Job Pricing ???

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Looking at bidding a job and need some advice. A local rental company has a pickup with an aluminum bed. The sides on this bed fold down. The skin (which looks like .080) has broke welds that are broke from the tube frame. What is involved is re-welding the broken welds their are roughly 25 welds at about 2 inches long......easy access to work and the aluminum is pretty clean. Any idea what to charge?
Reply:Well repairs are tricky to price. This sounds like a T&M job(time and material). The way I tend to do it is itemize and when confronted about price, read it.1. Time estimated to prep(Remove paint and dirt), set up for welding. 2. Time estimated to straighten and restrain. This may vary per location.3. Time to perform each weld.4. Time to inspect when done.Weld like a "WELDOR", not a wel-"DERR" MillerDynasty700DX,Dynasty350DX4ea,Dynasty200DX,Li  ncolnSW200-2ea.,MillerMatic350P,MillerMatic200w/spoolgun,MKCobraMig260,Lincoln SP-170T,PlasmaCam/Hypertherm1250,HFProTig2ea,MigMax1ea.
Reply:Originally Posted by shovelonWell repairs are tricky to price. This sounds like a T&M job(time and material). The way I tend to do it is itemize and when confronted about price, read it.1. Time estimated to prep(Remove paint and dirt), set up for welding. 2. Time estimated to straighten and restrain. This may vary per location.3. Time to perform each weld.4. Time to inspect when done.
Reply:Price it, at the price you want.Nothing more, nothing less.Don't ask guys who get $100 an hour shop rate, plus materials. (Not me fyi)Just a couple welders, big hammers, grinders, and torches.Work will free you.Men in dirty jeans built this country, while men in clean suits have destroyed it. Trump/Carson 2016-2024
Reply:Originally Posted by weldermikeDon't forget Happy Hour and your cheeseburger deluxe as well. After that, then your done.
Reply:Thought you boys over the pond like it large??
Reply:Originally Posted by rahtreelimbsLooking at bidding a job and need some advice. A local rental company has a pickup with an aluminum bed. The sides on this bed fold down. The skin (which looks like .080) has broke welds that are broke from the tube frame. What is involved is re-welding the broken welds their are roughly 25 welds at about 2 inches long......easy access to work and the aluminum is pretty clean. Any idea what to charge?
Reply:It don't matter if you are a carpenter, welder, electrician or painter, be it in shop work or outside......Always figure it first based on time and materials....Many trades base their final fee on 3 times materials cost...Where if you use 100 bucks in materials, you charge 300 bucks.If you travel to job, figure your time and transportation costs to get there and back. If you do it in shop, then add what is costs you to open your doors every work day including taxes and utilities and upkeep.No matter how you figure it, you will someday discover that all you are doing is keeping everyone else in business where you, the tradesman absorb losses, not them....Yup, you first pay the materials supplier, the gas pump owner, the electric company, the taxman, the finance company, the ex wife and the insurance man all their fixed prices, where only you absorb any losses....And all those other guys care less if you make a buck off them because they already made their buck off you because you had no choice but to use them.The option is to work by the hour for the other guy and let him be the one that profits or looses when stuff rubberbands.Last edited by wornoutoldwelder; 03-15-2015 at 07:10 AM.
