How do i get my certification ?

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I have been welding Most my life and im well over 40 :} and i have never got a certification!   i have worked for this trailer company for 6 years now and i do all the custom Fab and welding for them and thought it would be nice to get that CertI use mostly a 250 miller .035 / 75-25 mix Mig and i can lay a nice weld But really dont want to have to go to school to get the cert is there a better way? Thanks for your help ahead of time.Charles
Reply:A welder is certified to a particular code or standard. If you are working for a shop that produces products to meet a given standard, then they generally do the tests and write the certification (exception: there are some jurisdictions that require a jurisdictional cert for certain jobs, such as NYDOT for bridge work, some Canadian provinces for pressure vessel work, etc.) In other words, you are generally certified BY THE SHOP, and these papers don't move with you. If you change employers, you retest.Unless you have a particular reason (such as a code you need to meet for a job,) it isn't worth the time and money and does you no good.Example:ASME code: The welder runs a test piece in a particular position, using  a particular procedure (specifying material,  process, heat range, consumable types, etc), und the supervision of the employer representativ (this is a requirement. It may be the boss in a small shop, welding foreman, welding engineer for the company, inspector for the company, QA manager, or whoever else is designated). This test piece is then examined to determine if the weld meets a particular standard. First is visual examination (is the weld the correct size? visible flaws such as excessive undercut? etc) Then come the tests of the weld material. This may be done with radiography (X-ray), cutting coupons out for mechanical tests (bends, tensiles, hardness, impact, whatever) depending on requirements set for the work. Most common is bend tests, since it can be done in house in a lot of shops, is fast, and is cheap is the test piece needs to be sent out. Radiograph is next most common-- cheap if you are already doiing radiography for another reason (a lot of guys get qualified on a production weld that needed to be shot anyway...  free but for a few minutes to do papers IF you are sure they guy will pass. Always a risk).  In the grand scheme for low carbon steel, I'd rather be xrayed than bent any day of the week. Mechanical tests are tougher to pass.AWS welder qualification is similar.For one shop I work with, the welders need to be certified by the oversight agency (ABS or Lloyds, usually). The process is about the same, but the price is high, as we pay a lot of money for the inspector to come in. The papers don't follow the employee when he leaves, since the procedure is REQUIRED to be qualified by the shop. If we could get away from this, we would, since it is a LOT of money. (fortunately, more jobs are coming along where ASME papers are suitable, the the Coast Guard regulations have gone through some revision, and an NBIC stamp holder can do a lot of pressure piping jobs that were formerly not permitted.)Last edited by enlpck; 01-18-2009 at 11:32 AM.
Reply:ASk your shop to pay for your tickets. If it's a certified welding shop they should be paying for your tickets. That's pretty much what they do up here in Canada... Assuming you're in the states.
Reply:Im out of Arizona and i thought the cert was for you not the shop i have all my other Certs like forklift operator and i just thought it would be nice to have one for my welding but if its only good for the place you are working for even though i know the shop would pay for it and all then maybe i wont worry about it. I was just thinking of making some things on the side that i came up with and designed and having something saying that im a Cert welder would make it look better Thanks for all Fast responses Charles
Reply:Find yourself an accreditted testing facility and call them and tell them what you are looking to do. Most schools out here in New England will let someone come in and take a test...it costs you money obviously but you don't have to go to school. They should have a CWI or SCWI that can administer the test to AWS standards. I never heard of a shop certifying you and the papers staying there. That sounds sketchy to me. I took the test I want to papers. I earned them they are mine. If you want I will pay for them if I choose to leave but what good do the papers do an employer who no longer employs the person who the papers belong to? Sounds like crap to me. I have worked for a few shops and the papers where yours period. OSHA 30...yours...OSHA 10, Subpart R, CPR, or whatever they were yours to keep. The companies obviously had COPIES but did not retain these things after you left.'Mike
Reply:Ironman: Welding certs are not the same as training. You go through training on OSHA1910, you presumably know what you were trained about OSHA1910. If you were trained by a recognized training program, you are good to go. On the other hand, just because you can weld to a particular procedure does not necessarily imply you can weld to another procedure elsewhere. ASME code, for example,  REQUIRES that a representative of the company witness the welder performance qual test. Many employers will give the employee a copy of the papers, but they are of little use. Another employer may look at them and hire you over someone that has nothing, but you will still have to retest. Many other codes have the same requirement, including some of the AWS codes.If you want something to carry with you, you can get an AWS card (http://files.aws.org/certification/CW/QC7-93.pdf), but that doesn't help at all with many employers (at least around here, a lot of the work is shop procedure and special procedure that the AWS card won't cover), and most will test you anyway even if they are using standard procedures covered by your card when the work needs to meet a code. It won't help at all if the shop isn't using the exact process and procedure you tested. Might get a foot in the door on a job change, but that is about all.
