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So here it isSeveral people asked for a post of how to fabricate a railing start to finishSo I'll show you step by step how I did these two railings, along with some pretty pictures.Any questions, ask away,Any criticism, just shut up, just kidding.This is how I do it, I've done probably into the 1000s of linear feet, I've never counted.So I start with some measurements like thishttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...d4f96d3554.jpgThis is what I was saying before. You don't need a scaled drawing, you don't even need graphpaper really, you just need a couple points of reference, I measure the top landing, starting from the house, to the top nosing. Then I measure the horizontal and vertical to the bottom nosing,I repeat, the bottom nosing, NOT the ground,You don't need to measure the angle, you can figure that out using a handy dandy construction calculator, or a triangle calculator online, it's way more accurate.So then you take those references and transfer them to your table. You can see the soapstone marks I made, denoting the top landing, and in this case it only has one step.Connect the bottom and top nose with a line, this is good to measure to. https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...24e803b06d.jpgA very important point here, a residential gaurdail needs to be 36" minimum off the walking surface, I make my panels 34" tall, and leave a 2"gap, with the thickness of the caprail it usually comes out to 36.5"So, you can do 2 things, that white line can indicate the surface of the step, or it can indicate where you're going to place your bottom rail.Either way, same result, if it indicates the surface of the step, then you measure up from the line 2" and clamp your bottom rail, in this case I'm using 1x1/2x1/8 channel , that's 90% of the rails I do, and 90% of the rails I see out in the world.Now, I core drill most of my rails, I allow for 4" of post to go into the stone or concrete. So when you cut your posts, allow for that.I leave 2" from the house to the 1st post of the railing, that's my preference. Please don't use hollow 1x1 tubing, it rots out, always. You guys who are seasoned fabricators can skip most of this, this is aimed at people who've never done this before, or wmat to do it a tried and tested way.I leave 2" gap from the house to the railing, that's my preference.Last edited by MetalMan23; 06-14-2020 at 10:27 PM. http://www.philswelding.com
Reply:Clamp your posts, cut your channel, in this case I didn't bother to punch them, I just welded the pickets in between the channels,Make sure the posts are parallel, weld, sand the welds downhttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...0681c4e292.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...0b9949e369.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...9119fbb526.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...03a1a08a07.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...b2e9448cd8.jpgYour top rail of the railing needs to be parallel to the surface, and only start going down the stairs once it reaches the point DIRECTLY over the top nosing, so, if you have a post at the top of the step, your rail will have to continue level, until it reaches the point directly over the top nosing, and then angle down towards the bottom. This is very important in order to maintain proper guardrail height going down the stairs, I've seen many many rails that are 36" on the landing, but more like 30" or 32" high on the stairs part of the rail. This is wrong. It's not to code, don't ever do that or I'll be upset. https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...764954c15c.jpgLook at this example, not my work, it's wrong, sure it looks nice, but if the landing is at the proper height, then the stairs most certainly are not, again, please don't do this. The top of the railing needs to measure 36" high measuring up from the nosing of the steps. So all the rails, (in this case this railing has 3, usually they have 2) will be parallel to each other, basically all cut the same size. Sent from my moto g power using TapatalkLast edited by MetalMan23; 06-14-2020 at 10:39 PM. http://www.philswelding.com
Reply:You'll see the spacers for the pickets, the posts and channel are 1" so the 1/2" pickets have to get raised up 1/4" to be centered https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...6c05244f01.jpgSent from my moto g power using Tapatalk http://www.philswelding.com
Reply:For picket spacing, get a construction calculator that can convert, to fractions, your life will be easyJust keep adding the decimal and it keeps converting it to the nearest fractionhttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...b99ac548a9.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...6718b30e54.jpgSent from my moto g power using Tapatalk http://www.philswelding.com
Reply:Lambs tongue time. I measure 3.5 and 7", taper the point to the 3.5, cut, sand down sharp edges, then throw on the bender, yes it's from HF,Bend the bottom curve first, flip over and finish the bend, centered on the 7" mark.https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...1a6b68c9ce.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...d9c44b149f.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...7a65c8753f.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...27344b3d46.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...c0830ae71f.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...91bfaee662.jpgSent from my moto g power using Tapatalk http://www.philswelding.com