Reply:I have a good idea on estimates for new metal projects, repairs are always tricky to estimate. I'll always give a high estimate so that if I get the project they're pleasantly surprised when I bill them less than the estimate (I'll double my time for the estimate) or they give the job to someone who welds for a living who can give them a more realistic estimate. People know I'm not cheap, but they seem to some anyway.Lincoln Precision Tig 185Lincoln Power Mig 256Hypertherm PM 45Everlast 140STSmith O/A
Reply:When charging time and materials, there is only ONE opportunity to increase your take home pay, and that is TIME.Those guys that drive the Snap-On and Mac tools trucks got started by offering innovative tools that saved mechanics TIME when working jobs where every job that rolled in was based on flat rate manual plus retail on parts they bought wholesale and shop overhead....All every flat rate manual did was describe how long it took to replace most parts on any car, and shop owners then charged a fixed labor fee per hour.   Where if he could do a job in half the time stated in flat rate manual, then he could by law charge full labor time based on flat rate manual, then eat good that night and could move on sooner to next broke dick car sitting outside where he might once again find a way to get er done faster than stated in flat rate manual.Same still goes.....Experience will teach you how to do stuff quicker where you still charge labor at accepted slower rates...sometimes certain tools will also cut the time required to do it...But you got no control over materials cost unless you live in a scrap yard.Last edited by wornoutoldwelder; 03-15-2015 at 08:13 AM.
Reply:When you turn on the lights and swing open your shop doors every morning, there ain't no telling what sorta bimbo gonna stroll in wanting you to do whatever for him. Some will state what they need, ask what it will cost, then leave it to you to source materials and simply return to pick it up and pay...While others will return with their own materials already cut to size or dug out of scrap pile and expect you to cut your fees because they littered your shop with their materials they bought cheap or dug up somewhere thinking a rusty piece of almost is good nuff and they ain't got a clue nor wanna pay you to clean it up and attempt to make it work.If you got a road rig you will often discover same only after you burn gas and time getting there....how do you charge for all that?....you don't. You just suck it up and write those same checks every month like always to keep the lights on and doors open and ex wife out of court and insurance inforce and taxman in diapers, condoms and buttplugs. and materials guys still willing to deliver free, and hope next month is better and you got nuff in freezer, and aliens finally invade and abduct just the idiots because they study idiots or desire to eliminate them from the universe.Last edited by wornoutoldwelder; 03-15-2015 at 08:24 AM.
Reply:I hope for the aliens vs idiots. That's good stuff. I charge 20 an hour plus materials, whatever they may be.Powcon 300st (my favorite)Miller Goldstar 600ssLincoln Idealarc 400/400Miller 12vs2 LN25'sMiller Deltaweld 302Miller Bobcat 250 G EFIMiller Bobcat 225d Plus (Dropped a valve, up soon)Everlast 255ext (ordering soon!)
Reply:Originally Posted by stevenopolisI hope for the aliens vs idiots. That's good stuff. I charge 20 an hour plus materials, whatever they may be.
Reply:I moonlight after work in the shop. I have my own machines but use their power/space because they like me. I also have a point to prove, the other welders that charge over 100 an hour to sit around and drink coffee  and bs need a reality check.Powcon 300st (my favorite)Miller Goldstar 600ssLincoln Idealarc 400/400Miller 12vs2 LN25'sMiller Deltaweld 302Miller Bobcat 250 G EFIMiller Bobcat 225d Plus (Dropped a valve, up soon)Everlast 255ext (ordering soon!)
Reply:Originally Posted by stevenopolis I also have a point to prove, the other welders that charge over 100 an hour to sit around and drink coffee  and bs need a reality check.
Reply:Originally Posted by Firemanmike69$20/hr seems way low. For me $20/hr is me coming to your shop to use your welder to weld together materials you bought
Reply:I'm a small time operator. I charge 150 bucks for the first hour and a reduced amount for the next hour. I'm not going to hook up my trailer and drive out to their location for anything less. If I have to acquire material then there is a deposit that covers material cost. I will not be on the hook for the bill.JimJim,I don't mean to be argumentative and cantankerous,but I am getting older and a bit crotchety!Addendum; AND CRANKY
Reply:Originally Posted by stevenopolisI moonlight after work in the shop. I have my own machines but use their power/space because they like me. I also have a point to prove, the other welders that charge over 100 an hour to sit around and drink coffee  and bs need a reality check.
