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The final final final final stage of the restoration of the one way discSick of seeing it, sick of working on it, and ready to see it in the field. Might have a chance, rain forecast from tonite thru tomorrow niteThis is an adjustable tie rod made from 3/4 cold roll, and a Cat 0 toplink. The eyes of the toplink are cut off, and the tie rod is welded in place. Ends are heat bent.It's an interesting weld for me anyway. The toplink, where welded, is forged steel. I have no idea what kind of steel, or anything else about it.The thing was tacked, preheated, welded with mega peening between passes, and post heated repeatedly for almost an hour after the final weld pass. Then it was allowed to air cool. It's a poor mans equivalent of heat soaking to relieve stress. I hope it works. No cracks in the grind out, but it's gonna be interesting how it behaves under load.Humidity was in the 70% range all day, so the rods were kept in an oven. (Never thought I'd get weird about ovens).The toplink, and cold roll were beveled, and welded at a 90 degree angle to the shaft. No round welds. After the initial welds, the beads were run longways along the shaft and toplink to fill all low spots. No break was taken for any type of cool down. The heat was constant. Welds were run on opposite sides from beginning to end.The pics show what existed on the machine prior to making the steering mechanism.Steering arm was attached to the axle pivot, and anchor attached to the hitch.More funny round welds. If I live to be 100, I will never make a good round weld. Hats off to you guys that work with round tubing Y'all are either real good, or psychotic(sp?).It's a restoration of an AMERICAN engineered machine. A machine that's apparently stood the test of time. I'm looking forward to see it work again.If the rain comes, it goes in the field in the next couple of days.It's gonna be a hoot. I have never used one of these before, and from what I understand from the manuals that I do have, it's a booooooger to adjust for varying field conditions. The biggest problem, from what I can understand, is side draft (it wants to pull off to one side instead of going straight)I own all non-directional equipment. I can plow in either direction, and even my drill (old IHC 150 hoe drill) is non directional if you choose to plant in rows instead of dragging it in circles around the field.I normally plant in rows, same as row crops, because I can move at high speed down the field when moving hay. I don't have to cross rows, and beat myself to death. In addition, the ground here is hilly, and subject to serious erosion. Everything I do is across the down slope in order to create rows/furrows that resist washing.This is going to be really new to me. Near as I can figure, this thing is gonna be dragged in circles around the field from the perimeter working inwards to the center. I'm not particularly crazy about that. Oh Lord Attached Images"Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/
Reply:The final pics Attached Images"Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/
Reply:all looking good sam--- think of dirt track racing -turn left- turn leftturn left --beer and trophie girl at the end...[``]D i see the "boss" is out of the kitchen
Reply:Samm,Looks like all those welds are subject to pure tension loads. I didn't see any obvious way to apply a shear or torsional load(other than adjusting the tension in the link). Since that's the case, I expect you'll do alright. All the post heat to 'stress relieve' the weld joint may have cost you some of the strength gained from cold rolling the bar. But at 3/4" thick this is probably a non-issue.The only concern I see is if there should be a small, hidden defect inside the weld. All the shock loading on the bar could cause a fatigue failure, if there's a defect for the crack to start from. Since you welded the bar using a double V in the flat position, I doubt you have any internal flaws. I'd double check for any nicks on the surface where you did your grinding. If you have the time and patience, take some emery cloth and polish the shaft smoother where you did your grinding. This would make it tougher for a fatigue crack to start from a surface grinding mark. In the future you could do your grinding parallel to the shaft, to make the grinding marks run parallel to the shaft. This also helps reduce the chances of a small surface defect from growing into a fatigue failure.Last suggestion. Paint that thing! Rust will pit the surface and cause a failure faster than you might imagine; especially in hot, humid weather.Benson's Mobile Welding - Dayton, OH metro area - AWS Certified Welding Inspector
Reply:This should be interesting. I have had doubts about that tire set up being able to with stand the side draft. The original iron wheel with the blade down the center would be ideal if one could be found or made. Hope it works for you.
