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Ok so I started school for welding and im less than impressed with it.  We had to do a math course (no biggie).   What I am dissapointed in is the fact that the damn instructor has us cutting 1/4 " x 4 inch flat stock with a hack saw.  Then when I had the piece cut to length he measured it and told me I was 1/8th inch too short.  Being a carpenter I know how to read a tape measure.  Out I whipped the fat max.  I showed him it was five inches on the nose like it should be.  And explained to him that different brands of tape measures have different tolerances some vary by up to 1/8 (he had an old cheapo tape).I told him I had the same problem in the field with carpentry and he went on to say that a carpenter doesnt use 1/8's or 1/16s they only use halfs and quarters.   I understand showing those of us that know nothing about hand tools how to use them,  but come on cutting 1/4" steel with a hack saw ??  I think we may have to cut up some 1/2" steel tomorrow for a project with a hack saw.I am thinking on quitting the course and going elsewhere or try and hook a job at a shop and them teach me.  Im not paying $14,000 Canadian to learn to use a hack saw.  They only have princess auto grinders in the shop (princess auto is basically a Canadian verson of Harbour Freight).I dunno my instructor keeps telling me it will get better.  I havent signed off on my student loan yet and am holding out for as long as I can.I am going to go ask the largest welding shop in the city what they think of the Schools Training.
Reply:What is the weld lab/shop like?  Can you get an idea of how professional the course may be from the other equipment in the shop (Princess Auto)?  Do they cover O/A, stick, MIG, TIG?  Have they got a plasma cutter?  Any shear, roller, or bender?  How many people in the class, and how many welding stations?  How long is the course for $14,000?Have a very frank talk with the instructor, ask him directly how the class will progress and what you will learn.  Any metallurgy or only hands on welding skill instruction?
Reply:i hear exactly what your saying, unfortunately in many schools they teach to the dumbest person in the class, which most of the time is the guy who doesn't know that a hacksaw only cuts in one direction.id have a talk with the instructor, and definitely find about the metallurgy part.  Most anybody can learn to lay a decent bead in time, metallurgy has to be taught.  Alot of welders dont understand metallurgy, they just know how to make things stick together.  Dont be one of those guys, learn whats going on with the microstructure and learn the continous cooling diagrams, they will take you alot further if you want to progress in this field.just my 2 cents, good luck
Reply:How long is this course? For 14 grand I will come up there and teach you how to weld myself. No hack saws included.SA200,Ranger8,Trailblazer251NT,MM250,Dayton225AC,T  D-XL75,SpoolMate3545SGA100C,HF-15-1  RFCS-14 When I stick it, it stays stuck!
Reply:for 14k, you can move in my spare room and i'll teach you to weld. meals and laundry not included, that you do yourself."Retreat hell, were just fighting in the other direction"Miller Trailblazer 302, Extreme 12 VS, Dimension 400, Spectrum 375, HF 251D-1, Milermatic 251 w/ spoolgun  Hypertherm 1000Lincoln sp 1702000 F-450 to haul it
Reply:Sounds like a machine class more than anything..When I have a class the material is all ready to weld..And if we need more I use a power hacksaw..Or noisey smelly chopsaw.....zap!I am not completely insane..Some parts are missing Professional Driver on a closed course....Do not attempt.Just because I'm a  dumbass don't mean that you can be too.So DON'T try any of this **** l do at home.
Reply:You're nicer than me zap. I make 'em cut their own and usually with a torch, heheh. The stuff I do if you can't handle a torch well you might as well forget it. I used to work with an ironworkers helper who had a 4 year machinists degree. He said their first 3 projects were done with a hacksaw and files. Said it was a real pain but by the time you were done you knew what 3 thousandths of an inch was.Newfie I would definitely be asking the instructor for a detailed explanation as to when and how the class would be getting better. Be diplomatic with him as it is in your best interest if you want to graduate. Could be the hacksaw is just a way of weeding those out who don't really want to work for it. I've had that happen too. Keep in mind most college classes especially at the starting out point are taught like nobody in the class knows anything at all about the subject. I know I toughed it through a lot of them. It won't hurt to ask around at some of the local shops as they will usually know if the course is worth taking. For many years the local community college had a 2 year program in welding technology. Graduation might get you hired on locally as a helper if you got lucky.The difference between art and craft is the quality of the workmanship. I am an artist.
Reply:Im am still in school as well and I can tell you that the first day I was in class I was sitting in a both running 6010 beads and now Im trying to get my cert (Qualification) for 6 inch smaw pipe. It def got better for me but welding isnt for everybody. As far as they whole hack saw deal I would of told him to kiss my ***. If your paying 14000 and you cant even use an o/a torch I would have a lonnnng discussion with the instructor. But then again im just a hard headed 18 year old.As said by CHENRY:you cant weld on a thingamajig like that. are you even certified to do thingamajig welding ? I once saw an improperly welded thingamajig fail and eleventy twelvoteen things got ballywhacked. I dont think i would risk it.
Reply:Hack saw, no. by the time you get done jacking your arms back and fourth  you would not be able to hold them steady to weld good. Here, hold your sore arms in this position for a while. Sheared plates or O/A cut.Thats like telling a person learning to cook beans to start out by digging them out of the ground with their fingernails.