Reply:Clamp on and weld,Grind the profile in the joint going down the angle, or bend it, if you feel like it. https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...0646df67cd.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...41e602c2ac.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...4867742c37.jpgSent from my moto g power using Tapatalk http://www.philswelding.com
Reply:Paint, core drill, level and plumb the railing, and pour anchoring cement, good to go, happy customer.https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...868600371f.jpgSent from my moto g power using Tapatalk http://www.philswelding.com
Reply:More tomorrow, I have another railing I'll walk you through Sent from my moto g power using Tapatalk http://www.philswelding.com
Reply:Thanks for the education. What did the customer pay for this fine job? Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Reply:Hey MetalMan,Thank you so much for this. I cant wait for the next lesson. (I wish we had more threads like this one.)I have built several simple residential handrails and have figured some of this by trial and error. I definitely picked up some good tips. To clarify, you use 1 solid for the posts instead of tube? Is that because you core drill and epoxy? I dont have a core drill so use plates with tube for posts. Also, I thought the rail had to extend past the bottom step. It appears yours stops at the nose of the bottom step. Please comment. Also, i believe your picket spacing is more than 4. Is that because the height off the ground is less than 30 and doesnt have to meet that requirement?My biggest problem is grinding the top rail molded pieces to lambs tongue or 90* cast pieces. Any tips, suggestions, or examples of how to blend better would be much appreciated. Mine never look completely seamless. Ill be following this thread!Last edited by wb4rt; 06-16-2020 at 09:34 AM.Burt _____________________Miller Syncrowave 250Millermatic 211Miller 375 Plasma Cutter Hobart Handler 12010FtDrillBit.com
Reply:Don't use the cast pieces, the profile never matches, with the harbor freight bender, I just showed you how to make your own Lambs tongues, way cheaper, and better lookingI'd use 1" solid no matter what, it'll never rust out,What's happens is condensation builds up in the tube, then freezes, and bursts the tube open, Sent from my moto g power using Tapatalk http://www.philswelding.com
Reply:I’ll practice on the lambs tongue. I’m sure it would look better. On a couple that needed to be done cheaper I just rounded the end of the rail cap and it looked pretty good. They were happy with it that way.How do you do 90*? Just miter?We have very few days of freezing weather but I’ll see about using solid next time. Would be heavier, not sure how much more $. I have some rails about 8 years old with no problem. I keep thinking a used core drill might be a good investment if I had more orders. What product do you use to epoxy it?Burt _____________________Miller Syncrowave 250Millermatic 211Miller 375 Plasma Cutter Hobart Handler 12010FtDrillBit.com
Reply:Great post. Maybe it is my phone but you lost me on the chalk lines in the first pic of your table. I cannot see the steps. Also I guess I am not understanding what the nose exactly is. Cause what you say "don't do this", it looks like you did what you said "don't do this". It looks like you started your fall or drop early. Again, maybe I don't know exactly where the end of the nose is. That large gap need something other than open air. Maybe a vine looking cutout or something.www.tjsperformance.comDynasty 300 DXHTP 240HTP Microcut 380Hyperthem 85JD2 Hyd Bender and HF Hyd Ring Roller all in one =(Frankenbender)Bpt. Mill/DRO4' x 8' CNC Plasma TableInstagram: tjsperformanceYT: TJS Welding and Fabrication
Reply:Originally Posted by TJSGreat post. Maybe it is my phone but you lost me on the chalk lines in the first pic of your table. I cannot see the steps. Also I guess I am not understanding what the nose exactly is. Cause what you say "don't do this", it looks like you did what you said "don't do this". It looks like you started your fall or drop early. Again, maybe I don't know exactly where the end of the nose is. That large gap need something other than open air. Maybe a vine looking cutout or something.
Reply:Originally Posted by MetalMan23I took a picture from the web to show an example of what not to do,The stair nose is just the corner of the step, Sent from my moto g power using Tapatalk
Reply:That's perspective deceiving your eyes Sent from my moto g power using Tapatalk http://www.philswelding.com
Reply:I thought so.www.tjsperformance.comDynasty 300 DXHTP 240HTP Microcut 380Hyperthem 85JD2 Hyd Bender and HF Hyd Ring Roller all in one =(Frankenbender)Bpt. Mill/DRO4' x 8' CNC Plasma TableInstagram: tjsperformanceYT: TJS Welding and Fabrication
Reply:The only thing I do differently is I "V" notch the top rail and "U" channels and bend them rather than cut them. This saves a lot of time and grinding. And it looks good too. I just put a small weld on the then closed "V" notch. Sincerely, William McCormickIf I wasn't so.....crazy, I wouldn't try to act normal, and you would be afraid.
Reply:I noticed one other thing I do differently. I split the railing for the lambs tongue and run a pass to rejoin it. I learned to do this from my boss Ray, when I was making rails in Queens and Brooklyn, that is how they do it there. On really nice jobs I fill the backs of the handrail as well. Sincerely, William McCormickIf I wasn't so.....crazy, I wouldn't try to act normal, and you would be afraid.
