Stainless spillway

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Here is a little job I have just done for a well known member of this forum.It is from 3mm stainless sheet simply cut and tig welded together, to form a spillway for a water feature.Simonhttp://members.optusnet.com.au/~abba/index.html Attached Images
Reply:good lookin welding on your spillway feature !What did you use to do the welding on stainless ?
Reply:Very nice...is if for a pool?  I am guessing the "well known member" is a fellow Aussie...does his name start with "S" and does he have a new kitchen???Crap...I just noticed that the images are labled "Scott's Spillway"...I guess I will never make it as a detective.Smithboy...if it ain't broke, you ain't tryin'.
Reply:Hey Rick, I Tig welded the stainless with an Essetti 140amp inverter and straight Argon gas, it was 304 grade stainless steel with a number 4 finish (polished with 240 grit). Than cleaned the welds up with chrome bright paste. I enjoy stainless work but don't get to do much anymore out here in the country, When I lived in Queensland on the coast almost everything was from stainless.You worked it out Smithboy I must have left too many clues. The spillway is for a water feature It will come out of a brick wall but I don't really know from there, I am sure Scott will post pic's as he builds it, At least I hope he will.Simonhttp://members.optusnet.com.au/~abba/index.html[/FONT]
Reply:Are you sure your nickname isn't Detective Smith, instead of Doctor Smith?As Simon said, it's a water feature spillway. It will be set into a brick wall about a metre above the water level of a small pond. Half - the half without the top - will protrude from the wall. The base has a 4 degree approx fall (or at least I hope it does). Behind the wall, I'll build a small reservoir. A pump submerged in the pond will fill the reservoir, and water will cascade gently over the spillway in a beautiful wide sheet. At least that's how I'm hoping it will work. Simon finished that much quicker than I thought he would - I only put the money into his bank account on Thursday. I'd better think about that reservoir soon.
Reply:Got my spillway in the mail today.This weekend I have to make a gate, so next weekend I'll work out how to fit the spillway and get it working.If the gate turns out okay, I'll photograph it and post it. If it's turns out badly, I won't (and I'll tell all my friends somebody else did it).
Reply:Can't wait to see the rest of it, Have you given any thought on the best way to get the water to run off in a sheet? I guess once you try it you will know what it needs, I was thinking of a tube on it's side across the backwith a series of holes across it to get the water to spread even. I have some stainless pipe so if it needs a bit made let me know.I am also interested to see your ideas you have for the gate.Simon http://members.optusnet.com.au/~abba/index.html
Reply:I think a reservoir behind with a wide lip that sits on the back of the spillway may be the way to go. A pipe could work, though - it would be easier. I might play with a few things this weekend.Re: the gate. I'm interested to see my idea, too. I suspect I'll be making much of it up as I go along.Scott
Reply:Behind the wall, I'll build a small reservoir. A pump submerged in the pond will fill the reservoir, and water will cascade gently over the spillway in a beautiful wide sheet. At least that's how I'm hoping it will work.
Reply:One of my buddies here is small partical physicist.  We have been looking for quarks in all the coffee shops and bars of Atlanta...we are trying to win the nobel prize...or maybe the ignobel prize.I'll ask his opinion...but, in the meantime, you might try a couple of little experiments.  1) can you slow or reduce the water flow.  You may be just putting too much water through the spillway too fast to allow it to spread and flow evenly.  Turbulance is a chaotic process and it's difficult to predict its effects beforehand.  Thus, it's best to eleminate it as much as you can.2) Hold a gate (a board or something) at the end of the spillway to constrict water flow.  Maybe a piece of angle iron layed wide side down is tall enough.  Square tubing might be even better.  You want the water to flow over the gate at the end of the spillway.  As long as the gate is pretty level, the water will spread out to go over.  Below is kinda what I am talking about._______^or _______[ ]Last edited by smithboy; 05-01-2006 at 10:13 AM.Smithboy...if it ain't broke, you ain't tryin'.