Reply:The one guy in particular, the 110 an hour guy, that was hired by us to build a jacketed pump skid, that couldn't do the job at hand with out me fitting up the pipe and angles, and arguing why I needed hot oil jacketing, when I needed to be on the other side of this rock for another job but couldn't leave the welder fabricator guys side, and cheated us on hours, yeah that's a fair price. He pissed me off.Powcon 300st (my favorite)Miller Goldstar 600ssLincoln Idealarc 400/400Miller 12vs2 LN25'sMiller Deltaweld 302Miller Bobcat 250 G EFIMiller Bobcat 225d Plus (Dropped a valve, up soon)Everlast 255ext (ordering soon!)
Reply:20 an hour, my machine, My gas, my consumables. Their power and space. I do maybe two or three small jobs on the side on Sundays a month. The occasional aircraft part shows up as well.Powcon 300st (my favorite)Miller Goldstar 600ssLincoln Idealarc 400/400Miller 12vs2 LN25'sMiller Deltaweld 302Miller Bobcat 250 G EFIMiller Bobcat 225d Plus (Dropped a valve, up soon)Everlast 255ext (ordering soon!)
Reply:Originally Posted by welditforyouI'm a small time operator. I charge 150 bucks for the first hour and a reduced amount for the next hour. I'm not going to hook up my trailer and drive out to their location for anything less. If I have to acquire material then there is a deposit that covers material cost. I will not be on the hook for the bill.Jim
Reply:I usually clear 70+ hours a week on a 40 hour salary, so no one cares what I do with my spare time. I do not do anything critical, ie frame welding, or structural, just odds and ends.Powcon 300st (my favorite)Miller Goldstar 600ssLincoln Idealarc 400/400Miller 12vs2 LN25'sMiller Deltaweld 302Miller Bobcat 250 G EFIMiller Bobcat 225d Plus (Dropped a valve, up soon)Everlast 255ext (ordering soon!)
Reply:I guess I'm out of touch with reality when I can't understand why 100 an hour for welding plus materials is justifiable.Powcon 300st (my favorite)Miller Goldstar 600ssLincoln Idealarc 400/400Miller 12vs2 LN25'sMiller Deltaweld 302Miller Bobcat 250 G EFIMiller Bobcat 225d Plus (Dropped a valve, up soon)Everlast 255ext (ordering soon!)
Reply:300 cash a day. their machine, materials and rods.i.u.o.e. # 15queens, ny and sunny fla
Reply:Originally Posted by Firemanmike69Bingo. Do you charge for travel time?Originally Posted by stevenopolisI guess I'm out of touch with reality when I can't understand why 100 an hour for welding plus materials is justifiable.
Reply:Originally Posted by docwelder300 cash a day. their machine, materials and rods.
Reply:Originally Posted by stevenopolis20 an hour, my machine, My gas, my consumables. Their power and space. I do maybe two or three small jobs on the side on Sundays a month. The occasional aircraft part shows up as well.
Reply:@ rahtreelimbs - lots of salient advice above.  Consider.  Before you even provide a quote or strike an arc, determine your realistic shop rate AND mobile rate.  These rates should be different.  Unquestionably.  Pencil and paper to arrive at your rates.  Decomposed, the total cost to a client should be the summation of your labor rate, overhead costs, and profit margin.  You establish your labor rates and do not deviate from these numbers, irrespective of the prospective client.  Time is trump.  Always.  Our shop and mobile rates were 'arrived at' only after accounting for all costs, determining profit margins, and sizing up the competition.  Small business labor rates of $75-100 (shop) and $125-150 (mobile) are common in our locale.  A factor in determining both rates is to ascertain your annual "duty cycle".  That is the typical percentage out of 2080hrs you expect to be "on the clock".Remember you are in business to capture and sustain capital $.  Zero profit will not grow your business.Last edited by ManoKai; 03-15-2015 at 02:15 PM."Discovery is to see what everybody else has seen, and to think what nobody else has thought" - Albert Szent-Gyorgyi