealed the current 12x36 model to be 110-2034 which appeared to be virtually identical to the 92030 so I took a chance and ordered a new 110-2034 duplex in the hope it would be a direct replacemenmt for the bad one posted earlier.  New duplex gear arrived today and low and behold - perfect!  Only difference is the earlier gears had bushings but the new one doesn't.  So now that I know the gears are the same, I'll be ordering two more to replace the other worn ones before we have another meltdown.New gear on the right (no bushing), 'good' old one on the left and bad one on top.Geartrain reassembled and low gear returned to operation.Now to see if all the backgear parts for the model 110-2034 are available that are missing from the 92030 and just how expensive restoring that might be.MM200 w/Spoolmatic 1Syncrowave 180SDBobcat 225G Plus - LP/NGMUTT Suitcase WirefeederWC-1S/Spoolmatic 1HF-251D-1PakMaster 100XL '68 Red Face Code #6633 projectStar Jet 21-110Save Second Base!
Reply:Originally Posted by duaneb55. . .about the apron/lead screw drive geartrain repair.I contacted Enco Customer Service and in talking to one of their techs found out that my model 92030 was discontinued in '85 and replaced with the model 110-2030.  In a review of thier website revealed the current 12x36 model to be 110-2034 which appeared to be virtually identical to the 92030 so I took a chance and ordered a new 110-2034 duplex in the hope it would be a direct replacemenmt for the bad one posted earlier.  New duplex gear arrived today and low and behold - perfect!  Only difference is the earlier gears had bushings but the new one doesn't.  So now that I know the gears are the same,
Reply:Originally Posted by TractapacWhat's the lathe's first task going to be? Miller bits?
Reply:The bushing isn't an issue? Guess running in oil it prolly doesn't?
Reply:Problem is they don't run in oil and rely on routine lubrication.  Giving serious consideration to boring the new gear to fit with the old gear's or a new bushing.MM200 w/Spoolmatic 1Syncrowave 180SDBobcat 225G Plus - LP/NGMUTT Suitcase WirefeederWC-1S/Spoolmatic 1HF-251D-1PakMaster 100XL '68 Red Face Code #6633 projectStar Jet 21-110Save Second Base!
Reply:Originally Posted by duaneb55Problem is they don't run in oil and rely on routine lubrication.  Giving serious consideration to boring the new gear to fit with the old gear's or a new bushing.
Reply:Duane-  Congrats on getting (and subsequently fixing) your lathe.  I would love to own one, but I'm a neophyte like you and stories like yours make me very gunshy of used equipment.  In fact, I'm even a bit scared of NEW equipment since I didn't understand half of the part-names you mentioned and could probably accomplish far, far less if mine broke.Lincoln AC225 & MigPak 140, Lincoln Magnum SpoolGun, Miller Spectrum 375-X Plasma, Syncrowave 200 TIG, Millermatic 252 MIG, Miller Digital Elite, General 7x12" horiz/vert bandsaw, 3' box/pan brake, 20 ton press, milling machine, 12x28 lathe, etc.
Reply:Wow!!! Nice buy for only $250. And free use of Brinks trailer made it sweeter Brink said you have alot of projects on the waiting list Perhaps when he comes over to help move it and have Judy do his laundry you two could do a lil father & son bonding and reduce that projects list.Building you  your own trailer would be a great father & son project.! But by borrowing his trailer he comes home more often.Co-Own CNC shop:Miller :1251 plasma cutter, MaxStar 700 TIG/Stick, & XMT 456 Multiprocess Welder.&  2 Hypertherm HPR260's Plasma CutterSorry I had a bad stroke but now I am back.
Reply:i know this is an old post, but i am taking a chance.  I already talked to enco service and they are no help.  my gear on the threading indicator is missing, the one that tells you when to engage power feed when cutting threads.  i was wondering if there was any way you could measure it and give me the specs on it.  it would be greatly appreciated,  thanks.
Reply:Duaneb,I have a friend who had to replace a gear on his lathe, found it new and about passed out it was like $700-800. He hunted around and found a someplace that had it for about $35.00 he bought two. I can give him a call and get the address if your still looking.
Reply:Originally Posted by duaneb55As I noted after the last photo, $250 for the lot.  He was only get rid of it to make room for a bigger machine.
Reply:Oficially, YOU SUCK, there!
Reply:Hi, the bit that's missing is called a back gear....probably a jack shaft too....but if'n it was removed it was probably 'cos a couple of teeth got knocked off of one of the gears, there's two gears mounted on the hollow shaft,running on a cam spindle, one at each end spaced apart, and mesh with the two similar gears on the main spindle.They run on a spindle that is cam operated by a lever on the outside of the headstock to enable them to be engaged with two similar gears on the headstock spindle when a lower speed range is wanted.......there is also a locking pin behind the bull gear on the mainshaft that is part of the back gear mechanism, and it locks and/or releases the headstock drive pulley to the bull gear on the main spindle.....the big gear on the main spindle is called the Bull Gear, and is keyed to the main spindle, whereas the drive Vee pulleys on the main spindle run free when in back gear.You have 4 speeds now, and the back gear mechanism gives you 8 speeds in all.Back gear reduction ratio is normally about 1:6 or less. If'n you can't get genuine spare parts for this lathe, you can make them up from commercially available gears (a gear is just a gear) and match them to the gears on the main spindle.BUT........ the gears on the main spindle that these missing gears mesh with are Helical gears, that is gears with the teeth cut at a slant as opposed to regular straight cut gears, (to make them run quieter and smoother) so you might have to get them cut specially........the previous owner probably had a heart attack when he got a quote to have the gears welded up and repaired or new ones made.....the gears are normally under quite a bit of pressure, and some people lock them to the shaft to use them as a brake when unscrewing the chuck, which can result in the teeth getting knocked off.....very bad practice.They also get damaged when the back gear is left engaged with the spindle pin locked up, and this is instant gear tooth stripping.The gears are probably made from cast iron, so welding them up and recutting the teeth is a very particular job.....straight cut gears are a piece of cake and anyone with a good file can "recut" or reform the gear teeth after rewelding......helical gears need to be recut on a gear cutting machine.I recut some pegged and brazed up straight cut gears for a mate using the lathe with a tool set on it's side in a boring bar, and hand planed them with the saddle drive wheel.....similar to cutting a keyway.If'n all else fails and spare parts are totally not available anywhere....... drastic as it may seem.....I would strip the main spindle out, remove the two helical gears and replace them with off the shelf straight cut gears, and with a matching set of straight cut gears for the back gear mechanism......this is a relatively simple fixit operation.You might get lucky and find out with whom the previous owner left the missing back gear set, but if'n they're damaged you will be in the same boat.The design of this lathe headstock is using 100 year old technology, and the use of helical gears in the back gear shows that they know little of lathe design or maintenance.BTW, the quick change tool post you have appears to be the piston plunger type, really crap design, where the plunger pushes out to force the tool holder to lock against the Vee's....not very sturdy and prone to lack of accurate allignment.....the wedge locking type is better in this quarter, made by Aloris I think.Ian.