Question for all you ironworkers/structural

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I am wanting to be an ironworker when I get out of school. Is structural mostly smaw??? Any info at all would be greatly appreciated. Thank youJesseAs said by CHENRY:you cant weld on a thingamajig like that. are you even certified to do thingamajig welding ? I once saw an improperly welded thingamajig fail and eleventy twelvoteen things got ballywhacked. I dont think i would risk it.
Reply:I don't do ironwork, but have heard some things about it. Out this way there is a lot of fluxcore wire welding. Code changes have dictated the use of wire they call NR 232 (for earthquake regions), I think it's a Lincoln number, it is more difficult than NR 211, they also use NR 305 for flat position. Stick welding is still a cornerstone, because you must certify with stick first. But the new wires take practice to master, as if anything else doesn't!?!City of L.A. Structural; Manual & Semi-Automatic;"Surely there is a mine for silver, and a place where gold is refined. Iron is taken from the earth, and copper is smelted from ore."Job 28:1,2Lincoln, Miller, Victor & ISV BibleDanny
Reply:It really depends on whether you are talking about shop fabrication or field installation.In the shop alot of what is done is done with mig. Some of the heavier stuff alot of times gets stick.In the field, it is usually stick(7018 and 7024 jetrod) or LN feeder with fluxcore(nr211mp .045) around here.
Reply:Originally Posted by tanglediverI don't do ironwork, but have heard some things about it. Out this way there is a lot of fluxcore wire welding. Code changes have dictated the use of wire they call NR 232 (for earthquake regions), I think it's a Lincoln number, it is more difficult than NR 211, they also use NR 305 for flat position. Stick welding is still a cornerstone, because you must certify with stick first. But the new wires take practice to master, as if anything else doesn't!?!
Reply:kinda dissapointed me because I would rather pick up a stinger than  a mig gun anyday. but oh well. thanks guysAs said by CHENRY:you cant weld on a thingamajig like that. are you even certified to do thingamajig welding ? I once saw an improperly welded thingamajig fail and eleventy twelvoteen things got ballywhacked. I dont think i would risk it.
Reply:Go get the stinger   the other stuff is easy once you've smoked that over.I'd rather be hunting........USE ENOUGH HEAT.......Drifting around Aussie welding more pipe up, for something different.....wanting to get home.
Reply:90% FCAW (232) all position10% SMAW (7018,6010-6011) all position
Reply:im not worried about it being hard I can always overcome that. Im sure ill eventually get into FCAW. Ive just always been told that mig sucks buy an old guy that teaches me alot of my stuff because of the lack of penetration and what not.As said by CHENRY:you cant weld on a thingamajig like that. are you even certified to do thingamajig welding ? I once saw an improperly welded thingamajig fail and eleventy twelvoteen things got ballywhacked. I dont think i would risk it.
Reply:He is talking about solid wire and shielding gas called MIG, or Gas Metal Arc Welding, AKA GMAW. You won't be using MIG outside the shop, and probably not on structural.Flux core, AKA self shielded, is different. FCAW Flux Core(d) Arc Welding penetrates DEEP!!!City of L.A. Structural; Manual & Semi-Automatic;"Surely there is a mine for silver, and a place where gold is refined. Iron is taken from the earth, and copper is smelted from ore."Job 28:1,2Lincoln, Miller, Victor & ISV BibleDanny
Reply:Originally Posted by pbfoureverim not worried about it being hard I can always overcome that. Im sure ill eventually get into FCAW. Ive just always been told that mig sucks buy an old guy that teaches me alot of my stuff because of the lack of penetration and what not.
Reply:qaqc, what is the difference that fcaw and gmaw other than fcaw is flux cored. Isnt there gas flux cored and gas less flux core. Theres WAY to much to learn in welding damn it.As said by CHENRY:you cant weld on a thingamajig like that. are you even certified to do thingamajig welding ? I once saw an improperly welded thingamajig fail and eleventy twelvoteen things got ballywhacked. I dont think i would risk it.