Reply:I'll split the Lambs tongue as well on nice jobs, but most of the time I just cut it, Sent from my moto g power using Tapatalk http://www.philswelding.com
Reply:Originally Posted by MetalMan23Clamp on and weld,Grind the profile in the joint going down the angle, or bend it, if you feel like it. https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...0646df67cd.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...41e602c2ac.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...4867742c37.jpgSent from my moto g power using Tapatalk
Reply:This is a great thread, obviously i have an interest in handrails. I should have seen this before I proceeded, but we were trying to use avail stock and keep it simple. Anyway thought i would post and say thanks to Phil. It is comforting to see a young man display enthusiasm and a willingness to work, not so common anymore.GeezerPower Mig 255C185 TIGBlue 175 MIGRanger 8 Kohler 20HP1974 5K Lincoln/Wisconsin Powered (Cherry)Victor/Harris O/AK 487 Spool Gun
Reply:Originally Posted by TJSGreat post. Maybe it is my phone but you lost me on the chalk lines in the first pic of your table. I cannot see the steps. Also I guess I am not understanding what the nose exactly is. Cause what you say "don't do this", it looks like you did what you said "don't do this". It looks like you started your fall or drop early. Again, maybe I don't know exactly where the end of the nose is. That large gap need something other than open air. Maybe a vine looking cutout or something.
Reply:Hey Phil,Looks like I have a railing job coming up. I want to make my own lamb’s tongue as you describe in post #5. Could you tell me what size dies you use for each bend?Thanks, and I hope you will continue this very interesting instruction thread!Burt _____________________Miller Syncrowave 250Millermatic 211Miller 375 Plasma Cutter Hobart Handler 12010FtDrillBit.com
Reply:For the pointy end I use a smaller die, like 1" or 1.5, and for the other bend I use something like a 2.5, recently I've started bending the pointy end first, and then the upper curve and it works better. Sent from my moto g power using Tapatalk http://www.philswelding.comOK, dont laugh too much but here is my first attempt at a lambs tongue. I think I bent the big loop a little too much. Burt _____________________Miller Syncrowave 250Millermatic 211Miller 375 Plasma Cutter Hobart Handler 12010FtDrillBit.com
Reply:Perfect Sent from my moto g power using Tapatalk http://www.philswelding.com
Reply:Originally Posted by wb4rtOK, dont laugh too much but here is my first attempt at a lambs tongue. I think I bent the big loop a little too much.
Reply:Originally Posted by wb4rtOK, don’t laugh too much but here is my first attempt at a lamb’s tongue. I think I bent the big loop a little too much.
Reply:Hey Geezer,Yep a few candles on the cake but my only able-bodied friend is 82 and I’m a bit younger than him. Almost everyone my age has a bad back or heart or something so I have to call Bob when I need a hand. Per Phil’s post #25, I used a 1 1/4” with a 1 1/2” die for the small loop on the end. I used a 2 1/2” for the larger loop. My 1” die is missing or I would have used it with the 1 1/4”. I think it would look a little better.Burt _____________________Miller Syncrowave 250Millermatic 211Miller 375 Plasma Cutter Hobart Handler 12010FtDrillBit.com
Reply:Thanks Burt, may I ask: what type bender you have? assume you are bending 1 15/16" cap?? I imagine the 1 3/4" would bend easy also assuming large enough throat on the bender.thanks, i sure enjoy this thread. I have several feet of handrail to buildGeezerPower Mig 255C185 TIGBlue 175 MIGRanger 8 Kohler 20HP1974 5K Lincoln/Wisconsin Powered (Cherry)Victor/Harris O/AK 487 Spool Gun
Reply:post 31 should read 2 1/4" versus 1 3/4". Couldn't get edit feature to cooperateGeezerPower Mig 255C185 TIGBlue 175 MIGRanger 8 Kohler 20HP1974 5K Lincoln/Wisconsin Powered (Cherry)Victor/Harris O/AK 487 Spool Gun
Reply:Sorry Geezer, I had that in my first reply but it got erased before I posted it. I think it is a Harbor Freight bender. I bought it off Craig’s List 5-6 years ago. They are all pretty much the same I think. HF has it for less than $90 but they may be hard to find. They told me they are supposed to get some in August. You should try Northern Tools also. They seem to be better stocked. I’m using 1 5/8” cap I think.Burt _____________________Miller Syncrowave 250Millermatic 211Miller 375 Plasma Cutter Hobart Handler 12010FtDrillBit.com
Reply:Originally Posted by wb4rtSorry Geezer, I had that in my first reply but it got erased before I posted it. I think it is a Harbor Freight bender. I bought it off Craig’s List 5-6 years ago. They are all pretty much the same I think. HF has it for less than $90 but they may be hard to find. They told me they are supposed to get some in August. You should try Northern Tools also. They seem to be better stocked. I’m using 1 5/8” cap I think.
