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Hi all,We are looking at getting our first MIG. I used a MIG once in a welding course about 7 years ago. It was actually a course on stick welding, but those of us that were done our test early (and passed) got to try MIG.(Remember - I am from Canada, so these prices may be a little off for the US folks.)Anyways, first I looked at the Lincoln SP-180T vs. the Millermatic 180 Auto-Set:Similar in most respects. The Lincoln is priced at $857 at WeldersSupply, $780 at Canadian Tire. The Miller is $915 at WeldersSupply. The sales guy at WeldersSupply said that the Lincoln had a slightly better drive system, otherwise pretty similar. True/False??? The downside I see to these units is the lower max Amps and the lower duty cycle which lead me to......The Lincoln Power Mig 216 vs. the Millermatic 212 Auto-Set:Again, the two are comparable. When I phoned WeldersSupply, the sales guy said that they had a couple of 216's left from a show and I can have the show price of $1678 (reg. $1749) or he has a new 215 left over also for $1678. The Miller 212 is $1785. Again, he says the Lincoln has a better feed.I'm leaning towards the Lincoln 215/216 or Miller 212 for the higher amps and duty cycle. Also, being essentially new to MIG, I like the idea of the Auto-Set feature. Mostly I'm welding mild steel, may want to get into Aluminum or Stainless down the road, but that's not a priority.So here it is:Lincoln 215 - $1678Lincoln 216 - $1678 ($1749 reg.)Miller 212 - $1785They are all within $100, which is not a big deal. Might as well say they are the same price. Which welder should I get?Andrew
Reply:r these the two u r talking about..? Attached Images thermal arc 252i - millermatic 350P - miller XMT, cp300ts, 30a 22a feeders, buttload of other millers, handfull of lincolns, couple of esabs - Hypertherm 1250 G3
Reply:man , i love lincoln-but what's the AUTO SET feature..? of the miller thermal arc 252i - millermatic 350P - miller XMT, cp300ts, 30a 22a feeders, buttload of other millers, handfull of lincolns, couple of esabs - Hypertherm 1250 G3
Reply:From the PM 215 they went to the PM 215XT. The XT added the spool gun switch as part of the standard package and a Nascar sticker .. From the PM 215XT they real quick like went to the PM 216. From what little I can tell the PM 216 moved the on-off switch up high where it should be, added the cable and gun holder, a couple of beer can holders and you lose the one side storage area. Oh and you still get the Nascar sticker. Tapped voltage control. Sweet machines tho. With the prices you list I don't know why a guy would buy backwards to the PM 215. Don't know nuthin about the MM 212. Looks like continuous voltage? If the price is equal you'd probably like either machine equally. I doubt the autoset is a real factor but I suppose it's possible with any modern technology that has a board and chip room so why not.Dealers for any given are are what they are but I'm thinking they are sticking you with about an extra $100.00 on both machines.
Reply:Originally Posted by woi2ldman , i love lincoln-but what's the AUTO SET feature..? of the miller
Reply:Originally Posted by woi2ldr these the two u r talking about..?
Reply:Originally Posted by SandyWith the prices you list I don't know why a guy would buy backwards to the PM 215.
Reply:I don't have one of the newer autoset Miller machines, but I have played with them a bit. It's not a bad feature for those that don't really weld frequently to get close to the needed settings. You can still set manually if you want. I see it more for the hobby guys, or the maintenance guy who needs to weld, but might only do it a few times a year, or a shop where most guys aren't really welders, but there may be one or two that know their stuff.To me they are both very close and either would probably be fine. I'm a big Miller person. Not because of brand loyalty so much, but because of the local support network I've got. My LWS carries both Miller and Lincoln, but most of the stock parts are Miller. I asked about this once and was told thats mostly because the shops/schools in the are use Miller and they sell almost 7 to 1 over the Lincolns. I've got 6 friends all with Millers in their shops. If push comes to shove and I need a part NOW on a Sunday in an emergency, chances are a few calls and I can get the part I need or even a temporary replacement feeder and be back up and running. I'd have issues if I had a Lincoln around here. If you are in a remote place, and the machine makes you money and is critical to your work, I'd look long and hard at what support network there is to back up each brand. I'd be screwed if I moved to someplace where Lincoln was king and absolutely needed something on short notice. I'm thinking about more than just tips and nozzles, but liners, feed rollers, gun switches, add on's like the spoolgun etc. It's nice to have the luxury to order what you need, but when that client walks in and is willing to pay big bucks to fix this NOW!, you don't have an option of ordering a spoolgun and waiting 3 days. You can run down, grab what you need local, and get that job done and pay for that new toy. That or you loose the job because you find your liners kinked and the local shop doesn't carry one for your machine...No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:Originally Posted by Andrew_DI had read somewhere on here that a few thought the 215 to be a better machine than the 216. Comments??