Reply:Quote: Humidity was in the 70% range all day, so the rods were kept in an oven. (Never thought I'd get weird about ovensGood for you Sam. Without the oven Low-Hy becomes High-Hy, and HAZ goes "Bink" (sound of delayed cold crack).
Reply:Originally Posted by lars66This should be interesting. I have had doubts about that tire set up being able to with stand the side draft. The original iron wheel with the blade down the center would be ideal if one could be found or made. Hope it works for you.
Reply:Originally Posted by pulserQuote: Humidity was in the 70% range all day, so the rods were kept in an oven. (Never thought I'd get weird about ovensGood for you Sam. Without the oven Low-Hy becomes High-Hy, and HAZ goes "Bink" (sound of delayed cold crack).
Reply:Originally Posted by farmersammI hope so tooBoth Krause, and Moline offered the rubber tires as an option apparently.I may need to go with a ribbed tire if it slips.Krause manual shows a ribbed tire on front furrow wheel, and plain tires on all other wheels. Moline shows plain tires on all 3 wheels.The old tires that came off the machine were pretty badly scuffed, so you could tell something was goin' onI'll bet the iron wheels sold at the same auction. The guy had removed them so he could travel on paved road. I got there late. Doggone things probably were bought by someone wanting something "rustic" by their front gateI can still remember that day. Loading it was a real joke. He broke his gin pole thing, then had to use his loader and a neighbors loader to lift it. Then they stayed still, and I backed under it. Draggin' your latest prize home is always the fun partNever looks THAT heavy sittin' there as you're bidding
Reply:Probably long gone. It's been maybe almost 7yrs since.It's been cloudy all morning. Maybe we'll get a little moisture, and I can put out some entertaining pics of this thing trying to walk around the left side of the tractor."Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/
Reply:Must be various ways to control the side draft. The wheat farm I worked at in northern Montana many years ago had 3 of them in a timber framed gang hitch. they were never used the season I was there and if they would have been so many years have went by since I wouldn't remember any thing about the details anyhow.
Reply:Time to correct the brain fart. the rod weeders were in a gang hitch not the one ways. Knew I was wrong as soon as I hit the button.
Reply:Nice Idea!And very good practical solution. By the way, I have seen some tie rods bended. This is caused by compression in a long rod whem you have a crash (accident ).One way to get better resistence in the compression is to assembre the toplink in the extreme of the tie rod. The main body of tie rod may be a pipe sch 40, 1-1/4 nominal without descontinuities. This can provide better strengt to the alm tie rod during compression forces. (flambage of a bar)
Reply:Lookin' good Sam.Say, about that rain stuff. Could you catch some in a can and send it down here to me? I would sure like to see some water from the sky. It's so dry here even the bugs have left.
Reply:Originally Posted by A_DAB_will_doSamm,Looks like all those welds are subject to pure tension loads. I didn't see any obvious way to apply a shear or torsional load(other than adjusting the tension in the link). Since that's the case, I expect you'll do alright. All the post heat to 'stress relieve' the weld joint may have cost you some of the strength gained from cold rolling the bar. But at 3/4" thick this is probably a non-issue.The only concern I see is if there should be a small, hidden defect inside the weld. All the shock loading on the bar could cause a fatigue failure, if there's a defect for the crack to start from. Since you welded the bar using a double V in the flat position, I doubt you have any internal flaws. I'd double check for any nicks on the surface where you did your grinding. If you have the time and patience, take some emery cloth and polish the shaft smoother where you did your grinding. This would make it tougher for a fatigue crack to start from a surface grinding mark. In the future you could do your grinding parallel to the shaft, to make the grinding marks run parallel to the shaft. This also helps reduce the chances of a small surface defect from growing into a fatigue failure.Last suggestion. Paint that thing! Rust will pit the surface and cause a failure faster than you might imagine; especially in hot, humid weather.
Reply:Originally Posted by farmersammThese heat issues give me headaches.I wonder if I changed the forged end of the toplink by applying excessive heat.