Reply:Should be a doddle for a 'small particle physicist'. Lots of small particles in this thing.Fiddling with the flow rate is easy - I've got the garden hose in the reservoir at the moment instead of the pump outlet so I have infinite control over flow volume. When the flow is really dialed up, the water shoots off the end of the spillway and saturates the deck. That's not going to work. When the flow is reduced so that the water falls down it forms this inverted triangle.I also cut a piece of perspex that fits in the spillway so I can vary the angle on the base to increase or decrease the flow speed without altering water volume. I suspect it's going to take lots of experimenting. I'm sure I've seen it work before somewhere. Maybe I've imagined it?
Reply:You have...some of those fancy faucets in bath tubs use a spillway just like it.  I saw one in a high-end home improvement magazine.  I bet you have a couple of those hanging around the house, don't you?Smithboy...if it ain't broke, you ain't tryin'.
Reply:Haven't renovated the bathroom yet. It's on my 'to do' list. Or at least the list my wife has for me.I don't want a 'projecting sheet' - the pond isn't wide enough. I need a sheet that falls straight down. They call them a 'sheer descent' - I've been on Google this morning. They are plenty of pictures, so I didn't imagine it. And there are units for sale. I just can't find anything on how the spillway edge works exactly. And why mine doesn't work.
Reply:My work buddy had the idea of using the surface adheasion properties of water.  You could lay a little angle of sheet 1"x1" at the edge and see if water spreads along the surface on the downward side.  He said that this is not generally in his field of expertise, but very little in the world we experience IS in the area of the expertise of a nuclear physicist.  If you can see it...it's too big.__________|Smithboy...if it ain't broke, you ain't tryin'.
Reply:So he's a nuclear physicist? I hope it doesn't blow up.Not entirely sure what he means. There is already a 30mm downturn at the edge of the spillway - see welderman's photo.The problem seems to be after it leaves this. That's when the water heads in from either side.
Reply:nice job on the spillway is it not nice that we can get together and do a project for one another?good work gents ...zap!I am not completely insane..Some parts are missing Professional Driver on a closed course....Do not attempt.Just because I'm a  dumbass don't mean that you can be too.So DON'T try any of this **** l do at home.
Reply:Yes, it is. Pity you guys live so far away - I'd drop round and have a beer with some of you and pick your brains. I also want to taste what comes out of those huge BBQs you guys have.The spillway looks perfect till I turn the water on. The error would be in the design, not the fabrication. It hasn't beaten me yet, though. When I've won, I'll post a photo.Last edited by scott brunsdon; 05-02-2006 at 09:55 PM.
Reply:Hmmm,I see what you mean.  I didn't show him the picture, I just described it to him and forgot didn't look myself before relaying his thoughts.Yep, he's nuclear...not nukular as GW says it.  It's nice having a physicist as a drinking buddy (mostly coffee).  Some days we debate the metaphysics of string theory, the peculiarities of both the weak and strong forces, and occasionally slip into cosmology all before lunch.  Of course, other days, we contemplate the weather, the high price of gas, and who might be in next year's Superbowl.  He is from India, but you will not find a bigger American football fan anywhere (a Buffalo Bills fan...tragically).Smithboy...if it ain't broke, you ain't tryin'.
Reply:I reckon you'd need to be drinking coffee to concentrate on a conversation like that. Beer wouldn't be at all conducive.Scott
Reply:Hey Scott, relatively new to the site here, and came upon this thread whilst digging through the old projects.  Wondering if the problem you are having might actually be a surface tension of the water thing, where the water sticks to itself as it descends, therefore pulling itself into a stream form instead of the flat sheet you are looking for.  Perhaps adding some kind of a water treatment (like a water wetter or something equivalent) that would reduce the surface tension would help.  Maybe a pool supply store would have something.  Just my .02, and curious how the project ended.Pyroberns