Reply:Well, I've got more prices and info...First a thought - the Lincoln 216 can go up to 250 Amps. The Miller is only 210 Amps. That might be a deal breaker if everything else is the same.Dealer #1 (The dealer listed in my original post.):Lincoln 215 - $1678Lincoln 216 - $1678 ($1749 reg.)Miller 212 - $1785Dealer #2:Miller 212 - $1804Dealer #3:Lincoln 216 - $1699Miller 212 - $1699either one delivered, set-up, free fill of 75/25 AR/CO2 gas ($125-140 value. Jjust need to lease the cylinder.)Dealer #4:Hasn't phoned back yet. Why he couldn't give me an immediate price like the other guys, I don't know. Maybe he's sharpening his pencil?????I'm leaning towards dealer #3 for the better deal, but now both welders are the same price!!! The advantage I see for the Lincoln is the higher amps. The Miller has the Auto-Set, but maybe that's not as important as initially thought. Also, most of the sales guys think that the Lincoln has a better drive system. All these dealers are about 45 minute drive away, so parts shouldn't be too much of a problem.Andrew
Reply:I, or nobody else here, can make the decision for you. However, just a couple observations. Tapped vs. continuous voltage control --- not important. Simply set the voltage on a tapped machine, dial in the wire speed to match. Arguably, the best mig machine ever made, the old MM200 (a 250 amp class machine), was a tapped machine.Auto-set. Not important. Once you have a few hours on a machine, should be easy to dial in volts and wire speed, to fit whatever you are doing, considering gas mix, position, and material. Duty cycle .... is it really important to you??? Remember, it varies according to the amps you are using, if you are welding mostly sheet metal, you are generally nowhere near the max power, and duty cycles rise as you drop the amperage. Unless you are doing a lot of hardfacing, build-up, or pre-tacked production work, at high amps, duty cycle isn't really a factor. Also depends on temperature,,,, I think they are rated at 100 degrees or so, if the air temp is 80 degrees F. , duty cycle will be somewhat more than listed.Don't discount the Hobart line either ....
Reply:I was going to point out earlier what jsfab just did about the duty cycle, but I am by no means anywhere near qualified to give helpful advice; however, since several people have offered relevant advice I figured I could step in and point out what I noticed . . . According the literature, the Lincoln has a slightly higher duty cycle, which I would assume appeals to you since you passed on the other models due to lower duty cycle. I've never used either machine and the only MIG I've used so far is a MM200, so take what I say with a grain of salt.Good luck and I hope you're happy with which ever one you choose.MikeConstans Fides et IntegritasLincoln Weldanpower 150 ACAirco Aircomatic MIGet CAV II w/ spoolgunMillermatic 30a wirefeeder
Reply:I was looking at both these and reading in this welding forum about the lincoln 250amp claim. You really don't have anything for duty cycle up that high and the duty cycle for both machines at 160amps and around 210amps are the same. If you want the 250amps you need to step up to a bigger machine. The miller will give you 250amps also but it won't do 1/2" just like the lincoln one won't. I bought the mm212 but the older tap version not the auto select one and i love it. Miller has the best customer service in my opinion. This is my third different miller in 2yrs and i'm just a beginner welder and i can call them and they answer any question no matter how stupid.
Reply:I haven't used the Miller but I can vouch for the 215 as a great machine as it was the only one we used while building out the welding school for Local 72. We had that thing going every day without a hiccup ( we even fabbed steel partitions for the bathroom stalls) LOL
Reply:Ok,I will solve the dilemma. Just buy Lincoln. Who cares which one is better? Red is faster than Blue. heheheLincoln Power Mig 210MP MIGLincoln Power Mig 350MP - MIG and Push-PullLincoln TIG 300-300Lincoln Hobby-Weld 110v Thanks JLAMESCK TIG TORCH, gas diffuser, pyrex cupThermal Dynamics Cutmaster 101My brain
Reply:Dealer #3Blue or Red- either one will be a good choice.Ed Conleyhttp://www.screamingbroccoli.com/MM252MM211 (Sold)Passport Plus & Spool gunLincoln SP135 Plus- (Gone to a good home)Klutch 120v Plasma cutterSO 2020 benderBeer in the fridge
Reply:Originally Posted by woi2ldr these the two u r talking about..?
