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I need to make these 6x6 tube frames, like a door frame going into the ground, 45° corners fairly straightforward. So I hired a guy, I wanted him to work on the frames while I did other work, I figured it'd save me time, but here's how his cuts were coming out. https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...71b762f586.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...9e6ef25655.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...ac87a47a6c.jpgI had to spend so much time fixing grinding and cutting to get the joints to fit up properly.... He said he had experience with plasma cutters, I don't think he did, he was long arcing it so much it kept tripping the breaker, then he used cutoff wheels to make the rest of the cuts... I don't think I'm being too demanding, a straight line is a straight line, and none of those cuts were straight, And then I set up a test joint for him to weld with the MIG, 16ga square tubing, simple 90 degree joint, and he failed,https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...49a51b234c.jpgMaybe next time I try to hire someone I should just have them set up the MIG and weld a couple joints without any input from me and see how they doLast edited by MetalMan23; 06-13-2018 at 10:32 AM.
http://www.philswelding.com
Reply:Perhaps he will get better. Be thankful for the help and gently show him how you want it. If that is all you need him for the cut long and have him grind back.
Reply:
Originally Posted by tapwelder
Perhaps he will get better. Be thankful for the help and gently show him how you want it. If that is all you need him for the cut long and have him grind back.
Reply:If you were closer I would work for you.....www.tjsperformance.comDynasty 300 DXHTP 240HTP Microcut 380Hyperthem 85JD2 Hyd Bender and HF Hyd Ring Roller all in one =(Frankenbender)Bpt. Mill/DRO4' x 8' CNC Plasma TableInstagram: tjsperformanceYT: TJS Welding and Fabrication
Reply:A 45 minute drive is nothing....... Although it's probably more than that if there's traffic
Originally Posted by TJS
If you were closer I would work for you.....
Reply:You didn't conduct In Service training, did you?Did you rely on his Certs?He did do a nice job of laying the pliers on the table. Maybe you should grade on a curve.
Reply:I hope he is trainable. At least now you know, he knows nothing. Show him the metalman way. I hope he's a positive contributed to your business for a long time.
Reply:
Originally Posted by MetalMan23
I need to make these 6x6 tube frames, like a door frame going into the ground, 45° corners fairly straightforward. So I hired a guy, I wanted him to work on the frames while I did other work, I figured it'd save me time, but here's how his cuts were coming out. https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...71b762f586.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...9e6ef25655.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...ac87a47a6c.jpgI had to spend so much time fixing grinding and cutting to get the joints to fit up properly.... He said he had experience with plasma cutters, I don't think he did, he was long arcing it so much it kept tripping the breaker, then he used cutoff wheels to make the rest of the cuts... I don't think I'm being too demanding, a straight line is a straight line, and none of those cuts were straight, And then I set up a test joint for him to weld with the MIG, 16ga square tubing, simple 90 degree joint, and he failed,https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...49a51b234c.jpgMaybe next time I try to hire someone I should just have them set up the MIG and weld a couple joints without any input from me and see how they do
Reply:PSIf train the first on second retraining was need tooDaveSent from my SAMSUNG-SM-J320A using TapatalkHF 170 welderHF 4x6 band sawSouth Bend 9NMillB&D mag drillVictor torch
Reply:
Originally Posted by tapwelder
I hope he is trainable. At least now you know, he knows nothing. Show him the metalman way. I hope he's a positive contributed to your business for a long time.
Reply:
Originally Posted by MetalMan23
I don't know if I want to try or not. I suppose I could give it a shot and see what happens I was hoping to avoid having to babysit someoneI know right? And that's after 10 minutes of grinding,
Reply:Hire an illegal. Get a Nicaraguan if possible. Coco can cut that with no mark, by eye.
Reply:This and a drag tip. Notice the lip is trimmed. That's to clear the plasma head.Why aren't you bandsawing anyway?
Attached Images
My name's not Jim....
Reply:So even using cutoff wheels he couldn't cut the line....maybe he needs glasses?EDIT: or was he already taking some sort of 'eye' medication...
Reply:Looks good!! Tack it!!Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Reply:
Originally Posted by Boostinjdm
This and a drag tip. Notice the lip is trimmed. That's to clear the plasma head.Why aren't you bandsawing anyway?
Reply:If you don't treat him right, and give him a raise by end of week, his mommie will be at the shop showing you what for. She don't take no s#!t when she's protecting her boy either.
Reply:
Originally Posted by Virgil5
If you don't treat him right, and give him a raise by end of week, his mommie will be at the shop showing you what for. She don't take no s#!t when she's protecting her boy either.
Reply:^^ That means his mom is only 65-70.... she could still put some hurt on ya'
Reply:
Originally Posted by ronsii
^^ That means his mom is only 65-70.... she could still put some hurt on ya'
Reply:How much are you paying this guy? I'll send my 16 year old son to work for you during the summer for minimum wage. He's got no practical skills, but he is a big strapping boy (6'1" ~200lbs), is highly intelligent and a quick study. Just a thought.Miller Multimatic 255
Reply:
Originally Posted by Louie1961
How much are you paying this guy? I'll send my 16 year old son to work for you during the summer for minimum wage. He's got no practical skills, but he is a big strapping boy (6'1" ~200lbs), is highly intelligent and a quick study. Just a thought.