Reply:Originally Posted by gclampFarmersamm, The work you did will work out fine. Everything A Dab said is true, BUT as in any repair, or modification or custom fab job, one also has to look at the overall use and worst case scenario, IE fabing a hitch, will they ever try to pull out a tree stump? (always my assumption) Your application and usage should work real well. But, you do need to at leads prime it as soon as you get er done. Since this is a seasonal item, you might want to grease or never size the threads, and a jam nut might help it from vibrating loose during operation. only neede one on the right hand thread."The toplink, and cold roll were beveled, and welded at a 90 degree angle to the shaft. No round welds" Did you bevel and or grind to 100%. When welding round stock under a pull type load, this should be done. sorry to bring up a bummer question, but just wondering
Reply:If this isn't open for discussion, it ain't really a forum. Shouldn't be any egos here, and if it's wrong, somebody should step up and say so"Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/
Reply:Probably, but no moreso than welding on the cold rolled bar. Forging, rolling, both do similar things to the steel. Heat, will tend to undo the strengthening that comes from working steel.It's all a moot point since you had to weld them, and you don't really know what the toplink is made from. This makes it impossible to select filler metal and any post-weld heat treatment designed to undo the effect of welding.Don't take my comments too much to heart Samm. I didn't mean to imply that your welding was done incorrectly, under the circumstances.I will stand by my recommendation to smooth the shaft surface and paint it though. Unless you look forward to repairing that tie rod at some point in the future... Originally Posted by farmersammThese heat issues give me headaches.I wonder if I changed the forged end of the toplink by applying excessive heat.
Reply:Samm, I keep looking at the tie rod setup and I think you'd have better luck to rig so the tongue makes the tire turn left as shown in the mfg'rs pic. Otherwise you'll have tremendous side loading on the spindle & wheel as the tractor drags it sideways on the turns. I think that's why the original setup had the mech. lift so's you could lift the discs out of the ground for the turns. JMHO, MikeOl' Stonebreaker "Experience is the name everyone gives to their mistakes"Hobart G-213 portableMiller 175 migMiller thunderbolt ac/dc stick Victor O/A setupMakita chop saw
Reply:Originally Posted by mla2ofusSamm, I keep looking at the tie rod setup and I think you'd have better luck to rig so the tongue makes the tire turn left as shown in the mfg'rs pic. Otherwise you'll have tremendous side loading on the spindle & wheel as the tractor drags it sideways on the turns. I think that's why the original setup had the mech. lift so's you could lift the discs out of the ground for the turns. JMHO, Mike
Reply:What's on the machine doesn't have any provision for pivoting in a turn. Hell I dunno"Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/
Reply:ok sam maybe im missing somthing.but why didnt u just cut the top link in half.and weld some tube to it to make it longer.looks good anyways .
Reply:THIS IS GONNA BE BIG MESS!!!!!!!"Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/
Reply:Another thing I noticed when I was moving it into the "shop" was that the discs lost their bite when it was turned left. The things came up out of the ground and rode like a wheel.I'm absolutely positive I'll be coming back to the house with mangled metal, and a whole new plan of attack"Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/Originally Posted by farmersammSo the way it's set up, is that the two front wheels are locked, and the far rear wheel is a crazy wheel. I think the front wheels pivot around an axis like any other 2 wheeled axle, and the rear wheel follows because it's a crazy wheel in any other direction than straight ahead (weird, but from looking at it for weeks, I can sorta see how it works).
Reply:Originally Posted by 92f150300sixok sam maybe im missing somthing.but why didnt u just cut the top link in half.and weld some tube to it to make it longer.looks good anyways .
