I give up on wire wheels!

admin

I know wire wheels/cups must have a good purpose or no one would still buy them, but I give up on them. I have tried a couple of different brands with the same results. They do a pretty good job cleaning mill scale for a few minutes, then they start slinging little stingers and wearing out way too soon. I think I will stick with flap discs from now on. They last just as long, do a good job, and cost less.What am I missing? What am I doing wrong?Burt _____________________Miller Syncrowave 250Millermatic 211Miller 375 Plasma Cutter Hobart Handler 12010FtDrillBit.com
Reply:Wire wheels shouldn't be for removing mill scale.  Paint and very light surface rust and surface contaminants, but that's about it.
Reply:The only time I have noticed the early breakdown is with the cheapos.  They all start flinging spears eventually but the cheaper ones start sooner.  Any more I only get them from the LWS. I don't necessarily trust the big box stores to buy for quality and HF never pops to mind for anything of that nature. The LWS has to deal with direct feedback from the folks they sell to. They sell some that disintegrate too soon and they'll hear about it right away. I'm guess there are online places to purchase decent ones.
Reply:ditto x3.A wire wheel is good to remove a bit of paint, or some -light- surface rust, or some light slag/crud after welding (GMAW or FCAW).To remove mill scale, you need a grinding wheel or a flap disc or something like that.Use the right tool for the job, and all that.     The best laid schemes ... Gang oft agley ...
Reply:I use the wire wheels and cups for the clean up of rust, paint, slag, bbs and such.  I usually don't bother with removing the mill scale as the processes I use don't even notice it.  I always use the good stuff on the wire wheels and cups.  I don't like the little flyers the cheap ones are know for.
Reply:Well removal of mill scale is a subjective term. So is paint and rust for that matter. I use a wire cup for all the loose and flakey mill scale. On mill scale a couple of quick passes with a wire cup and the flakes and dust go flying. Yeh there's still a lot left but anything that is still there is stuck good.  Hit the edge with a flap wheel or grinding disc if you need to see the meat.  Same for rust and paint. If I'm going to paint over I'm not going to hit every inch with a grinder or flap wheel but I dern sure do with a wire cup. I keep four grinders laying around the bench at all times. A bigger grinder and grinding disc, smaller grinder and grinding disc, a flap wheel and and a wire cup. At least three get used in a couple of minutes time frame. So no I don't use one for everything either, but a wire cup is an important part of the arsonal. I'm not ready to trade one for another. For folks that need baby butt smooth then other steps are required.Last edited by Sandy; 12-15-2009 at 03:14 PM.
Reply:I like the encapsulated brushes, but they are expensive.. Old timer show me that if i put enough pressure on a wire brush, whether a hand brush or a power rush, to bend the wires, I was just throwing money away. Let the tool do the work.
Reply:I run a small wire wheel on my dewalt drill and it wont remove scale but will remove rust and some slag.  Looking at how the wire is pinched in between the pancakes I've considered taking some solder and melting it into the wires at the compression point to add longevity to the wires.
Reply:I use a flap wheel or a grinding wheel for cleaning mill scale off for welds.  When I wanted to get rid of the mill scale on a 30"x60" piece of inch-thick steel, I bought a $10 bottle of this:It's very dangerous stuff, and you need to handle it correctly.  But it will eat through the scale.Jack OlsenMy garage website
Reply:Originally Posted by Big65moparI run a small wire wheel on my dewalt drill
Reply:I switched from Flap Discs to a Sanding Disc with Backing pad like this one:http://www.acetoolonline.com/Product...te=google_baseI bought the Backing Pad at Home Depot but I order the Discs by the Box from Enco.Enco's site seems to be down or I'd provide a Link.Ed Conleyhttp://www.screamingbroccoli.com/MM252MM211 (Sold)Passport Plus & Spool gunLincoln SP135 Plus- (Gone to a good home)Klutch 120v Plasma cutterSO 2020 benderBeer in the fridge
Reply:Eh figure that I'm only working on 2"x5" plates and I am on a budget when it comes to tools.