Reply:Heres what I did and I think this might be what your thinking of.Like mentioned above, go to a test facility and discuss a particular process you normaly do.  In my case GMAW structural.  We decided using a AWS D1.1 code prequalifying unlimited procedure that allows one to perform many types of welding joints and most gass mixtures for GMAW.This particular one is very tuff, but thats why its a "prequalifying cert".  They are not cheap and I think it only holds for 6 months, but its a great conerstone to easily take again and show perspective clients or employers.  For me anyway, it was worth every penny.But the point point here is to discuss what you want or need with an AWS test facility.  They have more than helped me out anyway.  And also, in my case, helped me understand more about the sometimes confusing world of code and certs.  Nothing better than getting the right info straight from the horses mouth so to speak.Good luck and find out what you need weld it like you own it
Reply:Originally Posted by charles@DVTIm out of Arizona and i thought the cert was for you not the shop i have all my other Certs like forklift operator and i just thought it would be nice to have one for my welding but if its only good for the place you are working for even though i know the shop would pay for it and all then maybe i wont worry about it. I was just thinking of making some things on the side that i came up with and designed and having something saying that im a Cert welder would make it look better Thanks for all Fast responses Charles
Reply:I totally agree with Ironman and Lewray. Find a testing facility and tell them what you want to be certified to do. They know all the test procedures and can tell you what test you need to pass, whether ASME, AWS, API, or whatever. Pay your money and take your test. If you pass the test belongs to you, not who you work for. That said, if you want to work some where else they may require you to pass their test, not the one you have already pased.  If I didn't just want to prove to myself I could pass the test and didn't need it where I work I would let it slide. If your employer requires it, they should pay for it.
Reply:Where in AZ?I am looking into the program at Central AZ Community College. They offer a ton of classes, mostly in the evening, and have a good success rate for jobs after cert if you are looking for a change. Bob Suor is the welding department guy and can get you evaluated to see if it works for you.Take a look at their website if you are out near Coolidge, or check with the other local schools.
Reply:Thanks for all the input not going to change jobs just thought it would be nice to have a cert im the Gm and Fabman for Deer valley trailers North PhxThanks again
Reply:Originally Posted by ironman715Find yourself an accreditted testing facility and call them and tell them what you are looking to do. Most schools out here in New England will let someone come in and take a test...it costs you money obviously but you don't have to go to school. They should have a CWI or SCWI that can administer the test to AWS standards. I never heard of a shop certifying you and the papers staying there. That sounds sketchy to me. I took the test I want to papers. I earned them they are mine. If you want I will pay for them if I choose to leave but what good do the papers do an employer who no longer employs the person who the papers belong to? Sounds like crap to me. I have worked for a few shops and the papers where yours period. OSHA 30...yours...OSHA 10, Subpart R, CPR, or whatever they were yours to keep. The companies obviously had COPIES but did not retain these things after you left.'Mike
Reply:Here is an interesting site that gives a view of certifications.http://www.weldingskills.com/certification.htmlGordie -- "I believe you understand what you think I said, but I'm not sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant."
Reply:Originally Posted by ironman715Find yourself an accreditted testing facility and call them and tell them what you are looking to do. Most schools out here in New England will let someone come in and take a test...it costs you money obviously but you don't have to go to school. They should have a CWI or SCWI that can administer the test to AWS standards. I never heard of a shop certifying you and the papers staying there. That sounds sketchy to me. I took the test I want to papers. I earned them they are mine. If you want I will pay for them if I choose to leave but what good do the papers do an employer who no longer employs the person who the papers belong to? Sounds like crap to me. I have worked for a few shops and the papers where yours period. OSHA 30...yours...OSHA 10, Subpart R, CPR, or whatever they were yours to keep. The companies obviously had COPIES but did not retain these things after you left.'Mike
Reply:Pretty much the same thing where i'm at,they bring out the WPS and give us the sample and we weld them up and they x-ray them and they keep the paperwork on file,when we leave the certs are no longer any good. We have to keep up to date by using the process at least once every 6 months no matter what material type. Also alot of them cross-qualify us for other WPS's somehow? Only a few that oddball jobs that we might have to take a new cert for depending on the customer.Syncrowave 250Millermatic251Trailblazer302Thermal Dynamics cutmaster52
Reply:Originally Posted by Shane G.Pretty much the same thing where i'm at,they bring out the WPS and give us the sample and we weld them up and they x-ray them and they keep the paperwork on file,when we leave the certs are no longer any good. We have to keep up to date by using the process at least once every 6 months no matter what material type. Also alot of them cross-qualify us for other WPS's somehow? Only a few that oddball jobs that we might have to take a new cert for depending on the customer.