Reply:Craig................You Dog!!!!!!!!!!!"Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/
Reply:If youse need some backup, I'm only a daze away. Only need a place for my sleeping bag and regular meals. Since I have a cast iron stomach, I'm an easy feeder. Dinner for breakfast or supper for breakfast is OK by me. 9-11-2001......We Will Never ForgetRetired desk jockey. Hobby weldor with a little training. Craftsman O/A---Flat, Vert, Ovhd, Horz. Miller Syncrowave 250
Reply:See, I wasn't considering all the "angles". It's true the discs will ride on the top of the ground in a left turn, so that should relieve any of the stresses I had in mind. The articulated hitch for cats was probably made so the front furrow wheel could follow the cat hitch as, when turning, the the drawbar would move slightly right when the front of the cat is turned left unless the drawbar is allowed to swing free on the radius bar. MikeOl' Stonebreaker "Experience is the name everyone gives to their mistakes"Hobart G-213 portableMiller 175 migMiller thunderbolt ac/dc stick Victor O/A setupMakita chop saw
Reply:I vaguely remember when I was a kid, watching a neighbor run one of those disc plows.If I remember right, he would run the field in a left turn staggering pattern kind of like what I have drawn out in this pic!He would make a pass turn left skipping a row or two, make another pass then go up the row he skipped, make a pass and skip a row or two so forth and so on until he was at the other end of the field! Attached Images#1. If you don't like what I wrote, or if it offends you, then don't read it!#2. I am living life the way I see fit, if you don't like the way I'M living, tough sh**!
Reply:When i was a kid i ran one of these but dad had us plow the field in a square turning to the left all the time. We started on the outside and worked towards the inside of the field. After it was finished you had to plow the corners because it would miss a little on the turns.
Reply:Ok dudes, dudettes, and "makovers"No more time to fool with this thing. Pulled it out of the shop and parked it. Have other stuff that needs doing.It pulls nice above ground. It pulls like it isn't there in the ground WOW!!!!When I hooked it up to the tractor to move it, I immediately knew I'm lookin' at a major rework on the hitch. The thing is missing important stuff. MLA2OFUS was dead on!!!! I appreciate the advice, and didn't know it was good advice when I got it. This thing is like a detective novel. Thanks man!!!!!!!!!!!!!For S%G's I dropped it a few inches into the ground to see what it could do. AMAZING AMAZING AMAZING, AND ONE MORE AMAZING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!. This was hard compacted ground that a plow couldn't even hope to penetrate I've never seen anything like it.On the flip side, the side draft was fantastic, and pulled the plow WAY left. The rubber tires couldn't even hope to keep it straight. I wish I had the original iron wheels with the lip on them. I'm hoping that on softer ground, with the discs in deeper to make a real furrow, the sidewall of the furrow will hold the tire. Also the direction of the furrow wheels is gonna take some tweeking. They're both adjustable, so I think I'm ok.A slight bummer, and a good thing too. It looks like this dude will make a seedbed in one pass. It leaves a very fine finish. Not like plowing. The problem I'm concerned with is whether the land will be subject to wind and water erosion at a much greater rate.I run a hoe drill with iron packing wheels. It is feasable, looking at the way this thing leaves the ground, to drill seed immediately after one pass with this thing. The iron press wheels on the drill will compact the seed zone enough to eliminate air pockets. I may be able to skip springtoothing altogether. I've got some pics showing the thing with a seed box mounted on it, and a one pass job. I can't upload them because they're in an Adobe PDF, and I don't know how to copy the pics.I've read that this thing was phased out due to erosion factors, and compaction issues. But if I can get it running good, it looks like a really good "every other year" machine. I think subsoiling will be a MUST after using it.Anyhow, it's gonna sit till early August. Want to be able to use it in the Fall.TEDTWOFEATHERS, MLA2OFUS, LARS66, PROPDOCTOR, and others I can't remember right now......THANKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!The crazieness is gonna continue in about a monthIf the 74 Chevy C-30 pans out to be a hard resto, like this, I'm gonna have grey hairs by next yearPic One.........WRONG!!!!Pic Two........ In transport mode (notice the exceptional ground clearance)Pic Three....... WOW. Hard as concrete ground. This baby will DIG Attached Images"Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/
Reply:Glad we could all help, Samm. If those tires don't want to stay in the furrow, Some single ribs like for a tractor front axle will help. I think once you get it in the ground good you'll be OK. As a kid I saw one ways with tires you could almost see the air in and they stayed in the furrows. We'll be awaiting the results in Aug. MikeOl' Stonebreaker "Experience is the name everyone gives to their mistakes"Hobart G-213 portableMiller 175 migMiller thunderbolt ac/dc stick Victor O/A setupMakita chop saw |
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发表于 2021-9-1 00:09:07