Reply:Soon as I wear through my current grind wheel I'll buy a flap disk for my bosch and give it a try and hope it lasts as long as my cheapo black and decker grind wheel has been so far.
Reply:Originally Posted by Big65moparEh figure that I'm only working on 2"x5" plates and I am on a budget when it comes to tools.
Reply:Dont use a flap disk for scale removal either, they tend to glaze over the scale and dont really remove it without excessive pressure and time.  Grinding wheel is your best tool.Have we all gone mad?
Reply:safety is no 1 in my book ive read horror stories about people using wrong  rated disks  in grinders with horrible results of them blowin apart and severing arteries and what not i tend to stay away from the cheaper stuff  makita makes a really aggresive down to a really fine sanding disk which does just fine in my grinders at about .99 a disk which fit in 4 1/2 in grinder does the trickmiller maxstar 150   hobart handler 210 w mig conversion hobart 250 arc force plasma cutter    boston ind cutting torch miller performance auto darkening helmet milwalkee 14in chop saw 10,000 watt generator huge drill press and industrial band saw
Reply:mopar,A flap disk doesn't last as long as a grinding wheel.  For me anyway.  But where as a grinding wheel is hard and inflexible, a flap disk can (and does) flap and bend and deform at least a bit.  This lets the flap wheel soften and blend things a bit better than a hard grinding wheel.Proper tool for the job and all that.  And I submit that a coarse flap disk with abrasive still on it will NOT 'glaze' over mill scale.  A flap disk with the abrasive worn or mostly worn off could, because then it is just some backing strips flapping against the metal workpiece.  ENCO web site  http://www.use-enco.com/24 grit flap disk for a 4-1/2 inch angle grinder at ENCO http://www.use-enco.com/CGI/INSRIT?P...PARTPG=INLMK32There is another type of flap wheel that is 'flappier'.  That type is not what I usually mean when I mention angle grinder and flap wheel.    The 'flappier' flap wheel http://www.use-enco.com/CGI/INSRIT?P...&PARTPG=INSRHIStandard depressed center 4-1/2 inch grinding wheel for an angle grinder http://www.use-enco.com/CGI/INSRIT?P...PARTPG=INLMK32And mn-welder, yes absolutely ALWAYS check and double check the RPM rating on the machine and the attachment and make SURE that the rpm rating on the attachment is equal to or greater than the rpm of the tool.  Putting a disk made and rated to go on a drill (maybe 2000 rpm or so) onto a 4-1/2 inch angle grinder spinning at 11,000 rpm can and will make the disk blow apart.  The 'disk' could be a grinding disk or a flap disk or a wire brush, always (ALWAYS!!) check the rpm rating to make sure the attachment is rated to go on the speed of the tool.  The best laid schemes ... Gang oft agley ...
Reply:CUP BRUSHES, FUNNY YOU SHOULD ASKFirst off...........Buy good quality American made wheels and brushes!!  Expect to pay at least 20 dollars for a good 4" cup brush.  AND NO, IT'S NOT EXPENSIVE.  It will easily last 10 times longer than a cheap import piece of crapSecond............Buy a twisted wire brush unless you like walking around looking like a porcupine with little pieces of wire stickin' out all over you Attached Images"Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/
Reply:Big65mopar, bad idea to try to fill in your wire brush center with solder for the same reason that soldered electrical connections are either discouraged or not allowed in aircraft wire harnesses (can't remember which 'cause my army helicopter repair days were 50 years ago).  Solder holds the wire rigidly up to the point where the solder stops resulting in a stress concentration at that point.  Better to allow whatever bending of the wire that is going to occur to happen over a longer length of wire.  Same reason that when you forgot your wire cutter and want to break a wire you grip it with pliers and flex it right at the plier rather than bending it with your fingers..awright
Reply:I see a few comments in here that indicate that you guys may not be using the right PPE for the job. A faceshield and long sleeves/gloves should be used at all times. Forgive my lecture but I drove a guy to the hospital after a nasty accident and it scared the sh## out of me. I'm happily paranoid now
Reply:I really hate using wire wheels because like several have said, especially farmer, "porcupine with little pieces of wire stickin' out all over you " > I wear all kinds of protection and still seem to get stuck with those flying wires(and yes I buy the good wheels). I personally like sand blasting as it doe not scar the metal like most wire brushes, but of course you have to deal with the blasting grit/media and the dust.Co-Own CNC shop:Miller :1251 plasma cutter, MaxStar 700 TIG/Stick, & XMT 456 Multiprocess Welder.&  2 Hypertherm HPR260's Plasma CutterSorry I had a bad stroke but now I am back.