Reply:Originally Posted by DSWI don't have one of the newer autoset Miller machines, but I have played with them a bit. It's not a bad feature for those that don't really weld frequently to get close to the needed settings. You can still set manually if you want. I see it more for the hobby guys, or the maintenance guy who needs to weld, but might only do it a few times a year, or a shop where most guys aren't really welders, but there may be one or two that know their stuff.To me they are both very close and either would probably be fine. I'm a big Miller person. Not because of brand loyalty so much, but because of the local support network I've got. My LWS carries both Miller and Lincoln, but most of the stock parts are Miller. I asked about this once and was told thats mostly because the shops/schools in the are use Miller and they sell almost 7 to 1 over the Lincolns. I've got 6 friends all with Millers in their shops. If push comes to shove and I need a part NOW on a Sunday in an emergency, chances are a few calls and I can get the part I need or even a temporary replacement feeder and be back up and running. I'd have issues if I had a Lincoln around here. If you are in a remote place, and the machine makes you money and is critical to your work, I'd look long and hard at what support network there is to back up each brand. I'd be screwed if I moved to someplace where Lincoln was king and absolutely needed something on short notice. I'm thinking about more than just tips and nozzles, but liners, feed rollers, gun switches, add on's like the spoolgun etc. It's nice to have the luxury to order what you need, but when that client walks in and is willing to pay big bucks to fix this NOW!, you don't have an option of ordering a spoolgun and waiting 3 days. You can run down, grab what you need local, and get that job done and pay for that new toy. That or you loose the job because you find your liners kinked and the local shop doesn't carry one for your machine..
Reply:Well it has been decided....After reading over all the comments here and talking to a couple of local guys, we've decided to go with the Lincoln 216. The sales guy is delivering it Monday.Thanks,Andrew
Reply:Awesome, keep us updated!MikeConstans Fides et IntegritasLincoln Weldanpower 150 ACAirco Aircomatic MIGet CAV II w/ spoolgunMillermatic 30a wirefeeder
Reply:Congrats on the lincoln,its a shame though that your going to have that little voice in your head saying "i should have bought the miller" FelonCaution lurker lives here" hmmm That is serious,pass the ganja and pick up a 24 of MGD"
Reply:Naw, that little voice will be saying "I am glad I bought the Lincoln and not the Miller". Congrads on the purchase!A few of my toys !LinuxMintManjaroMiller Roughneck 2E Lincoln WeldPak 100HTP MTS 160 Chicago Electric 80amp Inverter Victor O/A
Reply:Originally Posted by Felonyass MonkCongrats on the lincoln,its a shame though that your going to have that little voice in your head saying "i should have bought the miller" Felon
Reply:Don't we always wish we could have gotten the next bigger better model? Although, sometimes waiting and saving to buy the better model might delay the earnings you could be making with the cheaper model. Lincoln Power Mig 210MP MIGLincoln Power Mig 350MP - MIG and Push-PullLincoln TIG 300-300Lincoln Hobby-Weld 110v Thanks JLAMESCK TIG TORCH, gas diffuser, pyrex cupThermal Dynamics Cutmaster 101My brain
Reply:Well, this will be used mainly for repair/maintenance around the farm, so it'll work pretty good while we learn how to weld with wire. AndrewI tender to prefer Miller machines. One reason I like Miller is that they supply parts for a longer period of time then Lincoln.That being said, in my garage sit 3 Lincolns, and no Millers! What can I say, good deals on used Lincoln machines just come my way, and I can't say no. Really, both are very good machines, and are a great value. As long as both machines have all the features you need, they are really the same. Some models here or there may have features the other doesn't.Some of the heated arguments I see online are really pointless. I think sometimes, in the end, it comes down to what color paint you like better. (I've never been a fan of the color red... unless, of course, it's on a Ferrai!)(Edit: I've used Miller machines on the job, never used a Lincoln on the job.)Last edited by moya034; 02-07-2010 at 10:34 PM.Lincoln Idealarc 250Lincoln Weldanpower CC/CV engine driveLincoln LN-25 wire feederMiller Syncrowave 180 SDVarious oxy-fuel setups featuring Victor, Harris, and Prest-o-lite products
Reply:Originally Posted by Andrew_DWell, this will be used mainly for repair/maintenance around the farm, so it'll work pretty good while we learn how to weld with wire. Andrew
Reply:I find it telling that the OP decided to post the thread here in Lincoln. There is a Manufacturer Product Forum for Miller too. The OP went for the Lincoln welder in the end.http://www.facebook.com/groups/sa200weldersCurrent machines:Hobart G600 Powered by 1967 Chrysler LH-318 (Project)Hobart GF-250(Traded)68 Redface81 Blackface |
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发表于 2021-8-31 22:15:58