Reply:Well I don't think my boy could do any worse of a job 😁
Reply:Oh no he’s not worthy of the pay from the three pics you posted. How do you get along with him, is he a know it all that claims to be better than he is or is he an easy going good listener that is capable of learning?Lincoln, ESAB, Thermal Dynamics, Victor, Miller, Dewalt, Makita, Kalamzoo. Hand tools, power tools, welding and cutting tools.
Reply:What is his title? Is it an skilled labor agency hire? What else has he done wrong? You are golden if that is the worst. I guarantee a capable 16 year old could do worst with a bandsaw, even. Not out of the realm of possibility that he sit on your band saw to make it decend faster(experience) They are ignorant and creatively destructive. And easily bored. And some extremely slow at tasks trying to do it right. That will coat you money.He's an easy going guy, easy to get along with.I put an ad on Craigslist, perhaps that was a mistake,I'm not trying to turn this thread into one that bashes him, it's more asking what you guys would do in my position, he seems like a guy who knows a lot of different things, but that's not what I'm looking for.When I was 16, I was making cabinets and furniture in my dad's wood shop/basementWhen I started welding, and before I even touched a welder I read every book my library had on the subject, it gave me a understanding in the theory side, you'd be surprised how many young guys wanted to work for me, I told them go get some books and read up first so I'm not wasting my time teaching you basic terminologies, but they don't want to do it.Last edited by MetalMan23; 06-14-2018 at 12:32 PM.
http://www.philswelding.com
Reply:There would have been a very short conversation when I saw the first "weld", either get it together or get gone. I might have grabbed a pair of gloves and a helmet to prove to myself there wasn't a problem with the machine first. I got over all the altruistic crap long ago, labor is only labor, not friends, not investments in the future, just extra hands producing profit.Kids including those up to age 60 today are just along for the ride, with no intention of improving themselves or their skills. Be it the result of TV or Public Education or whatever we have evolved into a society of useless creatures who will occasionally perform one or two basic labor functions. That may be workable in a large operation such as car building, but it won't keep the doors open in a small shop. You see what's available, and regardless of how much you hope and dream, the available labor situation ain't going to improve. Over ten years you'll make more money and keep more of what you make working alone and sticking with jobs you can do alone. You already knew that when you sent kids to the library and none came back. It's pathetic, but it's reality.
Reply:Late term abortion...REAL late. That's absurd, yet no surprise.My God man. I can show my house keeper gurl how to cut a damn tube, multiple ways, in 30 minutes. No problem.https://vimeo.com/214253581
Reply:if it were me, and you hired me to basically cut 45' cuts in 6x6, AND you gave me a plasma torch....I'd ask for a few pieces of scrap 1/8th bar metal and a few slips of 20GA. I'd then build a jig that gave me exactly 45 degree miters on all sides.20 ga is to give me some play as I built the jig. C clamp it in place top and bottom so it doesnt move.Probably take me 20-30 min to build the jig, but then each cut would be done in 5 minutes to perfection.BTW if you build a jig, you can easier train your "guy" so that he cuts straight.
Reply:
Originally Posted by madmax718
if it were me, and you hired me to basically cut 45' cuts in 6x6, AND you gave me a plasma torch....I'd ask for a few pieces of scrap 1/8th bar metal and a few slips of 20GA. I'd then build a jig that gave me exactly 45 degree miters on all sides.20 ga is to give me some play as I built the jig. C clamp it in place top and bottom so it doesnt move.Probably take me 20-30 min to build the jig, but then each cut would be done in 5 minutes to perfection.BTW if you build a jig, you can easier train your "guy" so that he cuts straight.
Reply:
Originally Posted by Bonzoo
Not Hired. I can show a 10 year old how to blast a chalk mark with a plasma cutter in 2 minutes. It's a hell of a lot more simple than cutting up a loaf of bread
Reply:I'm not trying to turn this thread into one that bashes him, it's more asking what you guys would do in my position, he seems like a guy who knows a lot of different things, but that's not what I'm looking for.When I was 16, I was making cabinets and furniture in my dad's wood shop/basement
Reply:A jig isn't a bad idea, but it really shouldn't be necessary imo
Originally Posted by madmax718
if it were me, and you hired me to basically cut 45' cuts in 6x6, AND you gave me a plasma torch....I'd ask for a few pieces of scrap 1/8th bar metal and a few slips of 20GA. I'd then build a jig that gave me exactly 45 degree miters on all sides.20 ga is to give me some play as I built the jig. C clamp it in place top and bottom so it doesnt move.Probably take me 20-30 min to build the jig, but then each cut would be done in 5 minutes to perfection.BTW if you build a jig, you can easier train your "guy" so that he cuts straight.