Reply:f= flux  (with or without gas doesnt make it MIG or GMAW because it still produces slag)g= gas=]i did all the shop stuff with dual shield because of less amount of smoke but all field installation was with 232 and smaw in the areas you cant get the gun.6G zirconium 702 GTAW 2" xxheavy6G P.E.D. carbon steel GTAW 2" xxheavy3G titanium Gr. 2 - Gr. 7 GTAW up to 3/4" 3G 316L stainless GTAW up to 1" 3G carbon steel GTAW up to 1" 3G Hastalloy GTAW up to 3/4"1G tantalum GTAW up to .060"
Reply:there are dualshield wires which are flux cored AND use shielding gas.  Then there are lincolns (most common for structural) innershield wires, which use no shielding gas.Solid wire or mig or GMAW runs completely different than FCAW or flux core.  Learn to run 232, that in my opinion is the hardest wire to run vertical.  In the flat, horizontal, and overhead its not so hard, going vertical up is definitely a challenge and requires alot of hood time to learn the quirks of the wire, and how to manipulate the puddle without trapping slag.  The thing about 232 is the slag will freeze before the metal does.  Because of that you CAN NOT run through or over your slag line, or it will trap it.  The slag WILL NOT boil or burn out like with stick welding.
Reply:Well, I'm not an iron worker, but Im a structural fitter in a fab shop in Ontario Canada.  The majority of our work is with hardwire MIG, not sure of the code, but every welder must pass CWB testing with said wire before he or she can weld on any structurals, the majority are also stick tested.  Some flux cored (dualshield) but not very often, as with stick, once in a blue moon. Our prints all specify 7018 for field welds, and any bridge work must be done with 8018.
Reply:there's alot more to being an Ironworker than just welding. To answer  your real question, It can't be answered. It depends on what is called for. Do you already have your certifications? I would suggest going to the union hall in orlando and talk to them. If you have papers already, you'll never be out of work.
Reply:i would say you dont really want to be an ironworker, its a tough way to make a living808-i wish have welding papers meant that id never be out of work haha
Reply:drivethruboy- you're absolutly right, but if it was easy, everybody would be doing it. I wish I had my papers, it takes me a couple of weeks to get called back out, guys with papers are working the next day.
Reply:i wish my local was that way (pile drivers) and it isnt any easier making a living this way
Reply:Originally Posted by pbfoureverqaqc, what is the difference that fcaw and gmaw other than fcaw is flux cored. Isnt there gas flux cored and gas less flux core. Theres WAY to much to learn in welding damn it.
Reply:It all depends on what type of work you are doing. I've worked with millwrights and ironworkers as a structural welder (I preferred the ironworkers as I just liked the work I did a lot more) and in the on site fab shops doing pipe and structural. The boiler houses were built with flux core, but everything else was smaw (structurally speaking as there was a lot of tig work in the pipe departments). Specifically 6010 and 7018. This is only my experience, was new power plant construction, and seismic activity wasn't the concern that it is in California. In the southern NM/west TX Permian Basin it was all smaw except for some shop work which was done with gmaw and  occasionally some really heavy stuff using dual shield. The use of FCAW is becoming more and more prevalent and will probably continue to increase due to lower costs and time used. I don't work construction anymore, but I use it for everything I can. It is faster (which my customers like) and cheaper on me (which I like). I use a lot of NR211-MP (it's what Lincoln recommends for my uses) and it serves me well. The codes determine the process, procedure and consumables to be used for any particular application. Learn sticks, mig (all three processes covered by the term), tig and STT (Surface Tension Transfer) as well as pipe and structural if at all possible. The more versatile you are the more employable you are. All I know about unions is what I have been told so that isn't a whole lot, but outside the unions many employers require you to be competent in at least two processes.Last edited by Jolly Roger; 05-14-2008 at 09:44 PM.Reason: don't want to ruffle any feathers/spellingThe difference between art and craft is the quality of the workmanship. I am an artist.