Reply:Geezer. PM sent.Burt _____________________Miller Syncrowave 250Millermatic 211Miller 375 Plasma Cutter Hobart Handler 12010FtDrillBit.com
Reply:PM answeredGeezerPower Mig 255C185 TIGBlue 175 MIGRanger 8 Kohler 20HP1974 5K Lincoln/Wisconsin Powered (Cherry)Victor/Harris O/AK 487 Spool Gun
Reply:Every now and then my boss would make a wild-looking lambs tongue kind of like the image I included. But to be honest, it looked like something that would catch a jacket pocket or pocketbook strap, so I tended to avoid making them that pronounced. Just once he put a kink in the lamb's tongue it looked a little too lifelike and creepy to me. But definitely realistic. Sincerely, William McCormickIf I wasn't so.....crazy, I wouldn't try to act normal, and you would be afraid.
Reply:Awesome I learned a lot thanks Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk
Reply:I have ask about Fabrication Take a good drafting class. It show how too and the rule of thumb. It also helps in shop for layout the parts is can be lot of drafting on parts.Dave
Reply:Here is my latest handrails with lamb’s tongues I bent per Phil’s instructions. I got metal delivered last Friday and installed today (1 week later). My powder coater rushed them for me. I thought they turned out well and Customer was very happy. Burt _____________________Miller Syncrowave 250Millermatic 211Miller 375 Plasma Cutter Hobart Handler 12010FtDrillBit.com
Reply:Originally Posted by wb4rtHere is my latest handrails with lamb’s tongues I bent per Phil’s instructions. I got metal delivered last Friday and installed today (1 week later). My powder coater rushed them for me. I thought they turned out well and Customer was very happy.
Reply:Originally Posted by geezerWell Burt you are on a roll. I bet the customer liked the lambs tongue, makes a job look complete with nice lines. I assume you welded the landing cap to the stair cap?? Looks like a fer piece past 8ft.
Reply:I sent Phil a PM, but maybe someone else can advise me about using cast iron spears on a gate project. How do I weld them? Just regular MIG or is a special wire required or ? Any advise is appreciated. I will be using 1/2 square pickets. Also any design suggestions to match/coordinate with my rails in this other thread starting post #59 https://weldingweb.com/vbb/threads/7...-choices/page2Here is my initial design:(Sorry about the orientation)Last edited by wb4rt; 04-16-2021 at 06:19 PM.Burt _____________________Miller Syncrowave 250Millermatic 211Miller 375 Plasma Cutter Hobart Handler 12010FtDrillBit.com
Reply:Well, customer had another idea. Here is more of what he wants. (I can never get the pictures to post right, no matter how I orient the camera.)Burt _____________________Miller Syncrowave 250Millermatic 211Miller 375 Plasma Cutter Hobart Handler 12010FtDrillBit.com
Reply:Hey Burt, how did your gate project wind up? Kinda like this last design.GeezerPower Mig 255C185 TIGBlue 175 MIGRanger 8 Kohler 20HP1974 5K Lincoln/Wisconsin Powered (Cherry)Victor/Harris O/AK 487 Spool Gun
Reply:Originally Posted by geezerHey Burt, how did your gate project wind up? Kinda like this last design.
Reply:Now I have a question on a potential new project. Anybody done an inside rail like this? Any hints or tips on how to do it?The designer wants a steel cap instead of wood.Burt _____________________Miller Syncrowave 250Millermatic 211Miller 375 Plasma Cutter Hobart Handler 12010FtDrillBit.com
Reply:Originally Posted by wb4rtNow I have a question on a potential new project. Anybody done an inside rail like this? Any hints or tips on how to do it?The designer wants a steel cap instead of wood.
Reply:Hi Phil. There are two parts to be made. One is only 6 open steps and the other is a balcony rail. I think if I make a template of the steps I will be able to get the pitch and picket lengths. The flat run should be pretty straightforward. She wants round pickets and molded cap. My main questions before I take on this job is how to anchor the posts and the pickets in the wood tread? Do you oversized the holes for the pickets or tight fit? Do you use adhesive/epoxy for pickets? Do posts use mounting plates? What size post would be required (1 1/2 x 1 1/2)?Any help based on your experience is very much appreciated?Burt _____________________Miller Syncrowave 250Millermatic 211Miller 375 Plasma Cutter Hobart Handler 12010FtDrillBit.com
Reply:Originally Posted by wb4rtHi Phil. There are two parts to be made. One is only 6 open steps and the other is a balcony rail. I think if I make a template of the steps I will be able to get the pitch and picket lengths. The flat run should be pretty straightforward. She wants round pickets and molded cap. My main questions before I take on this job is how to anchor the posts and the pickets in the wood tread? Do you oversized the holes for the pickets or tight fit? Do you use adhesive/epoxy for pickets? Do posts use mounting plates? What size post would be required (1 1/2 x 1 1/2)?Any help based on your experience is very much appreciated? |
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发表于 2021-8-31 15:01:46