Reply:I cant buy 2'. 2 1/4 ...2 1/2...3 whatever.... like you guys. I buy sheets, make what I need to stock and shelve it.
Reply:Jig ?? Yeah. Cutting angles is a lil hard..
Reply:Your cutting in a single direction on flat stock. People cant even cut a baguette on a 45 degree bias consistantly through the whole loaf.This is why pre sliced bread is so damn popular. what he's asking for on a 6x6 requires he switches directions 4 times. Your basically doing the same thing, but you only accounted for one of the sides. Plus, he has a lot of cuts to make. You will have to make sure you reposition your guide 4 times, and at the proper angle each time.And for the chalk line, you still used a guide. Looks like the OP's 45 degree cut was marked with a thick sharpee.
Reply:Id say cutting miters that line up without adjustment is harder than freehand work. Though that work is quite beautiful.
Reply:I understand that using the plasma cutter on the two sides that are not angled will be difficult because the cut itself would have to be angled and that's difficult to do with a plasma cutter in that case I would cut it a little bigger and then grind the angle
http://www.philswelding.com
Reply:I would probably fire the guy that hired him.
Reply:
Originally Posted by madmax718
Id say cutting miters that line up without adjustment is harder than freehand work. Though that work is quite beautiful.
Reply:
Originally Posted by BD1
I would probably fire the guy that hired him.
Reply:
Originally Posted by metalman23
i'm not looking for perfection, but i am looking for something that's within an eighth of an inch all the way around, if both sides were out an eighth that leave you with a quarter gap which is impossible to fill
Reply:actually after much reconsideration, a gravity band saw would have saved you money and aggrevation. Set the cut, and walk away.414559, JET HVBS-712, 7" x 12" Horizontal / Vertical Bandsaw, 1400 bucks.If you hired this guy for 40 bucks an hr for 8 hrs, its already 320 bucks.
Reply:
Originally Posted by madmax718
actually after much reconsideration, a gravity band saw would have saved you money and aggrevation. Set the cut, and walk away.414559, JET HVBS-712, 7" x 12" Horizontal / Vertical Bandsaw, 1400 bucks.If you hired this guy for 40 bucks an hr for 8 hrs, its already 320 bucks.
Reply:
Originally Posted by Louie1961
Well you know my advice, replace him with someone younger and eager to learn
Reply:If you were hiring for a full time year round gig,Id apply myself. After TJ of course. LoL Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk ProMiller 211Hypertherm PM 451961 Lincoln Idealarc 250HTP 221 True Wisdom only comes from Pain.
Reply:
Originally Posted by tapwelder
I have a and had a few youngsters in my shop. You will spend time watching and training and then the they will leave. It is not about alturism. Why hit reset, if this guy can be brought up to speed.
Reply:A lot of small shops are having this sort of problem. Right now there is a serious shortage of skilled tradesman, so it's all but impossible to hire someone onto a shop like yours or mine. A guy like you or me can pay well, but anyone who's skilled enough to come TIG weld aluminum for me could go up the road to a big operation that makes SS boilers and whatnot, and can get roughly the same pay, plus 401k, plus health insurance, plus an air conditioned shop, etc. And those operations can't find enough people. The people that do show up looking for work with us, well, you see what you've got. Training is tough, too, because no one seems interested at starting at a training rate. Same song and dance at every single shop I deal with.Who is John Galt?
Reply:
Originally Posted by bassboy1
A lot of small shops are having this sort of problem. Right now there is a serious shortage of skilled tradesman, so it's all but impossible to hire someone onto a shop like yours or mine. A guy like you or me can pay well, but anyone who's skilled enough to come TIG weld aluminum for me could go up the road to a big operation that makes SS boilers and whatnot, and can get roughly the same pay, plus 401k, plus health insurance, plus an air conditioned shop, etc. And those operations can't find enough people. The people that do show up looking for work with us, well, you see what you've got. Training is tough, too, because no one seems interested at starting at a training rate. Same song and dance at every single shop I deal with.
Reply:In Florida, most guys who are looking for welding jobs are pretty useless for a job shop so we always tested them. I found that you could quickly tell if a guy knew what he was doing with a simple test where they had to do some layout, cutting and welding. One thing I did for millwrights was have them make a 6x8 offset transition out of 1/4 plate, and if it was for more structural type work I would have them cut a peice off the end of a scrap I beam and tack weld it back onto the flange of the beam, then stand it up to weld it so they had to do some welding in all positions. Simple stuff but so many guys would struggle trying to do these tests, some would give up and just walk out and some couldnt even figure out the simple instructions to even get started. Most of the time the guys that were good I could stop way before they even finished the test. You can make a test for pipe work or sheet metal, a machinist or whatever and just let them prove that they can do what they say they can.Last edited by CrookedRoads; 06-14-2018 at 08:07 PM.***********************CR |
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发表于 2021-9-1 23:14:34