Reply:Don't blame you.  When I can get it, I use a steel that is 'white glove clean' so it doesn't need any grinding at all.  Get info here:  http://www.scsprocess.com/steelproce...eet-plate.htmlIt welds up great too:  http://www.scsprocess.com/steelfabri...bricators.html
Reply:Green aggs and ... spam? A grinder is so aggressive, it's easy to dig way past the scale and into the steel. I use them very rarely on tough cases, though usually I stick to flat sanding discs as low as 30 grit. I bet the dog has seen the error of his ways, huh?  No more wire wheels! Attached ImagesCity of L.A. Structural; Manual & Semi-Automatic;"Surely there is a mine for silver, and a place where gold is refined. Iron is taken from the earth, and copper is smelted from ore."Job 28:1,2Lincoln, Miller, Victor & ISV BibleDanny
Reply:tanglediver I see your point.Is it your dog ? if so how long to pick them out. WOW OUCH
Reply:for mill scale I use a needle gun.Salas Repair General Welding & FabricationI've had success with varying grit sanding discs.CWI, CWE, CST for Miller, Lincoln, Thermadyne, Hypertherm & ESABMillermatic 350PLincoln Invertec 205 AC/DCVictor combo torchESAB PCM 1125
Reply:Originally Posted by bigducktanglediver I see your point.Is it your dog ? if so how long to pick them out. WOW OUCH
Reply:Thank's for the Reply.We have English Bull and I hope he never meet.s a porcupine
Reply:Hi all, I use 2 different wire cups, a Weiler 100mm and a Flexovit 125mm mounted on 9" angle grinders. Both of them aren't real brilliant at removing mill scale, they seem to polish it more rather than remove it, on paint and surface rust no problem, however on thick plate with heavy mill scale I use a grinding disk, flap disk or alternatively a grinder mounted rubber pad with a medium size grit on it. I don't use the really large grit sized disks as I found that they tend to loose chunks of grit and they don't contact flush on the steel or do as good a cleaning job as the medium grit sized ones..Of the two cups, the smaller one (Weiler) has a thicker strand wire which helps to remove the paint and rust quicker, they are both double row cups and both occasionally throw out a wire or so, however I always wear a leather welding jacket,  a leather apron and welding gloves, plus mask when using them.  Learnt after being skewered a couple of times. Nothing serious but hurt a bit. Just make sure the cup RPM speed is rated higher than the grinder RPM speed. The wire cups also clean metal up better the more they wear down. I find the double wire cups are better and they don't tend to grap the material (kick back) as much on edges, but being mounted on a 9" grinder, I make sure I have a really good grip on the handles. When I was young, (a very long time ago)  one of my friends working on a contruction site had a wire cup kick back straight into his leg, went through his jeans like they were butter and did some serious damage to his thigh muscle. Hence the reason for wearing the leather apron. Every bit of protection helps and leather is significantly better then denim jeans. Hope this helps. RegardsLast edited by Ed.; 03-31-2010 at 07:55 AM.Miller Auto Invision 456 + S-62 wire feederC6240B1 Gap bed lathe16 ft3 air compressor16 speed pedestal drillHafco BS-912 Bandsaw