Reply:I'll have to go along with jollyR on that. When I was in TIG school back in the day, we beveled our 6" 120sch cupons with a file. That was fun. They were at least pre cut thank goodness. Stainless don't cut easy with a hack saw or a torch. I think they thought we might hurt ourselves with a grinder. It did seperate the serious students from the loafers.SA200,Ranger8,Trailblazer251NT,MM250,Dayton225AC,T  D-XL75,SpoolMate3545SGA100C,HF-15-1  RFCS-14 When I stick it, it stays stuck!
Reply:Originally Posted by Mark...Hack saw, no. by the time you get done jacking your arms back and fourth  you would not be able to hold them steady to weld good. Here, hold your sore arms in this position for a while. Sheared plates or O/A cut.Thats like telling a person learning to cook beans to start out by digging them out of the ground with their fingernails.
Reply:As a carpenter that has done trim I measure in 64ths and less for stain trim. Show your instructor how to bury an inch so almost any tape is reasonably accurate.My welding instructor was very good at teaching hands on reality based welding. Do it this way and it works all the time. Now you can learn how to do it the other way and see what happens when you make a mistake.I brought my own toys to class.  Which of the 9 different cutting methods would you like me to use? Torch, plasma, portable band saw, 14" gas saw with abrasive blade, chop saw , cold saw, 4 1/2" grinder, sawzall, hacksaw. Add the shear, horizontal band saw and the iron worker at the school...See if you can talk to anyone who has completed the class before. Schools often have a list of previous students that will say how the program was for them.
Reply:If this is a privately run school I would be very cautious.  I am on the other end of the country however we have had several instances of people enrolling in a welding program that collapsed midstream leaving the students with nothing other than a student debt.   If they have princess auto grinders I would be running outa there.  If you are a carpenter or can get your Red Seal in carpentry leave the rock and find work in Alberta then return to retire.
Reply:Tough call, I gave a technical school a try way back when. While they did go in depth, I did not have the stamina too keep up 5 nights a week for 4 hours a night after a full time job, plus homework. It's all I can do now to pull off 2 nights a week at this school. At least with this community college, I don't have the debt load that I might have been saddled with previously. As it was, a few weeks of school was enough for me to be charged about $1,500.00 in mid-eighties dollars.City of L.A. Structural; Manual & Semi-Automatic;"Surely there is a mine for silver, and a place where gold is refined. Iron is taken from the earth, and copper is smelted from ore."Job 28:1,2Lincoln, Miller, Victor & ISV BibleDanny
Reply:For 14k, you could go to Hobart and all of your steel would be cut for you.  Except for your completed test coupons which you cut with an o/a torch.
Reply:They cover Oxy acetylene cutting, welding and brazing,  Miog and stick welding.  Carbon arc gouging plasma cutting.  It covers iron worker opreration,  we do a bending and rolling course.  Yes we also do Metalurgy.It is a privatly run school that has been around for quite a few years.  The explaination on the grinders is that they had makita grinders but they were all stolen ???  Who knows.  They do now have 1 Makita grinder left there.   They have tons of welding booths and machines !  Miller machines !I discussed it with him today and I can do my projects at home if I like (I can use whatever tools I want to do them then as well at home).I showed him today where his plans were wrong for the 1/4" plate we cut yesterday.  He wanted us to drill and tap holes certain sizes certain distances apart but 2 of the holes would have over lapped !  He cussed a bit and came up with a solution and modified the plans !
Reply:Consider an apprenticeship. Hack saw is for no one, not even to weed some people out. When you pay 14k there is no weeding out. Now if you were accepted into an apprenticeship and given a job and free education then weeding may be in order. But in this case, they seem to just want your money. Its cheaper to have you hacking away and not cutting and welding with real gear all the while they pocket your dough. Thats not a class, unless there is a shortage of Hacksaw-trained Professionals (HTP's) in Canada.Look elsewhere and dont be discouraged.Bill
Reply:Maybe a process to cut show you to use a hacksaw but why waste all that time hacking when you need to be welding. You can buy a hacksaw and use it at home one of the reasons school is so important is the time on machines. And by the way I started out in construction as a rough carpenter and yes we use 1/8's why would it be on the tape? And while tolerances might be slightly diff. in rough carpentry 1/16's and 1/64's might not be that important it is in finish carpentry. For 1 dollar for the instructer to say that ,no for any one in the trades to say that is ridiculous let alone pay 14,000 dollars to hear it. Check for reputable community college, google Welding schools. Good luck buddy and hang in there.
Reply:There will be be reason for the saw....who knows what I've done two courses and both where a waste APART from having materials and machines to hand, now i don't think there was 14g's worth for both combined, but I do have tickets, even though they wouldn't even give me a heat to start with........I'd rather be hunting........USE ENOUGH HEAT.......Drifting around Aussie welding more pipe up, for something different.....wanting to get home.
Reply:we start learning the torches  cutting welding and brazing June 10 from then on we will get into other forms of welding until February of next year. and somewhere inbetween learn metallurgy.
Reply:sounds like a bad schoolM Fed